How do we live together? (With Spiral Dynamics)

[Lorcan]

25 minutes ago, SFRL said:

All that you there I agree with.

But I think you are suffering from tunnel vision right now, sensory overload from all those new videos or something. 

Spriral Dynamics is GREAT.

Enlightment sounds GREAT. 

But there is a lot more that goes in the mix to make the world turn. 

 

What are the core things to study? I have been told and seen other told on this forum to meditate, self-inquire etc. But it seems that they give that advice in a way that they would hope  quit trying to attain power.

I was considering a good place to start was to buy books on leaders from past to present, Napoleon, Churchill etc. To study and examine how they went from birth to power.

I want to understand what goes in to the mix that makes the world turn.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Lorcan

[Faceless]

3 minutes ago, Lorcan said:

I was considering a good place to start was to buy books on leaders from past to present, Napoleon, Churchill etc. To study and examine how they went from birth to power.

It’s called fear, and in that fear seeking control, psychological security. 

[Lorcan]

1 minute ago, Faceless said:

It’s called fear, and in that fear seeking control, psychological security. 

Fear is a good place to start? Where should I study fear? I do not understand.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Lorcan

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, Lorcan said:

Fear is a good place to start? Where should I study fear? I do not understand.

In ourselves my friend. 

Understand fear in your daily life. See it arise, how it moves, how it tries to evade the fact of itself to the idea of what it should instead be. How it rationalizes it’s own movement. How it corrupts all action we take. How it destroys relationship with ourselves and others, and so on. I haven’t read much on fear, mostly observed it in myself. One thing to look into would be fragmentation of thought, and how the ego and thought relate to one anohter. After all all fear is a manifestation of thought-self. 

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by Faceless

[Lorcan]

10 minutes ago, Faceless said:

@Lorcan

.Keep order in your own house before trying to impose it elsewhere is what i am implying. 

What am I trying to get at is what to do after I have kept order in order in my own house and are then seeking to impose order to elsewhere.

What do I then? (Yes. I acknowledge I have a lot of inner work still to do, but I want to know the practicality of the actual process of getting shit done and getting the changes in place, mediation and self-inquiry wont do that)

[Faceless]

Also how we depend on an authority to bring about a sense of psychological security breeds fear, and at the same time destroys psychological and physical security in the world. All this breeds fear. 

[Faceless]

17 minutes ago, Lorcan said:

What am I trying to get at is what to do after I have kept order in order in my own house and are then seeking to impose order to elsewhere.

 

Are you free of fear now? 

17 minutes ago, Lorcan said:

What do I then? (Yes. I acknowledge I have a lot of inner work still to do, but I want to know the practicality of the actual process of getting shit done and getting the changes in place, mediation and self-inquiry wont do that)

Uh, well I don’t promote the common self inquiry method on this forum and i don’t promote meditation as in cultivated silence of the mind. I never personaly saw the significance in any of that. 

 

I don’t want to play guru or any thing, but I would start by understanding the human conciousness (thought-self) very well. After all youy consciousness-thought is not yours and mine, but is just conciousness-thought. One stream. Only we makes distinctions between yours and mine because of the nature of thought itself. 

You will grasp all this if you explore the nature of thought. 

So when you explore this, you are not investigating into your personal problems, but the problems of man. 

 

Again, I do not personally promote self-inquiry-meditation as recommended on this forum for my own reasons, but if you insist on going that route I would look into @Shanmugam. He and I do differ in some ways, but I have spoken with him via message , and I see that he has ended this fear, conflict, and no longer compelled to seek security in the illusory structure of psychological time. 

If you are not interested in that “a path” I would start by understanding thought, which is to understand yourself. 

Of course I take a great deal of interest in this and would love to talk about it as often as needed. I’m naturally interested in it all. 

Edited July 16, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

Sorry about some of the edits, I have one those cats who thinks it’s a parrot lol

Edited July 16, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

@Lorcan have you gone into the nature of thought or the  self before?

[Elisabeth]

3 minutes ago, Lorcan said:

What am I trying to get at is what to do after I have kept order in order in my own house and are then seeking to impose order to elsewhere.

What do I then? (Yes. I acknowledge I have a lot of inner work still to do, but I want to know the practicality of the actual process of getting shit done and getting the changes in place, mediation and self-inquiry wont do that)

The thing is ... a I believe @Nahm was saying ... as you grow you will both see the things that could bring change in a very different light, AND become more able to lead by example. 

It is great that you post these questions in your opening post. Most people have given up mostly, and/or are delusional about what's truly the best arrangement. Whatever answers you may have, keep questioning them, checking how realistic they are and improving them, and even as you do a lot of it, realize that you still can't have the whole perspective.

I started a similar topic a while ago. I also didn't get many answers, but I understood that there's better chances in being more specific about what I want to change. Leo's video on marketing also answered some of my questions. It talks about why winning people's attention is so difficult, it was rather eye-opening. 

16 hours ago, Lorcan said:

No. Everyone thinks I am weird.

Try to look around for people who are open-minded and also realize that their idea of "progress" or "self-actualization" could be very different (from yours and Leo's point of view) and get open-minded yourself. Are you in a big city? Go to different places, talk people and mention your ideas now and then to see if anyone resonates.

As an idea, try visiting a local sci-fi fanclub. The people there will be mostly orange and delusional, but every now and then a person that resonates with real big picture thinking is to be found, a writer or a community activist perhaps. Plus, we are all weird

[Lorcan]

5 hours ago, Elisabeth said:

 

Edited July 16, 2018 by Lorcan

[SFRL]

9 hours ago, Lorcan said:

 

What are the core things to study? I have been told and seen other told on this forum to meditate, self-inquire etc. But it seems that they give that advice in a way that they would hope  quit trying to attain power.

I was considering a good place to start was to buy books on leaders from past to present, Napoleon, Churchill etc. To study and examine how they went from birth to power.

I want to understand what goes in to the mix that makes the world turn.

Both. Meditate, self-inquire, contemplation all that is good so you stay centered in the right intentions. 

From a more pragmatic point you want to develop 'Orange' things like education and career. 

Trump did/does run a company worth billions of dollars. Obama is a Harvard graduate. 

It's nice to think that we could have a spiritual leader run the world. But can you imagine a US president just do the sit and do nothing technique? It just doesn't work that way. 

Ofcourse they may relax sometimes. But that's not what they are centered around. 

Edited July 16, 2018 by SFRL