The universe

[diamondpenguin]

So I was wondering. In Leo's videos he has stated that the universe is a dream and that it has infinite intelligence? That also it puts all the thoughts into our heads. It also has everything planned out moves ahead. So that mean that everything I do in my life has been already written out by the universe? And that everything that happens has been organized in way to keep reality working?

[Nahm]

 

1 hour ago, diamondpenguin said:

So that mean that everything I do

If there is a ‘you’, and a ‘movie / doing’, there is meaning (relativity / maya), but meaning is movie stuff, not screen stuff (consciousness).  Screen stuff is ineffably meaningless because it’s infinite, but not what the brain thinks meaningless means, because that is meaning (relativity). Your inquiry draws out the value of direct experience, but if you’re reading this and thinking about what I’m saying, that value is a thought and not what I’m wishing I could actually convey, if I were a who. ❤️

[Torkys]

All will is God's Will and it is the way you will get back to the Divine. 

[Sempiternity]

This may explain it all.

[metwinn]

23 hours ago, diamondpenguin said:

So I was wondering. In Leo's videos he has stated that the universe is a dream and that it has infinite intelligence? That also it puts all the thoughts into our heads. It also has everything planned out moves ahead. So that mean that everything I do in my life has been already written out by the universe? And that everything that happens has been organized in way to keep reality working?

Pretty much, to the ego this can sound very scary but I assure you its nothing but freedom when you get a good grasp on it. 

[Brent]

On 6/30/2018 at 4:42 PM, diamondpenguin said:

So that mean that everything I do in my life has been already written out by the universe? And that everything that happens has been organized in way to keep reality working?

I am not totally conversant with Leo's views, but I do know that very few people can even begin to understand the Infinite (not saying he doesn't)

Our consciousness exists only as we are localized within time and space, in the Infinite there is no "here or there or then", its oneness is all encompassing. It is space and time that allows for even the temporary existence of any consciousness other than God as He is the One consciousness of infinity. But within time there is a "now" and a "here" wherein the "I am" of the soul can manifest. And so we are conscious only as time and space allows for such a multiplicity of localities.

But from the Infinite's POV, as God creates, the beginning and the end are the same thing. His consciousness does not need time for His sense of self awareness. From His perspective everything He intends to happen will happen as it is fixed, creation being His dream as it were, His idea.

Evolution implies something can become something it is not already, Maturation is a better concept, from the seed to the flower so was the flower always within the seed. As our physical bodies grow and mature, from fetus to child to adulthood, our body follows those limitations inherent within the seed of the body, its DNA. Even psychologically as we mature it is a process more of discovering what we are rather than any ability to change what or who we are.

And so life is the mystical dance, everything is fixed, the creation is already whole and complete, but our consciousness is slowing moving through it, discovering what we are, discovering our path even as we walk it. Everything about you is not "working out" although in a time based system it seems that way, Everything in fact already IS.

 

[Nahm]

On 7/1/2018 at 1:32 PM, Torkys said:

All will is God's Will and it is the way you will get back to the Divine. 

Well yeah, I guess you could just say it all simple and clear like too. ?

[Torkys]

2 hours ago, Nahm said:

Well yeah, I guess you could just say it all simple and clear like too. ?

Simplicity is my number one value and the further I go, the more attractive it becomes

[WindInTheLeaf]

3 hours ago, Brent said:

I am not totally conversant with Leo's views, but I do know that very few people can even begin to understand the Infinite (not saying he doesn't)

Our consciousness exists only as we are localized within time and space, in the Infinite there is no "here or there or then", its oneness is all encompassing. It is space and time that allows for even the temporary existence of any consciousness other than God as He is the One consciousness of infinity. But within time there is a "now" and a "here" wherein the "I am" of the soul can manifest. And so we are conscious only as time and space allows for such a multiplicity of localities.

But from the Infinite's POV, as God creates, the beginning and the end are the same thing. His consciousness does not need time for His sense of self awareness. From His perspective everything He intends to happen will happen as it is fixed, creation being His dream as it were, His idea.

Evolution implies something can become something it is not already, Maturation is a better concept, from the seed to the flower so was the flower always within the seed. As our physical bodies grow and mature, from fetus to child to adulthood, our body follows those limitations inherent within the seed of the body, its DNA. Even psychologically as we mature it is a process more of discovering what we are rather than any ability to change what or who we are.

And so life is the mystical dance, everything is fixed, the creation is already whole and complete, but our consciousness is slowing moving through it, discovering what we are, discovering our path even as we walk it. Everything about you is not "working out" although in a time based system it seems that way, Everything in fact already IS.

 

Time exists for an observer that still believes he is a manifestation of reality and not reality in and of itself. That he is somehow something separate from what is, as experienced from his point of view, in the now that is timeless. Does an observer become God when he surrenders completely to the source, the flow, the now, that which is?

[WindInTheLeaf]

39 minutes ago, Torkys said:

Simplicity is my number one value and the further I go, the more attractive it becomes

Everyone who values should have simplicity as their number one value, but wouldn't it be simpler to have no values at all?

[Brent]

1 hour ago, WindInTheLeaf said:

Time exists for an observer that still believes he is a manifestation of reality and not reality in and of itself. That he is somehow something separate from what is, as experienced from his point of view, in the now that is timeless. Does an observer become God when he surrenders completely to the source, the flow, the now, that which is?

Is this a true question???? Without time, we would not exist, the "I am" of the soul could manifest no consciousness. So would you merge with God, no. The Infinite transcends Creation, it is ONE and it belongs to the consciousness of God as the Creator. To surrender our "I am" is to return to the nothingness from which we were created. It is, as it were, infinite, but infinitely nothing, not infinitely something. 

The only way to transcend the finite is if God Himself, His own Being, first enters into you. 

Christianity teaches a substitutional theology where the created soul is assumed to be eternal, and the death of Christ was payment to stay God's hand from punishing us. This is easily contradicted as God alone possess infinite and eternal Being. This theology is due to the influence of the flesh that divides life between pain and pleasure, hence paradise or torment.

What Christianity all too often has not understood is the true mission of Christ. God creates the Creation as a womb, within that womb are created beings who can exists as long as they are protected from the all consuming Being of the Father (Creator), then into the Creation God sends a SEED of His own Infinite nature, in the heavenly realm that seed is YHWH, then YHWH incarnates into the flesh as Jesus, by His death, so was this seed, this divine nature, able to be incorporated into the create souls, now these created souls share in the Life Being of the Father (Born of the Spirit) and are made one in Christ as Christ has become there very source of Being. 

When the Creation collapses, ends, so that seed which came from the creator will return, and with it those souls, having their identity stabilized in Christ, can merge with the Infinite. God maintains the Infinite as ONE and one Being, and yet He brings children into the fold. So it is that Infinite is ever expanding. That the simplest version I think I can do here. 

[WindInTheLeaf]

5 minutes ago, Brent said:

Is this a true question???? Without time, we would not exist, the "I am" of the soul could manifest no consciousness. So would you merge with God, no. The Infinite transcends Creation, it is ONE and it belongs to the consciousness of God as the Creator. To surrender our "I am" is to return to the nothingness from which we were created. It is, as it were, infinite, but infinitely nothing, not infinitely something. 

The only way to transcend the finite is if God Himself, His own Being, first enters into you. 

Christianity teaches a substitutional theology where the created soul is assumed to be eternal, and the death of Christ was payment to stay God's hand from punishing us. This is easily contradicted as God alone possess infinite and eternal Being. This theology is due to the influence of the flesh that divides life between pain and pleasure, hence paradise or torment.

What Christianity all too often has not understood is the true mission of Christ. God creates the Creation as a womb, within that womb are created beings who can exists as long as they are protected from the all consuming Being of the Father (Creator), then into the Creation God sends a SEED of His own Infinite nature, in the heavenly realm that seed is YHWH, then YHWH incarnates into the flesh as Jesus, by His death, so was this seed, this divine nature, able to be incorporated into the create souls, now these created souls share in the Life Being of the Father (Born of the Spirit) and are made one in Christ as Christ has become there very source of Being. 

When the Creation collapses, ends, so that seed which came from the creator will return, and with it those souls, having their identity stabilized in Christ, can merge with the Infinite. God maintains the Infinite as ONE and one Being, and yet He brings children into the fold. So it is that Infinite is ever expanding. That the simplest version I think I can do here. 

I am a bit confused, looking for clarification. God is something separate from creation? And he has infinite consciousness through which he creates his creation? Is creator, spirit of creation and creation separate things?

[metwinn]

43 minutes ago, WindInTheLeaf said:

I am a bit confused, looking for clarification. God is something separate from creation? And he has infinite consciousness through which he creates his creation? Is creator, spirit of creation and creation separate things?

God is creation. God is consciousness. This should clear it up.

[cirkussmile]

The Universe is so perfect that it works best when we surrender to it instead of trying to understand it  

[metwinn]

2 minutes ago, cirkussmile said:

The Universe is so perfect that it works best when we surrender to it instead of trying to understand it  

Problem is you have to understand it to surrender to it

[WindInTheLeaf]

17 minutes ago, metwinn said:

God is creation. God is consciousness. This should clear it up.

So if God is both creation and creator existing as act/play/spirit/dance(whatever we may call it) of creation, how is anyone not who or where they should be? How is anything or anyone not perfect as they are, as an expression of God, as God?

[metwinn]

2 minutes ago, WindInTheLeaf said:

So if God is both creation and creator existing as act/play/spirit/dance(whatever we may call it) of creation, how is anyone not who or where they should be? How is anything or anyone not perfect as they are, as an expression of God, as God?

It is only the the ego that see's things as not perfect. But objectively, everything is perfect.

[WindInTheLeaf]

7 minutes ago, metwinn said:

It is only the the ego that see's things as not perfect. But objectively, everything is perfect.

Then what is the problem? If everything is perfect then even the ego is perfect, but so is everything else, and when everything is perfect there is no reason to do anything, yet every reason to enjoy the doing. 

[metwinn]

1 minute ago, WindInTheLeaf said:

Then what is the problem? If everything is perfect then even the ego is perfect, but so is everything else, and when everything is perfect there is no reason to do anything, yet every reason to enjoy the doing. 

You said it yourself!

[Brent]

3 hours ago, WindInTheLeaf said:

I am a bit confused, looking for clarification. God is something separate from creation? And he has infinite consciousness through which he creates his creation? Is creator, spirit of creation and creation separate things?

 "Windintheleaf" Using the symbolism of the bible, God HOVERS above the waters (formless void), then He speaks. "Speaking" engages three principles, The Father Creator as He "wills", His Breath (Holy Spirit) as His Breath acts upon the void, and that same Breath forms a Seed within the Creation is known as His Word (breath given form). Now God did not create in the past, that is our perspective, His voice continues to stimulate the void causing it to wave as such, so as long as Creation last, so is His voice continue to intone (sing). 

Since God Himself, as the Infinite something is undivided, He does not parcel Himself into the Creation, rather He looks upon the infinite nothingness and His Spirit, like breath upon a bowl of water, generates the compression that cause the nothingness to vibrate, produces patterns which appear to us as the universal constants and wave interference becomes matter as we know it. In quantum physics waves are particles and particles are waves depending upon how you seek to measure them but all matter is merely vibration, in this case everything in creation is created from nothing.

OK, that's the big picture, now lets consider it from our perspective within the Creation. Within the Creation everything is finite, its vastness might give us the appearance of it being infinite but it is all truly finite, and within the Creation there exists no actual infinite. Potential Infinites yes, as there is "potentially" and infinite number of even numbers, but the true infinity of that can never be reached, as soon as you start counting you would always be counting and never reaching. Creation has a beginning, time and space a womb whereby we might exist for a while, and then a collapse, an ending, and these attributes of finitude are universal. (I should also add that Creation involves two distinct dimensions, namely the Heavenly and the Earth (matter), the Heavenly is superior, but even as it manifest a multitude of forms, so does it reveal its own finitude).

The Infinite of God as in the Creator, exists apart (Holy) and unto itself and does not intersect the Creation except as His Breath is the mediator. From God's POV, He is the true reality as we are the potential, existing as if we are a dream. For example, take a car, now add a million years before and after and look all at once at that 2 million years, how real is the car, its identity is as if it were a passing face in a cloud. Things seem real to us only as we are observing such a narrow band of time and space, but from the infinite's perspective we are still nothing, waves created on the surface of the waters that will disappear as soon as God withdraws His Breath. 

People will ask me if I think God exists, my response if that I am sure God exists, I am just not so sure about us. Without the Infinite's reality, even this finite reality (so called) could not exist, so of the two He is always the reality. Yet as His Breath continues to direct this Creation, so then is His Spirit available, but His Home, the direct presence of the Father is beyond all of Creation even as His very Being is different from ours, as Infinity exists forever beyond our grasp, finitude never able to attain to it, God is not so much in the Creation as the Creation is in God, being merely a drop in the Ocean of His Being, as it were. 

Edited July 3, 2018 by Brent