Letting Go Of A Particular Attachment To Progress Further Toward Enlightenment

[Emerald]

15 minutes ago, DJ said:

@Emerald Wilkins

As far as losing attachment to the ego about how you look, I think thats a personal decision. I mean, how far does one want to detach? Stop showering, stop brushing your hair, wearing deodorant and not caring what you wear? There has to be a happy medium in my opinion.  If putting on makeup and wearing a pretty dress makes you feel good, I would say don't fight it and do it. 

I know its easier said than done, but dont worry about the future...

There are plenty of attractive older women. They embrace their femininity and share it with the world and that, my friend, is a beautiful thing! Its their gift to the world. It doesn't matter if a rose bush was just planted or is 100's of years old. As long as its producing roses, it will always be beautiful!

I'm going to continue to keep myself up as long as it feels genuine. Dressing up and wearing make-up has always felt good and natural to me. Even as a child I always enjoyed things relating to beauty. So, that's not really what I mean by detachment. I think one of the issues is that I have a deeply ingrained resistance to the feminine principle in general, so I have a lot of resistance to that which is naturally feminine in me. When I had my experiences that I referred to, I felt a major up-surge of what I recognized as feminine energy. It felt very natural and powerful in a subtle way. Sensuality/sexuality was part of it, but there was so much more to it than that.

What I mean by detachment is to understand that I am not the self-concept that my ego spins. All fear, including fear of death, come from the illusion of ego.  So, I have this insecurity, but there is no "I" to actually have it. I suspect this insecurity exists as a mechanism to keep the ego hidden from being exposed. It's one of the ego stories that keeps it sustained. I would imagine that transcending the ego (permanently) is the only really effective way to get over all of these resistances to what is natural.

[Steven]

16 hours ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

It also makes me feel bitter and jealous that men don't have to experience this same sort of "identity death" until much later in life.

I can see where you are comming from, and I'm pretty sure, pretty, pretty sure, that many of humans deal with the same set of 'fears', male or female. 

 

[Emerald]

5 minutes ago, kalter000 said:

@Emerald Wilkins  I can relate. Although it's not about me getting older, but not having sexual life I want. As a 22 years old male, It's hard to play high-consciousness being, when in my mind vaginas are popping out all the time. 

Do you have this feeling, that you are missing out  something? I think you are suppressing your femininity and now you fear, when time will pass , that you will lose certain opportunities.

What if you are fighting with wrong enemy? Maybe instead of denying need of being attractive and sexual you should embrace it?

We can say, that you are associating your appearance with your self-worth too much or you put a lot of emphasis on being certain way- but would the same thoughts occur, if now you could express yourself with full power? It's the same as dying man feels sorry for wasted opportunities.

Maybe ,as Ayla recommended, you should accept your drives and tendencies? Think about why your mind is holding you.

P.S. sorry, if I misunderstood your problem.

I should have specified what I mean by attachment. I think it would be most natural for me to embrace my femininity because I believe that I'm a mostly feminine person. What I mean by detachment is to detach from identities, thoughts, and feelings that are holding me back from being genuine and accepting what is: masculine, feminine, or otherwise.

I've always been a naturally sexual person, so I can relate to the sexual obsession thing that you mention. It can be a major distraction. But there is a huge fear of missing out. It's like I have these barriers to my femininity/sexuality, so I can't fully enjoy them. Then I have this ticking clock echoed by social patterns, telling me that my sexuality is depreciating in value. Because my feelings about my own womanhood relate so much to sexuality, it feels strangely like I'll never really be the person that I want to be and even if I do get there it will only be for a very short time. It feels like my womanhood is going to be ripped away from me before I really get to enjoy it.

So, I'm sort of fighting with two enemies, and they're both me. It's very frustrating.

This is why I want detachment, because I can get more clarity about what is truly genuine for me. It will leave behind the false beliefs and assumptions to leave what it, which is always in a state of flux. I want to be able to accept that state of flux and to be able to accept reality without all the resistance.

[Steven]

3 minutes ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

it feels like my womanhood is going to be ripped away from me before I really get to enjoy it.

This is false even to rational mind... many women in their 40s and 50s 'discover' their sexuality.

This is our monkey mind speaking to us.

Can't you tell the typical ego demands?

Ego always tends to put us out comfort zone.

[kalter000]

@Emerald Wilkins Your second paragraph perfectly describes  my condition and my own blind spots. Looks like we are dealing with same neurosis, but in different clothes.

I have this fear of not reaching "ultimate self-expression" (c), I had these brief moments, where I could be able to see my full potential and how powerfull I can be, but then my identity overlaps "me", making me fearful and neurotic. And this phase of stagnation pisses me off, making me want to commit sorta "spiritual suicide", let go of myself. Last time when it was powerful enough, I had a breakthrough and since then I started learning about spirituality. But still my barriers are strong and resistance draws out all the joy from my life.

Hopefully we will sort something out =)

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, Steven said:

I can see where you are comming from, and I'm pretty sure, pretty, pretty sure, that many of humans deal with the same set of 'fears', male or female. 

 

Certainly. I know that I'm not alone in this. It's a very human struggle.

 

1 hour ago, Steven said:

This is false even to rational mind... many women in their 40s and 50s 'discover' their sexuality.

This is our monkey mind speaking to us.

Can't you tell the typical ego demands?

Ego always tends to put us out comfort zone.

I know this to be rationally true. It's just a very uncomfortable attachment that my ego seems to be using like a shield.

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, kalter000 said:

@Emerald Wilkins Your second paragraph perfectly describes  my condition and my own blind spots. Looks like we are dealing with same neurosis, but in different clothes.

I have this fear of not reaching "ultimate self-expression" (c), I had these brief moments, where I could be able to see my full potential and how powerfull I can be, but then my identity overlaps "me", making me fearful and neurotic. And this phase of stagnation pisses me off, making me want to commit sorta "spiritual suicide", let go of myself. Last time when it was powerful enough, I had a breakthrough and since then I started learning about spirituality. But still my barriers are strong and resistance draws out all the joy from my life.

Hopefully we will sort something out =)

Hopefully so. It's very frustrating.  

[Steven]

6 minutes ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

I know this to be rationally true. It's just a very uncomfortable attachment that my ego seems to be using like a shield.

So recognise it and accept it and don't feed it more energy. Or as you mentioned that you are perusing enlightening work. 

Then find out who is struggling? Who suffers? 

 

[Emerald]

Just now, Steven said:

So recognise it and accept it and don't feed it more energy. Or as you mentioned that you are perusing enlightening work. 

Then find out who is struggling? Who suffers? 

 

Definitely. I think my problem has been that I'm treating these thoughts like they are somehow different from other thoughts. Thank you.

[Galyna]

@Emerald Wilkins

Dear Emerald,

I really like to read you, because you sound as a very educated young woman, so let me stop by and add to this topic.

Preamble: I am 29, also married and have similar fear to yours. 

What helps me is to think this way: first of all, we worry about something that refers to the future. You are going to change, you are not a constant entity. What worries you right now might not be even actual in 5-10 years. There is no future, and that is why you can not be afraid of what will happen to Emerald when she is 50-60 y.o, because that Emerald will never feel/think the same as one that you know right now. You are not going to be the same person because there is no real centered being to make it happen. Can you grantee even that you will be alive in one year? No. Also, stay present and define the directions of your thoughts. They are just thoughts, thoughts about future that will never happen. Do not trust them and do not let them scary you.

Hope it will help you.

You are very interesting person, so I am sure by getting older you will be blooming even better  

Galyna. 

[Galyna]

@Emerald Wilkins

If I do not sound reasonable about my statements, tell your Ego about Christie Brinkley, she is a good example to follow.

[Steven]

Thoughts are not as powerful as we actually give them credit....

 

 Even in science and technology, a lot of things have NOT been discovered or invented by thinking it through. In fact many original and important things have been discovered through serendipity or by accident. 

Edited March 16, 2016 by Steven

[Emerald]

2 hours ago, Galyna said:

@Emerald Wilkins

Dear Emerald,

I really like to read you, because you sound as a very educated young woman, so let me stop by and add to this topic.

Preamble: I am 29, also married and have similar fear to yours. 

What helps me is to think this way: first of all, we worry about something that refers to the future. You are going to change, you are not a constant entity. What worries you right now might not be even actual in 5-10 years. There is no future, and that is why you can not be afraid of what will happen to Emerald when she is 50-60 y.o, because that Emerald will never feel/think the same as one that you know right now. You are not going to be the same person because there is no real centered being to make it happen. Can you grantee even that you will be alive in one year? No. Also, stay present and define the directions of your thoughts. They are just thoughts, thoughts about future that will never happen. Do not trust them and do not let them scary you.

Hope it will help you.

You are very interesting person, so I am sure by getting older you will be blooming even better  

Galyna. 

Thank you. Since being on the forum, I have come to similar conclusions about the present moment being the only thing that I can "know" for sure. Somehow, this has helped me in relation to straightening out things that are more on the metaphysical side of the coin, but not the mundane way... if that makes sense. It might be that I avoid taking apart the more mundane barriers because I'm not as interested in them, and they cause me more insecurity. But I will try to focus more directly on this idea in relation to my insecurities. Maybe bringing myself through the process of thinking about it and deconstructing it will be of help. 

[Ayla]

Trying to suppress your sexuality will get you further away from any type of inner work results. It is NOT your sexuality keeping you away from your realization. Your MIND is!! 

Imagine we were all 7 billions enlightened right this second. No more sexuality. No more children. Does that sound reasonable to you? Do that sound like a Godly plan ? 

Sit with that. Sit with the natural flow of a flower or a butterfly.. Coming and going. Do you think they are judging any of it? Have you ever seen a dog going to sleep? He doesn't think about it. He just sits down and sleeps and enjoys the sleep. 

You do the same. THAT is awareness

 

 

[Emerald]

Just now, Ayla said:

Trying to suppress your sexuality will get you further away from any type of inner work results. It is NOT your sexuality keeping you away from your realization. Your MIND is!! 

Imagine we were all 7 billions enlightened right this second. No more sexuality. No more children. Does that sound reasonable to you? Do that sound like a Godly plan ? 

Sit with that. Sit with the natural flow of a flower or a butterfly.. Coming and going. Do you think they are judging any of it? Have you ever seen a dog going to sleep? He doesn't think about it. He just sits down and sleeps and enjoys the sleep. 

You do the same. THAT is awareness

 

 

Definitely. I might have sounded as though I was saying I should detach from sexuality in the sense of stopping being a 'sexual' person. Sexuality is very natural, and I don't want to leave anything natural behind. I only want to leave the thoughts and assumptions that are barriers to my sexuality and authenticity behind. I want to separate the wheat from the chaff, so to speak... even though I know that the chaff is natural too. 

But I agree that sexuality just is. It is a natural force, and that it should be accepted and have non-judgmental consciousness applied toward it. But the attachments and unconscious/conscious beliefs that I have spike it with all sorts of negative emotions... so very often it leaves me feeling a little conflicted and very unsatisfied. It turns something that would feel positive into something that causes a lot of anxiety.

[Ajax]

21 hours ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

 

Either way, it's a major attachment that I have, and I suspect that overcoming it will be necessary before progressing further toward enlightenment. Several weeks ago, I posted about an experience that I had where it felt like my senses were "collapsing in on themselves" and like "I" was going away. I was only "brought back" when thoughts of these insecurities popped into my field of awareness from out of nowhere. I felt a really horrible, traumatic feeling after the fact. These insecurities have been on my mind 10x extra, ever since. 

So, I suspect that my ego is using these insecurities to sustain itself. 

Does anyone have any ideas of how to let go of a particular attachment, without repressing these thoughts or feelings? 

@Emerald Wilkins Makes total sense and is quite natural. Afterall, if you lose your identity... who are you? If  the answer is not clear, you become who you was. Humans have a need to have an identity.  Therefore, you must create a new identity. There is a conflict with who you are with who you would like to be....

I never had much trouble losing an identity because I was a hermit and had no need for attention of others, when I got married and had a child... I worked more on that one and my new identity overshadowed my old one.

Edited March 16, 2016 by d1ajax

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, d1ajax said:

@Emerald Wilkins Makes total sense and is quite natural. Afterall, if you lose your identity... who are you? If  the answer is not clear, you become who you was. Humans have a need to have an identity.  Therefore, you must create a new identity. There is a conflict with who you are with who you would like to be....

I never had much trouble losing an identity because I was a hermit and had no need for attention of others, when I got married and had a child... I worked more on that one and my new identity overshadowed my old one.

I would wager that, when the time comes, I will relinquish my current identity with more ease than I now imagine. It's normally the case. For example, when I was about ten years old, I remember thinking that I would be afraid to give up toys and cartoons when the time came. I was afraid of losing my identity as a kid. But I left childhood with ease upon becoming a teenager. I was the same in my transition from teen hood to adulthood.

The primary difference here is that society's ideal view of womanhood is to be a beautiful young woman. So, because I'm very idealistic and want to be my best version, I want this part of my identity to appreciate in value like the other parts. Unfortunately, physical attractiveness is a depreciating asset, by its very nature. Men have some degree of issue in this way too, although society tends to value men for their contributions more than their physical appearance. So, there's more of a social give and take. Men don't rely as much on their physical appearance in the first place, so it's easier to let go of for them and for society.

Ultimately, the primary issue is that I want some kind of significance. I want to be valued. It's truly an issue of self love, more than anything else. And my identities are at war with one another, in an egoic self-hatred battle. But I'm hoping that, with age, will come maturity and that I'll be so over this issue once I get to that point. 

 

[Ajax]

@Emerald Wilkins I could make a case that looks don't make much of a lasting impression.

Therefore it doesn't have lasting value... something visual is so transient it has to constantly be created. It is a temporary impression. Why? Because it pertains to a fantasy and fantasies usually can't maintain for long because the are not real.

Personality and skills and virtue makes so much more a lasting impression.

* edit: people are extremely self-centered, and what they remember and value the most is generally how you are making them feel. 

How do you want to really be remembered?

Edited March 16, 2016 by d1ajax

[Emerald]

4 minutes ago, d1ajax said:

@Emerald Wilkins I could make a case that looks don't make much of a lasting impression.

Therefore it doesn't have lasting value... something visual is so transient it has to constantly be created. It is a temporary impression. Why? Because it pertains to a fantasy and fantasies usually can't maintain for long because the are not real.

Personality and skills and virtue makes so much more a lasting impression.

How do you want to really be remembered?

That's true. I suppose that I just want the two to go together. I'm fairly idealistic, so I want a particular self-image which clashes up against reality. However, if given the choice, I would choose to maintain my other virtues over looks any day because they are much more fulfilling. Plus, I'm not even Miss America in the first place, so it isn't like my looks have ever been my greatest strength. I've always valued my intellect and creativity more, and had more to contribute in those areas. 

My skills, talents, and personality traits give me a lot more positivity in my life. Also, if I look out at reality, there are a variety of different looking people and I value them for their personality and not their looks. I guess I fear becoming dull to the eye of the masses. I want to be an interesting and magnetic person, and I've come to equate a woman being interesting with a youthful appearance and sex appeal. It's likely an outgrowth of the media's influence on me, because I don't think that it actually comes from reality. Normally, the most interesting people are hardly ever the most attractive. But my ego distorts these facts, and tends to live in a world of ideals set up for only me to live up to. 

I've also had a lot of negative feelings, dating back to my childhood, regarding being female. I was indoctrinated into the idea that masculinity is much better than femininity. So, as a child, I adopted a more masculine persona and even felt superior to other of my female peers who showed evidence of femininity in their personality. When I was about 10 or 11, I used to ask other kids to hurt me to prove that I wouldn't flinch and outright refused to make friends with girls. Luckily, that phase passed before I got into middle school, but even then, I was always unconsciously trying to escape my femininity.  Only when I was 20, did I realize that I had major issues with feminine repression and sought to reintegrate my feminine traits. I think this issue is sort of the residual effects of this early repression. It's a real bottleneck. 

[Toby]

The thing is... physical appearance will change. Physical abilities and strength will change. Character traits and personality will change. Mental abilities will change. And outside circumstances as well. It's maybe a bit sad but thats how it is.

Oh, I forget to tell you something: the two most famous female western Gurus both had plastic surgery afaik. And they are still amazing teachers IMO.