What do you know?

[okulele]

Ok, it really seems I don't know anything. I am sitting and looking, but I really don't get anything.

What about you, awakened people? Do you know something? What do you know? Do you know what reality is? Do you know what thoughts are? How do you know?

[Nahm]

I know that everything I know is illusionary and there is no such thing as knowledge, nor this me which claims to know this. I know I’m not an awakened person. Thoughts are finite, as you are infinite. The presentation or appearance of a choice must be illusion because only finite things could be optional choices and only infinite could be free to appear to make a choice, while infinite is the appearing finites, so there never was an actual choice possible. 

[okulele]

@Nahm That's twisting my mind.

Another way to phrase my question would be: Do you have a sense you understand what is?

Edited June 23, 2018 by okulele

[Nahm]

@okulele Yes, I do. That is ego though, and I made it up. Finite can not understand infinite, it’s already it. The act of understanding is already an illusion before you even get to the content attempted to be understood. That’s why it’s so funny, but I don’t understand “who” it is so funny to - or I am not aware infinite has a sense of humor. Maybe so. Maybe ego.  This is not intended to be mind twisting or ‘riddlerish’. If I tried to do that I actually wouldn’t know how to. The Truth is just unfathomably opposite of appearance, and exactly the same. It’s me though, so whatever, it’s hilarious. 

[sarapr]

40 minutes ago, Nahm said:

@okulele Yes, I do. That is ego though, and I made it up. Finite can not understand infinite, it’s already it. The act of understanding is already an illusion before you even get to the content attempted to be understood. That’s why it’s so funny, but I don’t understand “who” it is so funny to - or I am not aware infinite has a sense of humor. Maybe so. Maybe ego.  This is not intended to be mind twisting or ‘riddlerish’. If I tried to do that I actually wouldn’t know how to. The Truth is just unfathomably opposite of appearance, and exactly the same. It’s me though, so whatever, it’s hilarious. 

Whaaaat?

I feel dumb 

[tsuki]

1 hour ago, okulele said:

Ok, it really seems I don't know anything. I am sitting and looking, but I really don't get anything.

What about you, awakened people? Do you know something? What do you know? Do you know what reality is? Do you know what thoughts are? How do you know?

Knowledge is constituted in obviousness. Whatever is the content of your revelation that you understood at some point, the result of this understanding is obviousness. How could you ever thought otherwise, right?

It is obvious that I'm writing a post. It is obvious that I understand what obvious means, right?
It is obvious that his thing that taps the keyboard is my hand. How could it possibly not be my hand?
Things are because they are self-evident, and still - you are the one that understands them.
This is why you are not out there behind your eyes, but in here as you look at this post.
You obviously exist. You know everything, because you are everything.

Edited June 23, 2018 by tsuki

[metwinn]

@tsuki

23 minutes ago, tsuki said:

Knowledge is constituted in obviousness. Whatever is the content of your revelation that you understood at some point, the result of this understanding is obviousness. How could you ever thought otherwise, right?

It is obvious that I'm writing a post. It is obvious that I understand what obvious means, right?
It is obvious that his thing that taps the keyboard is my hand. How could it possibly not be my hand?
Things are because they are self-evident, and still - you are the one that understands them.
This is why you are not out there behind your eyes, but in here as you look at this post.
You obviously exist. You know everything, because you are everything.

The idea that you are a seperate entity writing this post is just an idea that exists in your mind. It's not reality. I am writing the post that your believe that you are writing just as much as you are

Edited June 23, 2018 by metwinn

[pluto]

The Truth is not always beautiful, Nor Beautiful words the Truth.

 

[Nahm]

@metwinn yep.

@pluto yep.

@sarapr me too.

[okulele]

Thanks for your answers. I have a strong need to understand, but as I see from your replies I will never achieve it the way I expect. Oh well, back to meditating!

[furashido]

On 2018-06-23 at 7:49 PM, okulele said:

Ok, it really seems I don't know anything. I am sitting and looking, but I really don't get anything.

What about you, awakened people? Do you know something? What do you know? Do you know what reality is? Do you know what thoughts are? How do you know?

I know that i do not know.

[Forestluv]

@okulele The knowing isn’t like knowing a fact. It’s just knowing. After my sister died, I grieved. I *know* what it’s like to grieve the loss of a loved one. I don’t have to convince myself or anyone else. I have no desire to debate whether I really know what the grieving process is like. When I encounter someone who recently lost a sibling, there is a connection - a knowing.

Similiarly, when consciousness/awareness/reality is present, there is a knowing - that doesn’t need to rationalize or debate. Later, my mind may try to interpret it and become confused, but that is expected since it can’t be figured out or understood.

[Guest Quanty]

We all know every detail of existence and non-existence. Very few we aware of IT. Yeah, you get like special powers after awakening, but you get used to them as everything in life. People laugh normally until you touch them (Dr Strange Style like in the movie), they see the world through your eyes and they freak out or simply you get them very high if they are focussed in the mind. 

Touch a book with the intention to download the content, and is possible (just an example of a superpower). 

Edited June 25, 2018 by Quanty

[Guest Quanty]

Enlightenment is not what people think is, in general, they have a very bad misconception. The awakened one does not bother too much with this existential mindsets/goals/feeling good. Like a child who wants to just be and play, nothing more. Eternal discovery.

And the agony around common people, because he/she can hear, feel all the beings around. And I must tell you folks, it is a piece of garbage this world, literally, when you hear, feel other people you just pass by on the street. (bumblebee style usually, with your internal voices). Is not fun, after a while you tend to let go of any information and stupidity that comes every day, and that stupidity is called education/high morals/independence/a must do something/life purpose/especially money, etc.

So maybe I'm on this forum to see if I encounter someone who had been to the other side, the sad fact is, I don't see, not even in Leo.

Too serious business here too. Sad.

[Hotaka]

@Quanty The hardest thing to do:

Step 3

What do I really know?

TODAY ASK YOURSELF WHAT YOU REALLY KNOW and distinguish what you know from what you think or hope for or want for yourself or your world, what you are afraid of, what you believe in, what you cherish and what you value. Distinguish this question from all such orientations to the very best of your ability and ask yourself, “What do I really know?”You must continuously examine whatever answers you give to this question to see if they represent your beliefs or assumptions or the beliefs or assumptions of other people or perhaps even of humanity at large.

THREE TIMES TODAY, FOR 10 MINUTES EACH, ask this question and think very seriously about your response and about the meaning of this question,“What do I really know?”

Practice 3: Three 10-minute practice periods.

http://www.stepstoknowledge.com/steps/Step3-What-do-I-really-know.htm

[Guest Quanty]

24 minutes ago, Hotaka said:

@Quanty The hardest thing to do:

Step 3

What do I really know?

TODAY ASK YOURSELF WHAT YOU REALLY KNOW and distinguish what you know from what you think or hope for or want for yourself or your world, what you are afraid of, what you believe in, what you cherish and what you value. Distinguish this question from all such orientations to the very best of your ability and ask yourself, “What do I really know?”You must continuously examine whatever answers you give to this question to see if they represent your beliefs or assumptions or the beliefs or assumptions of other people or perhaps even of humanity at large.

THREE TIMES TODAY, FOR 10 MINUTES EACH, ask this question and think very seriously about your response and about the meaning of this question,“What do I really know?”

Practice 3: Three 10-minute practice periods.

http://www.stepstoknowledge.com/steps/Step3-What-do-I-really-know.htm

You talk from the Mind and Concepts. I talk from pure experience. Challenge me if you want, many did, many failed. But I have to know you if you challenge me because I do not disclose to strangers this great power. Even though I did release diamonds in many posts and the noobs think I'm trolling.  

Why do I have this attitude? Pure defiance to those who come with the mind and think they are thinking.

You maybe wonder why I bother to write here?  Cause I don't go with the flow. Politeness is overrated when it comes to true truth. 

Edited June 25, 2018 by Quanty

[Hotaka]

@Quanty Good on you Quanty, I challenge you yes, why else would I put the @ symbol there if not to target you individually?

Well, the challenge itself is what brings out Knowledge, in fact, most of the great storms of Knowledge came through at times of war, take Wittgenstein as an example, he was at war in himself and at war on the outside. He served in both world war I and world war II. Of course we are not in this situation, but in the minds of people, a war is occurring yes, and we must bring it out to observe it on a sheet of paper as people's words are a great tool to diagnose and see the incorrect patterns within it. I challenge people to bring to me their own inner conflict, and I show them that it can stand alone even without their mind really doing anything.

[Hotaka]

What is beyond the flow? I ask this to all.

[Guest Quanty]

Maybe the best friends have to be enemies first   

[Hotaka]

@Quanty Exactly, I could be pressuring the deepest gut reaction in you, but there could be no friction or tension in my body, why is that? Do you feel the gut tension or are you watching?

I think the heart knows the answer to this. But do we need to be in conflict first? Or at the same time. And eternal conflict there is, such as left and right and in the heart as well it keeps it open, it is only bipolar because we can't challenge it without chickening out, so we remain on a pendulum.

Edited June 25, 2018 by Hotaka