Fear of losing myself

[Santhiphap]

On 21.6.2018 at 7:57 PM, Quanty said:

 

Never mind the quote above (cant erase it)

 

While I enjoyed reading the conversation, here is a short report of the meditation sitting a few minutes ago.

This time it took a while longer, it was a bit harder to connect with the love, devotion or compassion (whatever you want to call it) which seems to be a shortcut for me to reach a no-thought state.  Thoughts were usually still active to an extent, but I remebered the words of one of you guys in this thread that thoughts are just clouding the conciousness, not completely covering it up.  So there is a way to find an intuition that leads the way through the clouds.  When that happens it usually feels like an instant/momentary absence of thoughts that leads to drifting into a no-thought state a bit further.  If I can do this a couple of times in a row I reach an almost complete no-thought state very fast.

Although fear, heart pounding, anxiety, again kept me from pushing through I think I made some progress.  This time I took it a little easier, and didnt let the ego pull me back as fast as before.  The other times this happened I still suffered from fear up to an hour after stopping to meditate and I had frightening feelings of something or someone standing behind me or being in my presence, like the fear of a little child alone in the dark.  This time I felt much better right after I was done. 

The feeling, being so close, is already so amazing though.  Its like everything tingles but its not physically.  Maybe I am way off here but might it be the emptiness of mind that is slowly being perforated by conciousness which will fully push through and consume "me" if I keep letting go?

After meditating I keep having a little distorted feeling for reality and the brain still feels so tingly for a couple of minutes. Its an incredible experience alltogether already.

Edited June 22, 2018 by Santhiphap

[Santhiphap]

What I also find interesting is that the goal of slowing the thoughts or focusing on the breath to have moments of thoughtlessness isnt even my priority now. 

Thoughts dont seem like a barrier anymore since they just slow down and dont come up when I focus on letting go, accepting and devoting myself to everything that comes up.

Edited June 22, 2018 by Santhiphap

[Ananta]

2 hours ago, Santhiphap said:

Although fear, heart pounding, anxiety, again kept me from pushing through I think I made some progress.  This time I took it a little easier, and didnt let the ego pull me back as fast as before. 

Thanks for the update, glad the fear/anxiety wasn't as bad this time. I really haven't had that, so can't advise regarding it. Im really not afraid to die...not that "you", the "real" you will die. It wont.

Keep letting go... you'll see for yourself.

[WaterfallMachine]

@Santhiphap Hey, just wanted to say I'm glad you're making progress. I've been in dark places in my self inquiry practices -- very, very dark places, and I know how hard it can be to get out of them. Take care, and I hope you're feeling better.

[Santhiphap]

8 hours ago, Santhiphap said:

After meditating I keep having a little distorted feeling for reality and the brain still feels so tingly for a couple of minutes.

Can anyone relate to these tingly feelings in the head? It feels very physical and also heavy.

 

5 hours ago, Anna1 said:

 Im really not afraid to die...not that "you", the "real" you will die. It wont.

Keep letting go... you'll see for yourself.

 

The ego always want to identify itself with something, the trick is to let go of any identification, right?

So I might be able to trick the ego for some time and tell myself there is a "real" me to identify with, but the closer I get the more the ego realises there is nothing to identify with and it will start to panic.

@Anna1  I am really interested in how you managed not to be afraid of losing existence.  I can only assume you didnt even think alot about this existencial dilemma and kind of unexpectetly slipped into enlightenment?

@WaterfallMachine   I am currently taking almost 4 months off work and changing places. I am surrounded by nature in france right now and will head to Thailand in 2 weeks to stay for 3 months and probably become a monk for a while.  The perfect settings to let go and relax.   As long as I am not too much confronted with the daily struggle and the unaware society I am very happy and calm.

[Santhiphap]

I wanna say something about thoughts and meditation. Correct me if I am wrong.

I think a misunderstanding has been formed as I educated myself about meditation.  The general headline that suck in my mind is that one has to "eliminate" all thoughts.  This is easier said than done and the process is quiet unclear apart from specific techniques to start off from.

But the deeper I get I feel like its like a spiral, I need thoughts in the first place to dissolve them and get a level higher, and do it again and again and again to reacher higher and higher. Thoughts are automatically less aparrent the higher I go.  There really is nothing to do but to accept everything.

All I am saying (and I am repeating myself but this has been too much of a shift not to) is that I think my evaluation of thoughts has changed in a good way and that I assume many people falling into this trap of not accepting thoughts as something that can actually be usefull in meditation.

Hope this helps someone.  And again, please correct me if you think I am wrong.

Edited June 23, 2018 by Santhiphap

[Ananta]

8 hours ago, Santhiphap said:

The ego always want to identify itself with something, the trick is to let go of any identification, right?

Yes ...and once you're fully convinced that you are awareness, then that knowing/ realization replaces the I am the body/mind thought.

8 hours ago, Santhiphap said:

Anna1  I am really interested in how you managed not to be afraid of losing existence.  I can only assume you didnt even think alot about this existencial dilemma and kind of unexpectetly slipped into enlightenment?

I'm Self-realized, but won't claim "enlightenment". Plus, really, who would claim it?

The most that could be said is that one understands that their true nature is awareness and they have assimilated this fact and therefore are "liberated from dependence on objects- subtle and gross". I'm still not done assimilating.

Sooo, as to your question, why I wasn't afraid. The truth is that I'm a suicide survivor  (a decade ago). The ego already went through the ultimate fear, it wanted to be extinguished and it gave up on life. 

Anyway, I survived and 6 months later when I read Tolle (and others) and started Self inquiry ego liked the fact that maybe it would just disappear for good. Within a year after starting I had my first true awakening and recognized the unreality of the ego. I became Self-realized.

Edited June 23, 2018 by Anna1

[B_Naz]

Also, I'll like to say If this sorta thing happens, I think you should remember that you could be in an emotional state and you start reacting to your discoveries. Best way I find to deal with these is to realise that you're in a certain state of emotion. This should helps you switch states, since you jump from state to state everyday, hour and second, without realising

[Santhiphap]

@Anna1  I see. Thanks for your honesty. I read Tolle too and i find it very well written.

And yes I ment self realization. Im just using words.. as long as we are on the same page.. 

@B_Naz I am currently experimenting and experiencing the state changes when I accept certain things during tue day. As long as nothing is triggering my ego too much its an easy practice for now.

 

[cetus]

5 hours ago, Santhiphap said:

I wanna say something about thoughts and meditation. Correct me if I am wrong.

I think a misunderstanding has been formed as I educated myself about meditation.  The general headline that suck in my mind is that one has to "eliminate" all thoughts.  This is easier said than done and the process is quiet unclear apart from specific techniques to start off from.

But the deeper I get I feel like its like a spiral, I need thoughts in the first place to dissolve them and get a level higher, and do it again and again and again to reacher higher and higher. Thoughts are automatically less aparrent the higher I go.  There really is nothing to do but to accept everything.

All I am saying (and I am repeating myself but this has been too much of a shift not to) is that I think my evaluation of thoughts has changed in a good way and that I assume many people falling into this trap of not accepting thoughts as something that can actually be usefull in meditation.

Hope this helps someone.  And again, please correct me if you think I am wrong.

@Santhiphap To accept everything is to except that there is no you that was born, will grow old, and die. Your thoughts have created that illusion from the very start. If you except this you will see the bigger picture. You want to reach a higher level but you cling to the illusion that there is someone there.

Have you ever listened to the words of Nisargadatta's pointers?

[Ananta]

15 minutes ago, Santhiphap said:

Thanks for your honesty. I read Tolle too and i find it very well written.

Your welcome. I was hesitant, but it was so long ago, it really doesn't bother me. Anyways, I started with Tolle, but don't read his stuff so much anymore. I think he's great for beginners though.

"And yes I meant self realization. Im just using words.. as long as we are on the same page.. "

Ok, gotcha! 

Edited June 23, 2018 by Anna1

[Ananta]

@Santhiphap  

"Q: My ego is afraid that if I totally let go, I will forget my appointments and forget to take care of business. I’m telling my ego that this is not what happens, but it would be nice to hear it from you. Also, how do we take care of business when we have totally let go?

Adya: When you are letting go, you are letting go into a higher order of truth, reality, and love. It is scary because you are essentially letting go of control, or the illusion of control. And you are letting go of the morbid comfort of the old, conditioned, and the predictable. So it feels like taking a bit of a risk, a leap of faith you could say. But, when you are ready you will let go in spite of the fear, not because you have overcome the fear. It is only your mind that frightens you with images of not being able to do what you need to do in your daily life. Remember that it is a higher order of truth that is calling you to let go.

~ Adyashanti 

"The Way of Liberation" Study Course