Spiral Dynamics Stage Blue Examples Mega-Thread

[fatsinglebrokeNOTego]

 

[Leo Gura]

 

[Mondsee]

On 19/6/2018 at 2:44 AM, Leo Gura said:

I want to create a comprehensive list of video examples of prototypical stage Blue thinking

Stage Blue Examples:

[...] Marathon Monks of Mt Hiei [...]

Hey @Leo Gura, I have a question on this one. I see how the Marathon Monks of Mount Hiei can be very disciplined in a dogmatic fashion. They do things because the scriptures say so, and they'd rather die than disobey and break their honor, but, don't you think that by a total surrender of your life to something, as those Monks do, they maybe do get enlightened?

I know enlightenment isn't something directly implied by the spiral dynamics, but imagine they are deeply blue, and suddenly they realize the true nature of reality and that allows them to have a massive holistic view and understanding of everything, as the higher stages do. So maybe those monks are either very blue and become very turquoise from a moment to the next one...

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Freyah said:

@Leo Gura

Can you explain how Zen monasticism is blue? I thought most of the western folks ending up there would have seen through materialism and be looking for something deeper in their lives. I guess I'm thinking of people that have become dissolutioned with their materialistic orange based societies and seeing that consumerism doesn't make them happy. Are they not training have love and acceptance of all, and being more tolerant of all others, and ultimately progress up the spiral??

It tends to be very traditional and conservative.

Of course not always. But you have to see Zen as more than just enlightenment. Zen is an entire tradition, like Hinduism is.

Even though Zen and Hinduism can lead you to enlightenment, they are usually dogmatic and Blue in their value structure.

8 minutes ago, Mondsee said:

Hey @Leo Gura, I have a question on this one. I see how the Marathon Monks of Mount Hiei can be very disciplined in a dogmatic fashion. They do things because the scriptures say so, and they'd rather die than disobey and break their honor, but, don't you think that by a total surrender of your life to something, as those Monks do, they maybe do get enlightened?

I know enlightenment isn't something directly implied by the spiral dynamics, but imagine they are deeply blue, and suddenly they realize the true nature of reality and that allows them to have a massive holistic view and understanding of everything, as the higher stages do. So maybe those monks are either very blue and become very turquoise from a moment to the next one...

I don't doubt their enlightenment.

You can be enlightened but your value system can still be very traditional and conservative.

Enlightenment alone is not enough to take you to Turquoise. Enlightenment will not magically transform your value system to Yellow or Turquoise.

Spiral Dynamics is not directly tracking one's progress towards enlightenment. That is not what the model was designed for.

[fatsinglebrokeNOTego]

@Leo Gura I wonder if higher stages are necessarily better.

I get a sense that higher stages are more "true", but at the same time, I get a sense that limited resources, effects of close people who are also in lower stages, less quality food and less developed neo frontal cortex all affect the stages.

Also, I get a sense that stages are cyclical.

"it is how it is" type of thing

Edited June 22, 2018 by fatsinglebrokeNOTego

[Mondsee]

@Leo Gura gotcha! Thanks.

56 minutes ago, fatsinglebrokeNOTego said:

Also, I get a sense that stages are cyclical.

They're called "spiral" for some reason

[Thanatos13]

9 minutes ago, Mondsee said:

@Leo Gura gotcha! Thanks.

They're called "spiral" for some reason

There are no stages. There is no blue, green, yellow, or turquoise. It’s just soemthing made up based on arbitrarily created categories.

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, fatsinglebrokeNOTego said:

@Leo Gura I wonder if higher stages are necessarily better.

I get a sense that higher stages are more "true", but at the same time, I get a sense that limited resources, effects of close people who are also in lower stages, less quality food and less developed neo frontal cortex all affect the stages.

"Better" is a relative notion.

In the Absolute sense nothing is better than anything else.

In the relative sense, it's better to live in a Green society than a Blue society for most people.

Higher stages are less blindly selfish and egotistical than lower stage. Which generally makes for a "better" life. You would much rather live in Alabama than in the Congo.

But if you want to be a bloodthirsty psychopath, by all means, go ahead. See how that works out for you and your people.

[Leo Gura]

@Joseph Maynor "I don't lie to myself..." -- Rush Limbaugh

LOL, that's classic!

[Thanatos13]

There isn’t an Absolute. Existence is empty of anything that we humans assign to it. It’s just another creation of humans. 

There also isn’t a higher or lower because there aren’t any stages. 

[Thanatos13]

Again I keep saying that growth and development are a myth. 

[John Iverson]

2 hours ago, Joseph Maynor said:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rush_Limbaugh

How can this be a blue?? 

[electroBeam]

red vs blue

 

[Edvard]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

But Blue is the type of person who would die in the call of duty for his country/people.

Good thing blue people exist then. Or maybe it's not exclusively blue. I'm not saying you necessarily are saying that.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 22, 2018 by Edvard

[John Iverson]

26 minutes ago, Edvard said:

Good thing blue people exist then. Or maybe it's not exclusively blue. I'm not saying you necessarily are saying that.

 

 

 

 

I am convinced and i  see that blue is necessary to have civilization and imagine you have a civilization now ,.. and that will be evolve in to orange, green , yellow and turquoise... blue is necessary ... 

[Edvard]

4 minutes ago, John Iverson said:

I am convinced and i  see that blue is necessary to have civilization and imagine you have a civilization now ,.. and that will be evolve in to orange, green , yellow and turquoise... blue is necessary ... 

Yeah, and my point was also that maybe you may wanna risk your life for the nation as orange, yellow, coral, etc. This is not exclusively blue. I can tell you one thing for sure. There are not only blue people in the military, especially not these days, in developed countries.

Edited June 22, 2018 by Edvard

[John Iverson]

19 minutes ago, Edvard said:

Yeah, and my point was also that maybe you may wanna risk your life for the nation as orange, yellow, coral, etc. This is not exclusively blue. I can tell you one thing for sure. There are not only blue people in the military, especially not these days, in developed countries.

Yes , it could be, I don't know, but if it's that's the case maybe they are blue but they have slightly different in color.. because as long as they have the belief of "for the nation" i would die for the Nation.. then that is the sign that they are blue.... pure orange , green , yellow , and turquoise,.. will not do that and think that way... unless they are pure blue or blue + slightly different color... the portion of blue is higher than the other. Color...

Edited June 22, 2018 by John Iverson

[Rilles]

@Ether

dont know why it says @ether , ignore that

just wanted to add a Green quote 

Edited June 22, 2018 by Rilles

[Edvard]

1 hour ago, John Iverson said:

Yes , it could be, I don't know, but if it's that's the case maybe they are blue but they have slightly different in color.. because as long as they have the belief of "for the nation" i would die for the Nation.. then that is the sign that they are blue.... pure orange , green , yellow , and turquoise,.. will not do that and think that way... unless they are pure blue or blue + slightly different color... the portion of blue is higher than the other. Color...

I don't agree with that. We all have beliefs, but the thing about Blue, if we go by the model, is that it identifies with the beliefs and hold them as absolute truths, ie. handed down by a personal god, or similar. You can still believe your nation is good and worth protecting, and seeing the value in contributing to that, being willing to sacrifice your life for people because you also can count on others to do the same for you, and for there at all to exist a nation where people can thrive. Protecting the nation also protects your right to go to school, to practice yoga, to speak freely. We count on other people, and are better off in a society where we share this burden of protecting values that we share. Not necessarily through military, but that's an important part of it.

Edited June 22, 2018 by Edvard

[John Iverson]

24 minutes ago, Edvard said:

I don't agree with that. We all have beliefs, but the thing about Blue, if we go by the model, is that it identifies with the beliefs and hold them as absolute truths, ie. handed down by a personal god, or similar. You can still believe your nation is good and worth protecting, and seeing the value in contributing to that, being willing to sacrifice your life for people because you also can count on others to do the same for you, and for there at all to exist a nation where people can thrive. Protecting the nation also protects your right to go to school, to practice yoga, to speak freely. We count on other people, and are better off in a society where we share this burden of protecting values that we share. Not necessarily through military, but that's an important part of it.

Do you know what stage are you?