A rant against intelligence as Leo sees it

[blazed]

18 minutes ago, George Paul said:

At 16:40 Leo says that in the next trip he will ask infinity " Why are you intelligent?" .

If we were to expand the word intelligence with its definition, lets say "the ability to solve problems", or anything else, you can put anything there, the question Leo was supposed to ask infinity becomes:

                                             "Why are you able to solve problems? "

 

See ? WTF ? How can you ask God this thing? It doesn't make sense.

If you can come with a definition that would make sens , please write here, it would be an interesting exercise.

 

 

The root question becomes "why do you exist?" So basically "why does existence exist".

And the answer to that question is because non-existence by its very definition and nature means it does not exist, meaning it negates itself leaving on existence, you simply can't have non-existence it just cancels itself out.

So asking why are you intelligent is like asking, why does intelligence exist? which is like why does existence exist?

Because it does and you're a witness to it.

The only reason your experience right now is real is because you are saying its real, your own witness to your 5 senses and inner being is the only thing that is allowing reality to take place.

Infinite intelligence is easy.

There is no you in this picture that does anything, There is no "doer" the thing that you think you are does not exist, it's an illusion, its all being done by infinite intelligence,

lets say consciousness is the witness that makes existence exist.

and lets say infinite intelligence is how everything works on auto pilot.

Look at how nature does everything effortlessly.

Look at how your body breathes, heals, digests, pumps blood and regulates all your bodily functions, you are not doing jack-shit, you're not sitting there regulating your blood flow every second of your life, it's all happening on auto pilot.  That's infinite intelligence.

And there is no you, whenever you think you exist, that's the ego. You don't exist, besides existence itself, not as 1 not as 2, the same way a black hole in space is a not nothing, and neither is it a something, it is beyond both those things.

 

Edited June 10, 2018 by blazed

[Faceless]

5 minutes ago, George Paul said:

Yes, no other clue for now .

 

But not necesary. I admit extensikon of the definition to any phisical (for now) system than reacts to external stimulus.

I think that is reasonable that you stay with what you know for now. And if you are not accepting what others say get are willing to suspend your own bias/prejudice there is no problem.

And as far as questioning what Leo says, it’s better to stay undecided until we go into in depth. 

 

You do see the limitation of thought right? 

 

 

Edited June 10, 2018 by Faceless

[Azza]

31 minutes ago, George Paul said:

Nope, he repeatedly says that intelligence is a property of consciousness, or infinity. So consciousness is intelligent. Why would it be ? For what reason ? Any problem need a solution ?

And he nowhere explains what is to be intelligent ? What that means ? What the consciousness does so that it can be cataloged as intelligent ? And what is intelligent anyway when it comes to God ? A catch 22

Ok i think i understand what you're trying to say now. Correct me if I'm wrong  You're saying that consciousness is absolute. Infinite so it doesn't need to have any attributes or hmm property because it already is infinity of literally everything? If that so, you are already thinking of intelligence as human intelligence. Leo isn't referring to that according to my understanding. That's why i said leo is speaking about something different not intelligence as we know it. 

[George Paul]

7 minutes ago, blazed said:

and lets say infinite intelligence is how everything works on auto pilot.

Sounds like mechanics. Reminds me of holy spirit from Christianity.

So by having infinite intelligence, existence supports its existence (is running). Consciousness created world but this infinite intelligence makes it run. Sounds plausible.

Edited June 10, 2018 by George Paul

[George Paul]

3 minutes ago, Faceless said:

I think that is reasonable that you stay with what you know for now. And if you are not accepting what others say get are willing to suspend your own bias/prejudice there is no problem.

 

The problem is the others don';t say anything. Who said something about this subject? Point me one.

Edited June 10, 2018 by George Paul

[Faceless]

2 minutes ago, George Paul said:

The problem is the others don';t say anything. Who said something about this subject? Point me one.

I understand. 

I’m not on any sides. I just wanted to know what you were referring to by intelligence. 

Are you interested in science? 

Edited June 10, 2018 by Faceless

[George Paul]

6 minutes ago, Faceless said:

You do see the limitation of thought right? 

Moreover, I see thoughts as any other object in the Universe. 

It is not thoughts we are discussing here, but it is a concept that so far had only materialistic/thought implications applied unmodifieed to infinity

Edited June 10, 2018 by George Paul

[George Paul]

2 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Are you interested in science? 

I graduated from Physics, theoretical physycs speciality.

I dont give a shit now on it.

[Faceless]

1 minute ago, George Paul said:

I graduated from Physics, theoretical physycs speciality.

I dont give a shit now on it.

Cool ? 

What do you explore now? 

 

Edited June 10, 2018 by Faceless

[George Paul]

3 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Cool ? 

what do you explore now? 

As regards spiritual learning, I am 90% with Leo's ideas. Some of them I discovered by myself from discussions with another physicist. We gave up long time ago (20 yrs) the idea of a deterministic universe. Since than , we came up with many theories of our own, and Leo is the closest author i found so far to our direction.

Edited June 10, 2018 by George Paul

[Faceless]

3 minutes ago, George Paul said:

As regards spiritual learning, I am 90% with Leo's ideas. One of them I discovered by myself from discussions with another physicist. We gave up long time ago (20 yrs) the idea of a deterministic universe. Since than , we came up with many theories of our own, and Leo is the closest author i found so far to our direction.

Ah I see. Have you gone into David bohms implicate explicit theory? 

I do all my exploration inwardly. Although the observer/observed phenomenon is in direct relationship with that theory of his. We can observe this in self observation. You gone into that?

Edited June 10, 2018 by Faceless

[George Paul]

15 minutes ago, Azza said:

Ok i think i understand what you're trying to say now. Correct me if I'm wrong  You're saying that consciousness is absolute. Infinite so it doesn't need to have any attributes or hmm property because it already is infinity of literally everything? If that so, you are already thinking of intelligence as human intelligence. Leo isn't referring to that according to my understanding. That's why i said leo is speaking about something different not intelligence as we know it. 

You are half right.

Only I want to point to the fact that Leo is using a human intelligence concept without broadening it so that it would apply to infinity.

 

I am saying that if he tried to redefine this term, no video would have been made.

Edited June 10, 2018 by George Paul

[George Paul]

3 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Ah I see. Have you gone into David bohms implicate explicit theory? 

Nope, haven't read Bohm. Actually I haven't read any physicist that wrote philosophy. 

Quantum mechanics is all you need to say goodbye to reality.

[George Paul]

21 minutes ago, Azza said:

That's why i said leo is speaking about something different not intelligence as we know it. 

How do you know ? Usually he is very accurate in defining the things he refers to. This one escaped.

[Faceless]

8 minutes ago, George Paul said:

Nope, haven't read Bohm. Actually I haven't read any physicist that wrote philosophy. 

Quantum mechanics is all you need to say goodbye to reality.

Quantum mechanics is a specialty. The investigation is limited to the movement of thought itself. The observer and the observed are not separate. So the investigation is always partial, limited, fragmented, influcend by false assumptions and so on. Influenced by the bias and prejudices of the investigator/ and entity born of thought. 

 

Do you see what I mean? 

 

Bobm had gone into this quite deep. 

Something to check into. 

He goes into thought in depth. As thought is what is used to explore quantum mechanics, or any other science for that matter.

Edited June 10, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

Anyway thanks for your responses

[Truth Addict]

@George Paul

It's intelligent. Just like it exists.

Non-intelligence (illusion) is just a concept that occurs within infinite intelligence (Truth). Just like non-existence (illusion) is just a concept that occurs within existence (Truth).

It's intelligent in its design. That's why it's here, that's why it exists. Because otherwise it won't.

Randomness will never ever make such complicated, delicious, and beautiful design (as materialism assumes). Same goes for non-intelligence. Therefore it's infinitely intelligent.

[George Paul]

2 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Anyway thanks for your responses

My pleasure, u made me curious about Bohm, I will drop an eye.

BTW, in my understanding , I never thought that there was a conscious observer of quantum experiments like double split. Instead there was a much deeper truth, which very late after I graduated i barely understood.

[Faceless]

1 minute ago, George Paul said:

My pleasure, u made me curious about Bohm, I will drop an eye.

BTW, in my understanding , I never thought that there was a conscious observer of quantum experiments like double split. Instead there was a much deeper truth, which very late after I graduated i barely understood.

Idk check it out man. Maybe I can drop you a couple of videos on thought with bohm? To me it makes for a much more orderly movement of thinking anyhow. 

It benefits anyone who is willing to listen. 

 

[cetus]

You'll love Bohm. He spent a lot of time with J Krishnamurti. So Bohm is a great mix of 'thinking out of the box' physics and spirituality.     @ George Paul