Non-duality and pleasure

[SFRL]

Is it pleasurable to have this forum discussion about pursuing pleasure? 

[Faceless]

Studying abstractions and not observing the actuality in ones self is second hand learning. 

 

Please mr or mrs @Etagnwo

lets not go mess up @B_Naz thread.

 

[B_Naz]

2 minutes ago, SFRL said:

Is it pleasurable to have this forum discussion about pursuing pleasure? 

No, I fucking hate this. I'm not trying to pursue pleasure, that's the entire point ;( But I'm getting this pleasure from understanding duality and I don't know what to do with it. At the same time, I don't want to reject it because it's valuable observation but then, will I get addicted to this state? 

Edited June 9, 2018 by B_Naz

[Faceless]

@B_Naz do you see pleasure as desire pursuing any particular object? 

[B_Naz]

5 minutes ago, Faceless said:

@B_Naz do you see pleasure as desire pursuing any particular object? 

Not really. I don't even know why I'm pursuing in self-actualisation or any of this work. I don't want anything fixed in my life, I don't want pleasure. It use to be like that I guess until understanding a little bit more about duality and other concepts but now... It's just whatever, I'm doing it for no particular reason.

By the way, I'm not depressed or anything. I don't resist the pleasure or anything like that. I don't encourage this as well, this is just my personal journey. 

Edited June 9, 2018 by B_Naz

[SFRL]

5 minutes ago, B_Naz said:

No, I fucking hate this. I'm not trying to pursue pleasure, that's the entire point ;( But I'm getting this pleasure from understanding duality and I don't know what to do with it. At the same time, I don't want to reject it because it's valuable observation but then, will I get addicted to this state? 

Sounds like the same sentiments a porn addict is having when jerking off to porn. 

Although this might be more intellectually rewarding. 

I mean shit there are worse things that you can do with your life. The realization is good I think. You should have the ability to laugh at yourself. That makes it easier to accept it. 

[Faceless]

@B_Naz what I would do is start investigating how thought/the thinker opperates. 

That way you would see all this in yourself as it was arising. You wouldn’t have to ask anybody. 

If you understand all of (that/the you), you will be able to identify all dualistic movement. You would also be able to understand what to do when you are face with ‘how to handle pleasure, desire, and so on, without moving positively/dualistically. 

@robdl is another who is really cutting deep into this. 

[B_Naz]

36 minutes ago, Matt8800 said:

I dont understand this whole "I have to avoid pleasure" attitude in spiritual communities. The Buddha addressed this to his former colleges/renunciates. 

Live in the moment, experience beauty as it comes in its many forms and stay unattached.

I understand what you've said and coming from, and I agree with you.

It's not really that I'm trying to resist the pleasure, I'm not, it's more about will I get addicted to this pleasure? And when I say addicted, it's not about this addiction not benefiting me but making me stuck

[SFRL]

6 minutes ago, B_Naz said:

I understand what you've said and coming from, and I agree with you.

It's not really that I'm trying to resist the pleasure, I'm not, it's more about will I get addicted to this pleasure? And when I say addicted, it's not about this addiction not benefiting me but making me stuck

I think there are quite a few people on this forum being stuck on it. 

But you are aware of it. So I think you got a good chance to not get stuck. 

I mean shit you can get stuck on other shit like drugs or alcohol. Or pussy like me. 

Edited June 9, 2018 by SFRL

[Faceless]

17 minutes ago, B_Naz said:

But I'm getting this pleasure from understanding duality and I don't know what to do with it.

That is you. The pleasure. The you that wants to do something with it is a contradiction. Anything “you do with it”, is a further movement away from conflict to pleasure, which intensifies conflict. 

Just watch the pleasure and learn from it. You can’t do anything about it. There is only one movement, PLEASURE. 

3 minutes ago, B_Naz said:

It's not really that I'm trying to resist the pleasure, I'm not, it's more about will I get addicted to this pleasure?

If there is an awarness of this pleasure you will see the danger in it, and stay away. If you don’t see ‘as a fact’ the danger you will get caught in it. 

Edited June 9, 2018 by Faceless

[cetus]

10 minutes ago, B_Naz said:

I don't even know why I'm pursuing in self-actualisation or any of this work. I don't want anything fixed in my life, I don't want pleasure. It use to be like that I guess until understanding a little bit more about duality and other concepts but now... It's just whatever, I'm doing it for no particular reason.

@B_Naz

[B_Naz]

2 minutes ago, Faceless said:

If there is an awarness of this pleasure you will see the danger in it, and stay away. If you don’t see ‘as a fact’ the danger you will get caught in it. 

3 minutes ago, SFRL said:

I think there are quite a few people on this forum being stuck on it. 

Buy you are aware of it. So I think you got a good change to not get stuck. 

I mean shit you can get stuck on other shit like drugs or alcohol. Or pussy like me. 

That is true, I do have awareness. So this pleasure can be considered as an addiction like drugs? Is it worth doing some work on addictions as well?

 

 

[Faceless]

What is the root driving force that gives continuity to pleasure??

[B_Naz]

1 minute ago, Faceless said:

What is the root driving force that gives continuity to pleasure??

Memory?

[Faceless]

Just now, B_Naz said:

Memory?

Memory,experience, which responds as thought right? 

[Faceless]

Example...

I have had some experience of a drug which gave ‘me’ great satisfaction. After that experience ends I want it again because the memory of that experience of gratification has arisen. So I then seek the remeberance of that experience. This is how pleasure is born. 

Notice the ‘me’ 

The experience

The satisfaction

The memory

The gratification

And pleasure 

All imply the self/ MOVEMENT OF THOUGHT (the accumulation of memory responding as thought seeking security through its own movement) 

dog chasing tail

which leads one in a ⭕️

Edited June 9, 2018 by Faceless

[B_Naz]

15 minutes ago, Faceless said:

Example...

I have had some experience of a drug which gave ‘me’ great satisfaction. After that experience ends I want it again because the memory of that experience of gratification has arisen. So I then seek the remeberance of that experience. This is how pleasure is born. 

I know what you're exactly talking about. I've done this observation before. It happens to me with food. So "I" love eating junk food when watching movies at night, sort of a tradition of mine . When I get the food at the supermarket, I get excited, but then I put awareness on this excitement and it's just as you have said. I re-experience the experience of me enjoying my fatass watching Netflix, and the pleasure from it.

Then... When I actually do the eating and watching, it is never like the previous experience. When I finish, I get realisation of "well, that wasn't as good as last time". To be honest, it's more now like "why did I do that?" 

I get excited, then disappointed, I don't know where this disappointment comes from though, and I don't think it's not from the previous experience or memory, it's something deeper, but I become extremely aware of it.

Edited June 9, 2018 by B_Naz

[Faceless]

4 minutes ago, B_Naz said:

I get excited, then disappointed, I don't know where this disappointment comes from though, and I don't think it's not from the previous experience or memory, it's something deeper, but I become extremely aware of it.

Could it be the seeking security in that pleasure was not captured? 

Could it be a feeling of helplessness? 

Which is the other side of the coin, sorrow. 

To seek pleasure is to seek pain, conflict, sorrow, suffering. 

One and the same movement.

to seek security in thought (memory, experience) is to invite all that conflict/suffering.

Edited June 9, 2018 by Faceless

[B_Naz]

Just now, Faceless said:

Could it be the seeking security in that pleasure was not captured? 

Never thought of this, what does security actually mean? The security that I will get pleasure? That I will "secure" a pleasure at least?

[Faceless]

1 minute ago, B_Naz said:

Never thought of this, what does security actually mean? The security that I will get pleasure? That I will "secure" a pleasure at least?

Could we say that all movement of the self moves in the direction of psychological security?