Does spirituality make you lose motivation ?

[Leo Gura]

Yes, it's challenging to rewire your motivations. At deep levels of consciousness you realize that everything is pointless, valueless, and meaningless. So there's really no reason to do anything. And this can feel depressing and demotivating for a while. But that's true detachment. You just have to give yourself time and find ways to ground yourself. You can build up some healthy ambitions over time which are based on a higher purpose, even though you know purpose is an invention.

It can be tricky. Make sure you give yourself time. Don't make any rash decisions or actions. And trust that if you're in a depressive funk, that will not last forever. You will pull out of it with time.

The biggest mistake people make when they are depressed is that they assume this depression will last forever. It will not.

I think the way this problem is overcome in a tradition such as Zen is through rigorous habits and discipline. After enlightenment, the laundry. It's a grounding exercise.

[Azza]

I can relate to this so badly. and i'm actually very glad to hear i'm not alone. i'm so scared because i'm starting to lose passion about everything even my family. i started thinking "if someone I love dies, so what? they left an illusion anyway". i know what i'm saying sounds really bad but I can't help but think that everything is so meaningless. I can't decide what I want in my life anymore. nothing attracts me anymore after being so into having a family and even playing video games constantly, i stopped and now I don't even care to have a relationship. the only thing that kinda attracts me right now is wanting to help people. I feel like giving my business to a cousin i have that's in need for free and just going somewhere where I can volunteer. but then I think, i can help people from where i am if i really want then why do i wanna leave? that makes me realize i'm still looking for my peace of mind somewhere else and that's where i realize i have not taken one step forward. I think spirituality made me lost... i wanna add that i used to be a very devoting muslim so it wasnt so easy coming to this.

Edited May 31, 2018 by Azza

[Timotheus]

Finally I can see an advantage in my life long depressive episodes.

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Outer said:

What about the sentence "Life is suffering" that all the religious people have always talked about? Isn't that more accurate than pointless, valueless, and meaningless? The latter three seem like emotions to me, for example, the experience of meaning can be quietness of self-referential thoughts or a piece of Music.

Life is suffering from the ego-mind's POV.

What the religious people meant when they said "Life is suffering" is "Ordinary materialistic life is suffering" and that this can be transcended with deep enlightenment.

BEING is pointless, valueless, and meaningless. This is not an emotional statement. This is as factual as it gets. This is really not different from what physics would tell you: atoms do not have value or meaning.

It's actually a very important milestone in the spiritual journey for you to realize that BEING is meaningless. The ego-mind creates meaning to enable self-preservation to happen. Suffering cannot end unless meaning is realized to be an illusion. Suffering comes from the mind's pursuit of meaning and value.

Here's the 1st exercise from A Course In Miracles Workbook: Look around the room and notice that every object has no value or meaning. Like, you see a chair. What does a chair mean? Nothing.

It's a very simple but powerful exercise. Keep doing it.

[InfinitePotential]

11 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Here's the 1st exercise from A Course In Miracles Workbook: Look around the room and notice that every object has no value or meaning. Like, you see a chair. What does a chair mean? Nothing.

It's a very simple but powerful exercise. Keep doing it.

Aw yeah, just started ACIM. The exercises are sick and so useful, it's tough not to skip ahead. 

[Azza]

33 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It's actually a very important milestone in the spiritual journey for you to realize that BEING is meaningless.

But after realizing that BEING is meaningless, how and why do you keep being? because i think the only way out of being is when your physical body dies.

[Spinoza]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes, it's challenging to rewire your motivations. At deep levels of consciousness you realize that everything is pointless, valueless, and meaningless. So there's really no reason to do anything. And this can feel depressing and demotivating for a while. But that's true detachment. You just have to give yourself time and find ways to ground yourself. You can build up some healthy ambitions over time which are based on a higher purpose, even though you know purpose is an invention.

It can be tricky. Make sure you give yourself time. Don't make any rash decisions or actions. And trust that if you're in a depressive funk, that will not last forever. You will pull out of it with time.

The biggest mistake people make when they are depressed is that they assume this depression will last forever. It will not.

I think the way this problem is overcome in a tradition such as Zen is through rigorous habits and discipline. After enlightenment, the laundry. It's a grounding exercise.

You can build up some healthy ambitions over time which are based on a higher purpose, even though you know purpose is an invention.

Thanks for your reply, you really got what i feel

[Leo Gura]

5 hours ago, Azza said:

But after realizing that BEING is meaningless, how and why do you keep being? because i think the only way out of being is when your physical body dies.

There is no such thing as non-being. Even after the body dies, you will still not escape being. Being is infinite and eternal. So you're stuck being whether you like it or not. So might as well surrender to it.

By "Being" I don't mean "your life", or some way that you are, I mean the substance of reality.

Experience - ego = Being

39 minutes ago, Outer said:

Being does not have an absolute point, value or meaning. But there is definitely a relative point, value, and meaning that might or might not be created by ego-minds. To boil all points, value and meanings as simply ego-mind self-preservation is kind of dumb unless you mean it in an absolute sense. You know you're beyond of knowing that for sure, that's why you're so uncertain of your writing.

Play some music. Lying about your experience is ego-mind trying to fulfill a specific story and not tell what the experience is.

You're really telling an ego to look around the room and notice every object has no value or meaning. The fact that I have a chair in my room is due to an attribute of its meaning beyond the ego-mind. You don't understand why you're typing here or writing to each other. Is your pursuit of enlightenment, being a sage, and teaching, meaningless? You don't know. Does a hunter 300,000 years ago think about what the point of the spear does, or why he aims it? He doesn't know. That's what Thinker ego-mind does. Do you think about the computer or the chair? Or science?

It's not dumb. It's what is. Meaning and value are inventions -- and you are still obviously resisting this by playing these clever mind-games.

You haven't yet become conscious of what Being or meaning are. Careful with that arrogance. It's keeping you from growing.

You would greatly benefit from doing that exercise for a month or two.

Yes, what we are talking about is switching orientation from living from the relative to the Absolute. Which requires becoming conscious that meaning is an invention of your mind.

[Saumaya]

12 minutes ago, Outer said:

How is meaning and value invented? Can you take it from step one to the last one, to the creation of it? Are you able to really equate meaning and value as inventions if you can't do that? I can explain how and why the light bulb was invented, do the same with meaning and value.

 

True knowledge isn't possible from the POV of Absolute. Inference is only possible in the dream. Enlightenment is awakening from the dream.

Meaning assumes associations, associations assumes objects. Objects exist only in the dream, they come from the distinction of self and other(that's a duality).

Value is like saying one object is better than other. Same thing.

Meaning and Value have no place in Absolute. They exist only in relation.

 

[Highest]

It did for me. Lost all motivation to get a girlfriend and other materialistic stuff. When you realize that you are complete, the only thing you need is food and water. True and great freedom comes when you are empty and desireless. Not even a desire to live anymore, meaning if you die right now that would be fine to you.

[Guest Quanty]

Ye, I basically want to play all day, no matter with what, while meditating. 

[pluto]

@Highest Oh it goes deeper, even food and water are sources of desire/attachment to some degree and are not needed if you know how to absorb and utilize light - matter for energy

[pluto]

@Outer When you evolve to such a degree you vibrate at a higher frequency thus can sustain self because you are the creator of your reality. You can learn techniques to transfer light into energy especially if you are embodying a higher consciousness. Its hard for you to comprehend right now because you are trying to understand it from a 3D perspective.

Imagine a 2D flat surface trying to see and comprehend a 3D cube.

 

 

Edited June 3, 2018 by pluto

[Saumaya]

2 hours ago, pluto said:

You can learn techniques to transfer light into energy especially if you are embodying a higher consciousness. Its hard for you to comprehend right now because you are trying to understand it from a 3D perspective.

 

Im in the fifth dimension, apparently you can walk through walls and make a girl squirt without touching her. 

[Nahm]

@Saumaya I can attest to that. Sorry @Quanty  

[pluto]

@Saumaya If were residing in the fifth, you wouldn't be here nor use the word "apparently". However, you can embody fifth dimensional consciousness in an evolved 3D body, telepathy is the basic form of communication as manifestation is instantaneous and unconditional love is ever-present but will be extremely challenging to sustain for long in 3D/4D.

You either come back down or ascend.

 

Edited June 3, 2018 by pluto

[Ananta]

On 5/31/2018 at 3:48 PM, Leo Gura said:

So there's really no reason to do anything. And this can feel depressing and demotivating for a while. But that's true detachment. You just have to give yourself time and find ways to ground yourself. You can build up some healthy ambitions over time

This reminds me of the saying-

"At the first level on the path he saw mountains as mountains and rivers as rivers.

On the second level of the path he saw that mountains are not mountains and rivers are not rivers.

And at a third level he saw once again mountains were mountains and rivers were rivers."

[Saumaya]

14 hours ago, pluto said:

even food and water are sources of desire/attachment to some degree and are not needed if you know how to absorb and utilize light - matter for energ

Wait I know... you are some kind of....desert plant???