Suffering?

[Tearos]

Are you really suffering if you're not aware of the suffering?

Thank you!

Tearos/Fred

[tsuki]

Can you provide an example of such a situation?

[eputkonen]

33 minutes ago, Tearos said:

Are you really suffering if you're not aware of the suffering?

Thank you!

Tearos/Fred

Without an example, it is difficult to answer you...but if you are not aware of suffering then you are not suffering at that moment.  When you are worried and have anxiety...you know you are worried and have anxiety and thus aware of it.  if you were not aware of worry or anxiety...you would not be worried or anxious.

Edited May 5, 2018 by eputkonen

[Faceless]

Well suffering will disguise itself in the form of repetitive pleasure seeking. 

A mechanical movement to capture and maintain psychological security. 

To escape suffering leads to pleasure and to indulge in pleasure leads to suffering. Hehe

⭕️

Edited May 5, 2018 by Faceless

[Tearos]

@tsuki

Let's say I am an average, mediocre person. I would say that my life is pretty good. Let's say I decide to start a meditation habit, and after a given time, all the suffering in my life emerges from within because of the increase of awareness I have gained. The suffering was always there, but not until now I am aware of it. Was I really suffering? Or did the meditation create the suffering? Let's say that now, my life isn't pretty good anymore.

This is, of course, just an example - but I think it is a quite relatable example!

[Faceless]

@Tearos

Is your meditation participation another form of pleaseure? 

Edited May 5, 2018 by Faceless

[Nahm]

@Tearos You’re describing waking up, for many people. 

“Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see”  John Lennon. 

[Empty]

@Tearos Yes, you are. If you are not aware of your suffering, you suffer. 

 

Drop your ego, so the suffering will go

[tsuki]

@Tearos From the way you answer my question, I have a hunch that you were suffering because of fear of suffering.

If there was nothing wrong with your life as you claim - why would you have an impulse to change it by introducing meditation?
Would it be perhaps that you were trying to secure it so that you would be more balanced?

When you stand soundly with two feet on the ground and tell yourself that you need more balance - you will surely fall flat on your face.
There are times when meditation is 'used' to gain balance, but other times it is 'used' to express it.
If gaining balance does not work in your case - try to express it with it. Treat it as a form of art.
Perhaps, you are expressing your suffering and framing the problem so that meditation is to blame?

Edited May 5, 2018 by tsuki

[eputkonen]

2 hours ago, Tearos said:

@tsuki

Let's say I am an average, mediocre person. I would say that my life is pretty good. Let's say I decide to start a meditation habit, and after a given time, all the suffering in my life emerges from within because of the increase of awareness I have gained. The suffering was always there, but not until now I am aware of it. Was I really suffering? Or did the meditation create the suffering? Let's say that now, my life isn't pretty good anymore.

This is, of course, just an example - but I think it is a quite relatable example!

 

That which we suppress and repress tends to arise in silence (i.e. meditation).  If it is something suppressed and repressed, you were always suffering...just ignoring it and calling life in distraction happiness/not suffering.  Meditation does not create suffering...but in meditation there is a lack of distraction and what is suppressed and repressed tends to rise up again.

[Faceless]

Meditation in itself doesn’t cause suffering. It’s particiaption in meditation as means to end suffering that actully causes and proliferates suffering. 

To escape into mechanical routine “habit to attain psychological security” in order to end suffering is to escape what is “insecurity/suffering” to an idea “security/non-suffering” 

Moving towards the idea and evading the fact inevitably causes suffering. This is classic resistance. Any movement to attain and maintain psychological security is an invitation to insecurity..

In this there is the prepetual conflict between what is actully happening and what you desire to happen....Its like a dog chasing its tail. Around and around one goes. ⭕️

Edited May 5, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

In actual meditation there is no such movement. 

 

Edited May 5, 2018 by Faceless

[Guest Quanty]

Fear, in reality this sentiment comes out of chronic neuro path ways and energetic path ways in the body, a.k.a Blockages. 

This is the main reason why people don't awaken. It is so heavy the pain to change the body/mind, that the system panics, a.ka Dark Night of the Soul. 

 

 

[Faceless]

Fear of fear and seeking security from fear causing more fear. 

?

[phoenix666]

@Tearos what you wrote resonates with me a lot. 

I ran away from my own suffering so much in the past. I distracted the hell out of me. in retrospective I can say that there was that gigantic amount of suffering, hidden under layers of numbness and action. 

now I am much more aware of it. so sometimes I think 'how is it possible? I've put so much work in all of this. how can I still suffer so much?' but then I realize that the suffering has not increased (quite opposite actually) it's just that I become aware of it much more. so as soon as there is a pinch of annoyance, frustration, sadness or emptiness - bam - I notice it.  two years ago I would have distracted myself with something, completely neglecting my own emotions.

very interesting topic!