New 6-Part Osho Cult Documentary Just Out On Netflix

[blazed]

I just finished episode 3, interesting documentary but all this seems like utter bullshit and nonsense.

What's the point of all this? What’s so special about what Osho was trying to do, just a man with his own little agenda and wants. Why so much conflict and disruption to get what they want.

Neither side seems like they know what they're doing, on one side you got the racist, fear mongers that don’t like change.

Then on the other side you got the so called spiritual people who get into hissy fits when someone pees in their soup, and then turns around to the other group and calls them stupid and little and unenlightened.

Spiritual people who rely on a guru to feel good or cry uncontrollable in the presence of a guru have weak minds, emotional baggage, they need to be "rescued" from the stories in their heads.

They don't see that the guru is happening within them.

Don't look up to anyone, don't look down on anyone.

There's only one thing that is worth worshipping but not needed, and that is your absolute being, that manifested these gurus, plus the infinite variations.

As a compass, map or tool a guru is great, otherwise you might have to reinvent the wheel.

Might as well worship your PC's folks, kiss it good night every day! I mean the amount of questions Google answers you!

Edited April 20, 2018 by blazed

[eskwire]

On 3/18/2018 at 2:04 PM, Leo Gura said:

There's contradiction at all between being enlightened and being an alcoholic.

You can do both, and more!

Why is this so? Infinity?

This is a hard pill for me to swallow because I had a drinking problem relieved by a Vipassana retreat. Both make the other irrelevant. 

[Vipassana]

@Ether there is no such thing as a his body

[Ether]

@Vipassana Hey, dont believe anyone else blindly.

[Leo Gura]

On 4/20/2018 at 10:05 PM, eskwire said:

Why is this so? Infinity?

This is a hard pill for me to swallow because I had a drinking problem relieved by a Vipassana retreat. Both make the other irrelevant. 

The body and mind has addictions and habits which will continue long after enlightenment in many cases.

Of course enlightenment is helpful for getting you more consciousness over your addictions, but that doesn't automatically end addictions.

Alan Watts seemed to have some degree of awakening and yet seemed to be an alcoholic.

After various awakening experiences I've had, my internet and smartphone addictions, for example, did not magically disappear. I could still feel the mind and body mechanically reaching for my phone or the internet. The brain's job is to maintain the body's survival, and that means lots of bias towards homeostasis regardless of whatever truth you've just seen.

After all, after enlightenment, chop wood, carry water. The dream must go on, and as long as you're inside the dream, you are subject to it rules.

[Ether]

@Leo Gura But dont do most alcaholics drink to run away from the pain?

If Alan, awkaned why did he keep on drinking?

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Ether said:

@Leo Gura But dont do most alcaholics drink to run away from the pain?

If Alan, awkaned why did he keep on drinking?

A) Awakening to Truth does not necessarily end all suffering or pain.

B) Chemical addictions (like alcohol) can be very stubborn and will not change by seeing Truth alone.

C) There are many degrees of awakening. While Alan Watts clearly had some degree of awakening, I doubt he had Buddha-like abiding nondual awareness or a perpetual state of Nirvana.

D) Awakening alone WILL NOT transform or develop the self. It will not clear all the chakras, all the bad habits, it will not fix all the mind's neuroses, it will not make you a good person, and it will not produce emotional mastery or life mastery. Many psychological problems can be distinct from existential understanding.

E) After awakening, life must go on. Boredom can still set in and alcohol could be a nice distraction for some. After all, what is there to do, really? After awakening there is no need to do anything. There is not even the need to do good or be good.

F) You have no control over anything. Whatever happens is inevitable. Alan Watts had no ability to stop anything. Whatever the universe has in store for you, is what will happen, and you are surrendered to that.

Basically, stop expecting enlightenment to make you superman or a saint, or to fix all your Earthly problems.

[blazed]

16 minutes ago, Ether said:

@Leo Gura But dont do most alcaholics drink to run away from the pain?

If Alan, awkaned why did he keep on drinking?

Neuron patterns that are firing up on repeated behaviors, sometimes because of years of bad habits.

In the same way enlightenment won't cure cancer or grow back lost limbs, it's almost like watching a biological robot at work when you self-observe.

"you can watch the body go like an old car. There goes the fender, there goes the tire, one thing after another – but it’s predictable. And then, gradually, the whole thing drops off, and consciousness joins consciousness. It is no longer in this particular environment." Jospeh Campbell.

Theres no MAGIC here, addictions need work, meditation helps with these problems, because meditation is mind training/resting,  but then you need to also take the right action.

If we create a robot with super AI intelligence, and one day it's so complex that's conscious (just like a real person or even more intelligent) and then you explain to it how its actually nothing, it doesnt exist it's just a junk of metal and programs built on top of programs that gave it is a false sense of self what will happen to the robot?

 

[Leo Gura]

@blazed

 

 

[blazed]

41 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@blazed

 

 

Scene from a movie where th guy was surrounded by robots, and genuinely didnt know if he himself was a robot anymore

@Leo Gura Ironically the same guy IS a robot in another reality

 

Edited April 22, 2018 by blazed

[petragr]

that Osho video was pretty disturbing, I used to watch Lifetime movies for hours at a time , such negative content, I do not watch stuff like that anymore ,  looking at negative disturbing  images is like eating foods with lots junk in it, in my opinion.

However good example of what can go wrong ..... 

[Prabhaker]

3 hours ago, petragr said:

However good example of what can go wrong ..... 

Nothing went wrong, we can't understand ways of an enlightened master to spread his message.

Even Jesus was not moving with respectable people of the society, rabbis, saints and priests. He was living with laborers, farmers, gardeners, fishermen, woodcutters, beggars, prostitutes, gamblers, drunkards. Jesus is crucified, because he was not fulfilling the expectations of the society.

Judas , who saw so many miracles and heard so much of the Master's teaching could ever betray him into the hands of his enemies. What happened to Judas? He was very close to Jesus.

When Jesus was crucified all the disciples escaped, they all ran away.

Only Mary Magdalene watched Jesus's crucifixion from a distance.  In ad 591, Pope Gregory I declared Mary Magdalene a prostitute.

Paul was beheaded.

Peter was crucified, upside down.

Andrew, said to have been crucified.

Thomas, died when pierced through with the spears.

Philip, arrested and cruelly put to death.

Matthew  was stabbed to death.

Bartholomew, there are various accounts of how he met his death as a martyr for the gospel.

James, was stoned and then clubbed to death.

Simon the Zealot, was killed after refusing to sacrifice to the sun god.

Matthais was the apostle chosen to replace Judas. Tradition sends him to Syria with Andrew and to death by burning.

John is the only one of the company generally thought to have died a natural death from old age.

At first, Christianity was declared illegal by the Romans, and for 300 years Christians suffered persecution. 

Do you think everything went wrong? No, Jesus succeeded in spreading his message ! 

[blazed]

@Prabhaker

I know you're a Osho fan since you quoted him a million times and you have blind faith.

As the documentary said his cult had the "eyes of a people who were under a spell".

Now I know the Netflix documentary could be potentially making Osho look bad even though I felt like it was neutral to both sides.

But there was REAL video footages and interviews with the cast and people who were involved.

•  Osho showed signs of spiritual ego, arrogance, he was a bad loser and very unconscious in my opinion when sheela exposed on him TV about "how he takes advantage of people and manipulates them" his instant reply with a very angry expression was "SHES ON DRUGS! ON HARDCORE DRUGS!" loooool, he couldn't come up with anything better, pretty pathetic, doubt she was on drug considering how well she was speaking especially not "hard drugs".
   
•  He started saying petty thing in front of everyone (caught on video) "She wanted to fuck, but I said a man should never fuck his secretary". Wtf, highly conscious being words right there, we should quote that and hang it on a wall.
   
•  Sheela his main secretary, a full devotee, who had an unhealthy obsession about him, just like the whole cult. First of all she weeded out Osho's first secretary by gossiping and bad mouthing her "I have bad feelings about her". She then was highly jealous of any females interacting with Osho, she poison Ma Prem Shunyo, etc. etc.
       
•  (All these crimes were admitted by other interviewees that were involved in the cult, Jane Stork, Philip Toelkes, etc)  Sheela also orchestrated salmonella poisoning across towns, she got Jane stork to attempt murder a political figure, she got her to inject lethal poison into Osho's Dr, she did so many corrupt things, whilst she spent so much time with an "enlightened" person, she visited and talked to Osho more than anyone
   
• The Osho cult brought in so many Homeless people just to win votes, they were not sincere and not doing it out of love and compassion and then when they realise they can't vote THEY kicked them out, there was a video of sheela saying "One wrong move and you're out now, we can't have you here". Now I get it, they were some trouble makers but they knew that before they invited them. USE and DISPOSE huh. Again highly conscious society.
   
•  They drugged all the homeless people's beers.
   
• All the political games, all the finding loop holes in the law, causing conflict, making the locals hate them, growing so rapidly that it seems like they're taking over Oregon, all this silly nonsense bullshit because they wanted to create a society of "highly conscious" people, turns out they were not all that conscious.
   
•   All the money power, more fire arm power than the whole Oregon state, all the Rolls‑Royces, jets, power game.
       
•  The way Osho tried to fly and run just before a take down, just abandon all his people and community, 4 years he didn't move. He said about Sheela "she didn’t even say bye to me, only a criminal leaves like this" Well Osho didn't say shit to his community when he tried to run, Hypooooooooocriteeeeeeeeeeee.

Moral of the story, Osho is just one regular dude, that gain popularity and enormous amount of money. He knew how to speak, he had the serpent's tongue and could throw out spiritual wisdom.

Steal all the useful guru's ideas and wisdom if you can but don't care about the guru itself, no need for worship or fan boy.

"Only human".

I think one requires a weak mind, weak personality and emotional baggage to put all their faith on another person, it is clear to me every human being on this planet, even if they were enlightened and smart only has a speck of information that is available in the universe.

For example, I think Leo is really smart, shares lots of ideas, and potentially might be enlightened, and I think Leo is a nice guy in real life (probably) like someone you wouldn't mind being friends with.

But if he starts telling people to bow down and kneel before him or has some weird ass following, I'm out, that to me is a highly unconscious group of people pedestalling something because their weak minds "need" something to pray and idolize towards.

Edited April 24, 2018 by blazed

[Prabhaker]

51 minutes ago, blazed said:

But if he starts telling people to bow down and kneel before him or has some weird ass following, I'm out

Western world has been told to keep his head high. He has been educated not to surrender in any case; it is better to die than to surrender. To bow down to a master's feet are the moments when you have put your ego aside. The ego is afraid to bow down.

Buddhist Mantra in Pali Language is

Buddham Sharanam Gacchami – I take refuge in the Buddha
Sangham Sharanam Gacchami – I take refuge in the Community
Dhammam Sharanam Gacchami – I take refuge in the Ultimate Teaching

The Bible tells us that Jesus is the Good Shepherd and that we are his sheep. 

Do you find this 'a low conscious teaching' of Buddha and Jesus ?

[blazed]

24 minutes ago, Prabhaker said:

Western world has been told to keep his head high. He has been educated not to surrender in any case; it is better to die than to surrender. To bow down to a master's feet are the moments when you have put your ego aside. The ego is afraid to bow down.

Buddhist Mantra in Pali Language is

Buddham Sharanam Gacchami – I take refuge in the Buddha
Sangham Sharanam Gacchami – I take refuge in the Community
Dhammam Sharanam Gacchami – I take refuge in the Ultimate Teaching

The Bible tells us that Jesus is the Good Shepherd and that we are his sheep. 

Do you find this 'a low conscious teaching' of Buddha and Jesus ?

The ego bowing down to what? another ego? what do you see in a guru? it's flesh and blood, and an ego cosplaying a guru.

Yes i think it is unconscious. I see no difference between putting a guru on a pedestal and worshipping him or puting a maple leaf on a pedestal and worshipping it.

The maple leaf probably won't leave you chasing after land, money, followers, finding loopholes in the law, and killing opponents because you worship it though, unlike Osho caused Sheela to do through their interaction.

The only difference in every object is the interaction caused by it.

Buddhism is a religion so it has it dogma, and so does every religion, true spirituality has no religion, it is only the self.

And all Good spiritual teachers know it is the self they are looking for, even Osho said this a few times saying I'm not your guru, etc, all the people who had a guru who had an awakening said "I realised the thing I was looking for was me".

When you worship a Guru or any object you're putting only one part of yourself onto the pedestal, tunnel visioning, and ultimately making yourself blind.

Every guru is you, everyone is you, the whole planet is you, the whole universe is you, you realise just how unconscious and stupid it is to look up to just one guru, one abstraction of yourself.

Edited April 24, 2018 by blazed

[blazed]

3 minutes ago, Outer said:

How can you know?

Are your writing coming from silence?

Sorry, I don't understand what you're trying to say?

[blazed]

15 minutes ago, Outer said:

Is your writing coming from a mind that's silent of thoughts? If not, why write?

This is a bad way to understand spirituality, only in death you will find permanent silent mind. You're experiencing a human dream right now.

Everything is me, what I know is soooo little what I dont know is everything else. What I dont know is also endless potential, If only more people admitted this.

I enter blissfulness silent peace in meditation, but I don't want to stay there, that is a resting place for the mind.

@Outer

What im trying to say is you wouldn't pick up an object in your room and say "this is IT, this is the thing I've been looking for, I will worship it as the ultimate truth".

You wouldn't look at the animal kingdom and say: find a lion, and say this one is it! this is the best lion in the world, its the fastest, strongest, and smartest lion, I will worship this lion.

So why do it with a human being? why handicap yourself?

Edited April 24, 2018 by blazed

[Leo Gura]

@Prabhaker When your followers are placing diseased beavers into a blender to pour into the local water supply to poison an entire city, I'd say something's a bit wrong

[Prabhaker]

26 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

When your followers are placing diseased beavers into a blender to pour into the local water supply to poison an entire city, I'd say something's a bit wrong

Out of 5000 followers, only few disciples betrayed him and tried to destroy commune (Rajneeshpuram).

Everyone knows that Osho was arrested and presented in US courts. Government  authorities tried to prove charges against him in every way. But they failed to prove it. 

In 1985 Sheela pleaded guilty to attempted murder and assault for her role in the  bioterror attack. She was sentenced to 20 years in federal prison and paroled after 29 months.

Muhammad and Krishna were directly responsible for many killings. Jesus was directly responsible for whipping and terrorizing money lenders. Osho was not directly responsible for bio-terror attack.

Existence work in secret ways. Judas betrayed Jesus , he was crucified, but he became Christ. Crucifixion was not a positive thing, he preached for three years but he could have preached for thirty years more.Jesus was crucified between the two thieves, he was treated as a criminal. You can see the result of thing which went terribly wrong. Almost all images and sculptures of Christ show him in great pain on the cross. The priests say that Christ suffered for our sins. It seems that crucifixion is responsible for popularity of Jesus.

We can't conclude that betrayal by some of his followers will prove to be a disaster in future. The hate against Osho has given him too much negative publicity and media coverage, otherwise he may have died unnoticed by mainstream society. 

[Leo Gura]

@Prabhaker Osho was negligent.

It's amazing how Sheela got out in 29 months on attempted assassination of government officials and bio-terrorism charges.

She got off very light.