A Buddha will always be misunderstood

[Deep]

This going to be hilarious!

One thing I find wrong about modern enlightenment teachings is: You have to remove the ego to be enlightened. I haven't come across any ancient teaching that says the ego has to be removed. If someone knows maybe they can site the source. Most people here believed what Leo told them. You don't know for sure that removing the ego is the solution. You don't know for sure that you're God. Enlightenment is just a belief on actualized.org. 

The criteria I would use to determine enlightenment is: One has to feel like God (either during meditation or 24/7). If we're God we have to feel like it, to know it. I'm not making a correlation that removing the ego will make one feel like God. If one feels like a finite being, they aren't enlightened yet. I don't even know if enlightenment is true. 

I am reading The Gospel of Ramakrishna currently. Here is a quote I like: 

“How silly! This jug is God! This cup is God! Whatever we see is God! And we too are God! Nothing could be more absurd.” Sri Ramakrishna came out of his room and gently touched him. Spellbound, he immediately perceived that everything in the world was indeed God. A new universe opened around him. Returning home in a dazed state, he found there too that the food, the plate, the eater himself, the people around him, were all God.

Swami Nikhilananda. Gospel of Sri Ramakrishna (Kindle Locations 1884-1887). Ramakrishna-Vivekananda Center of New York, Inc.. Kindle Edition.

I would only believe one is enlightened if they were able to prove it to me, like Ramakrishna was able to prove to Narendra. Maybe there is a master in some remote village who can do that. If this is true, most people in the world have a VERY long way to go to reach that level. 

I practice Raja Yoga from the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali; along with Karma Yoga. I'm not going to write out the whole technique here. I don't practice it as rigorously as a yogi because I'm not perfect. The Yoga Sutras don't mention removing the ego. It says the goal of yoga is, "citta vriddhi nirodh," which means, "stop the mind from modifications." Once the modifications stop, the witness behind the mind will be revealed. That's what Ramakrishna practiced as well.  

The Yoga Sutras outline a process to do this. They give 10 observances that one must follow to control the mind: 1. truthfulness, 2. celibacy, 3. not accepting gifts, 4. not stealing, 5. non-violence, 6. surrender to God, 7. thinking positively, 8. contentment, 9. self-development, and 10. renunciation. These 10 observances only make the 1st limb, there are 8 limbs in total. 

In modern times, these behaviors can be seen as anti-social, narcissistic, snobby, and rude. Other people would be like, "Why the fuck isn't this guy doing what we're doing?" "There must be something wrong with him." God wants to become completely deluded in the Dark Ages. That's why Osho says a Buddha will always be misunderstood: 

 

[Saumaya]

@Deep

Don't think you are somehow special that you're into enlightenment.

Also an enlightened person wouldn't care about proving anything.

The ego is not removed it is transcended in enlightenment.

First become enlightened then set a criteria to judge other people, not by other people's measures.

Edited February 21, 2018 by Saumaya

[Ether]

@Deep Nobody cant EVER. EVER. Prove they are enlightened. why?

 

Because, we cant go inside another one's mind and see if they are thinking or not.

We cant go into their body and see if they feeling lasting happiness, peace, fulfileness, completion, wholeness.

 

Even if you got the truest teachings ever, that still doesnt mean you awakened because you cant do those two things.

[Shanmugam]

@Deep Question.. Why are you seeking enlightenment? What do you think it is going to do for you?

[Deep]

21 minutes ago, Saumaya said:

@Deep

Don't think you are somehow special that you're into enlightenment.

I don't think I'm special and I'm not into enlightenment. 

 

22 minutes ago, Saumaya said:

@Deep

Also an enlightened person wouldn't care about proving anything.

Swami Vivekananda went around asking people "Have you seen God?" Most people were unable to answer that question except for Ramakrishna. He was searching for a true master and found him. It's not about proof, it's just what happened. 

11 minutes ago, Shanmugam said:

@Deep Question.. Why are you seeking enlightenment? What do you think it is going to do for you?

I'm not really seeking enlightenment. I'm just messing around because I have a lot of free time. I made a mistake in the past. I dropped out of college because I wanted to start a business. The business idea is not fruitful so I'll have to finish my degree and get a job. Eventually I'll leave this forum. 

 

[Saumaya]

@Deep Deep...Deep

[Monkey-man]

Buddha didn't remove his ego. His ego stayed with him. because you can't remove something that doesn't exist. That was the reason he escaped life. After enlightenment he still constantly went to Nirvana because life around didn't become nice. His state of being became nice, while life around him still didn't look nice to him. Its still was full of suffering and it affected his being. His sickness when he was old affected his being. Pain wasn't his but it is still being felt. Buddha has stopped suffering when he escaped life, not when he became enlightened. Hello, recall yourself whats Buddhism is initially about, its not about life or god or happiness or anything like that. Its about escape from the whole thing. Because Buddha talked about all kinds of suffering including physical and suffering that he felt from others, not just self-created. Truth is ego doesn't exist, its about god vs devil, while ego is hero or your being or zero (thats why it doesn't exist) or moving with accordance to intuitive flow of life, heart or soul and giving up your personal mind-created desires VS actions based on personal desires. First leads to harmony, second to chaos. Both has suffering, but first is sufferings that are authentic and necessary to grow, eventually they are not being your sufferings but just sufferings, and second are made-up and unnecessary and 'your' sufferings. First is life, pro-evolutionary and more order created from the chaos, less unknown and second is destruction of life, chaos, anti-evolutionary. Buddha didn't follow devil or god, he just run away from the whole thing.

That's why people here are being deluded when they think that life is about doing whatever fak their mind desires. LOL nothing is further from the truth. Its about giving up your control to heart or unknown, from known desires, instincts, compulsions, thoughts to unknown, and it goes beyond enlightenment, it never ends.

 

Edited February 21, 2018 by Monkey-man

[Deep]

1 hour ago, Ether said:

@Deep Nobody cant EVER. EVER. Prove they are enlightened. why?

That's a huge assumption. You don't know that. 

@Saumaya Do you think what I said was arrogant? 

[Ether]

@Deep If you read what I said, maybe youd understand

[Deep]

1 hour ago, Shanmugam said:

@Deep Question.. Why are you seeking enlightenment? What do you think it is going to do for you?

Technically everyone is moving towards God. Most people just take a detour. I don't have any choice in seeking enlightenment or not seeking. I think Karma yoga is the most natural thing. lol 

12 minutes ago, Monkey-man said:

That's why people here are being deluded when they think that life is about doing whatever fak their mind desires. LOL nothing is further from the truth. Its about giving up your control to heart, and it goes beyond enlightenment, it never ends.

There has to be control in the beginning right? 

[Deep]

@Ether I read what you said but I think it's wrong. Enlightened people can influence other people's mind because they're in touch with consciousness. Consciousness is an infinite field. I don't know but I'm open to that. You don't seem open to it. 

[Saumaya]

2 hours ago, Deep said:

@Ether I read what you said but I think it's wrong. Enlightened people can influence other people's mind because they're in touch with consciousness. Consciousness is an infinite field. I don't know but I'm open to that. You don't seem open to it. 

You re probably reading bunch of bs imo but hey!.. Dont let me discourage you i guess

[Shanmugam]

@Deep The problem with enlightenment is that that there is too much information available, and 95% of them are myths..Don't make assumptions about it yet based on what you have read... 

[Key Elements]

I think there are a few things that have not been explained too deeply -- karma, life is a school, and everything is interconnected in this maya. All these things do relate to seeking enlightenment. Meditation is not the center stage. Psychedelics is only "meditation on steroids." Will get you there faster, and perhaps not. I believe Leo said this. 

However, it gets even more confusing once you try to explain it.

[Deep]

27 minutes ago, Saumaya said:

You re probably reading bunch of bs imo but hey!.. Dont let me discourage you i guess

Actually, it's the only book I've read about a yogi. It might be too radical for you. Are you saying Ramakrishna wasn't enlightened? 

24 minutes ago, Shanmugam said:

@Deep The problem with enlightenment is that that there is too much information available, and 95% of them are myths..Don't make assumptions about it yet based on what you have read... 

I would say 99% of information on enlightenment is a myth, but this is the 1% that is true. I've also heard people had experiences in Ramana Maharshi's presence. I haven't read books about him yet. My intention behind this post is: if you want to experience yourself as God, do it. If other people believe or disbelieve it doesn't matter. 

 

[Deep]

@Key Elements I don't really know much about karma. 

[Saumaya]

4 minutes ago, Deep said:

Actually, it's the only book I've read about a yogi. It might be too radical for you. Are you saying Ramakrishna wasn't enlightened

Yes being enlightened makes everything you say true. Youre right man

[Shanmugam]

@Deep I am not saying Ramakrishna was not enlightened. I am saying your conclusion about enlightenment is wrong..

Think about the following statements:

1) Mark is enlightened

2) Mark is six foot tall.

3) therefore, all enlightened people are six foot tall..

 

[Deep]

@Shanmugam My conclusion about enlightenment is: we have to experience ourselves as God to know that we are. That's all! I know all enlightened people don't share the same characteristics. 

Edited February 22, 2018 by Deep

[Shanmugam]

@Deep i have read Ramakrishna quite extensively.. He is one of a kind. If you put a coin under Ramakrishna's bed, he will shout in pain. But you won't see the use with Ramana Maharishi... There are lots of reasons why people feel peace and go through epiphany in the presence of some one who is enlightened.. Too many factors are there.. One of them is this: since they are completely free of a sense of self, you will see a tranquility on their face and eyes.. Their talk can call your mind. Sometimes it can cause an epiphany too..