The mary and jane metaphor suggest solipsism?

[MarkusSweden]

2 minutes ago, Saumaya said:

@MarkusSweden There is no guarantee that it is a shared dream. You can only assume it is so.

No guarantee, but if I'm wrong, then we have to go with solipsism, and that's madness! 

And you can't find any trustworthy teacher that not share my assumption that the waking state is a SHARED dream.

Therefore, my question to Leo is legit. 

[Saumaya]

1 minute ago, MarkusSweden said:

No guarantee, but if I'm wrong, then we have to go with solipsism, and that's madness! 

And you can't find any trustworthy teacher that not share my assumption that the waking state is a SHARED dream.

Therefore, my question to Leo is legit. 

There no right or wrong on this. These matters are unknowable. I suggest you don't spend any more time on this and think it from your own experience rather than asking Leo. Even you don't exist so solipsism is kind of negated but the basic gist remains the same.

[Faceless]

Makes sense that through duality and fragmentation ‘thought’ that solipsism would seem so. 

Thought being a fragment of the whole can not see the whole. The self is blind to anything beyond itself. The center is a function that serves a purpose. 

Fragmentation can never grasp anything other than itself. Fragmentation inevitably leads to further fragmentation. 

From here one would have to ask what is an action that is whole that can see/comprehend  the whole of something such as duality/fragmentation holistically? 

Has anyone gone into this before?

Kinda complex but interesting. 

[Saumaya]

@Faceless Woah that just went over my head.  i guess I am finally starting to see what is headleassness.

[Faceless]

8 minutes ago, Saumaya said:

@Faceless Woah that just went over my head.  i guess I am finally starting to see what is headleassness.

Lol ? 

I like to party lol 

I like to ask questions to myself like that. It goes with what you said though. You can not know the unknowable. ?

the question is what can? 

Edited February 24, 2018 by Faceless

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, MarkusSweden said:

@Leo Gura The whole point of this thread was to shred some light on one aspect that I think you and Rupert Spira don't give a fair amount of attention to..

In your Dream episode two weeks ago(which I loved) as well as in all the Spira episodes when he talks about the waking state dream and compare it to conventional dreams at night.

Both of you don't highlight enough that the waking state dream is a SHARED dream, whereas the conventional dreams at night are private and happens only to ONE mind, not to several billion minds as this waking state dream. 

I can't understand why we don't talk more about this fact.

For example, lets say you do some "important" science for the world and humanity in this waking state dream, and then you wake up, laughing that it was just a dream. All of your "important" science had no importance what so ever, except the enjoying part of doing it, since enjoying experiences are always valuable, but your science had no importance as such, since it was just a dream.

However, that's only true from your perspective since you're awake from this waking state dream. But seven billion other minds are still dreaming the waking state dream, and to them your science might have a HUGE impact and importance. 

Whereas in a dream at night, if you do science, it had no importance what so ever after you wake up, since you were the only one having that particular dream. 

I'm almost prepared to argue that the waking state dream can be reclaimed as REAL reality again due to the fact that it's a SHARED dream, with so many minds involved in it. 

You see what I'm saying here Leo? 

All of your best reasoning and ruminations are futile because they are happening within the dream.

Break the dream first, then see if there's anything left to ruminate about (there won't be).

When we speak of dreams, we are giving you a helpful analogy. Don't abuse the analogy. Enlightenment is LIKE waking up from a dream. Not identical to it in every way. Obviously, as then it wouldn't be enlightenment but the ordinary waking up you do every morning.

Just imagine that you can awaken from your current life. That's all we're saying. That is possible. So now go do it. Analyzing the analogy to death will only get you further stuck in the dream. The analogy is taking place within your dream. It is a pointer to something BEYOND.