Why is Leo setting the bar low?

[How to be wise]

In his latest video, Leo said the goal is to be in no-mind for most of the day. But Sri Sri Ravi Shankar said that he usually spends days and weeks on end without a single thought. He has remained in a constant state of ecstasy and bliss for 10 or 15 years. He sleeps less than 3 hours a day, because he controls his energies so well. He understands ‘truth’ 100%. He said that if he wanted, he could sit in one seat and stay there for the rest of his life, of course with his biological needs being provided. Compare that with what Leo has as a self actualized vision. It’s nowhere near. 

[Nahm]

@How to be wise Shanker is self, no seeker. Leo is dealing with general population seekers. We can all set our own bars too of course, and Leo’s half his age btw. 

[How to be wise]

@Nahm Sri Sri was in his twenties when he gained those ‘abilities’. Leo always says that becoming a sage takes long decades. But somehow those yogis do it very quickly.

Edited January 27, 2018 by How to be wise

[Joseph Maynor]

The more you detach from conceptualizations, the less monkey-mind the Ego will generate over time.  Enlightenment is a life long practice.  

Edited January 27, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Nahm]

@How to be wise Psychedelics come to mind. Other than that, I’m at a loss.

[Elisabeth]

Leo's got the bar set high on conceptual understanding. He wants to be able to provide great personalized advice to pretty much anyone. Those two goals clash a bit. 

Obviously, teachers have different strengths. 

Edited January 27, 2018 by Elisabeth

[Shin]

1 hour ago, How to be wise said:

In his latest video, Leo said the goal is to be in no-mind for most of the day. But Sri Sri Ravi Shankar said that he usually spends days and weeks on end without a single thought. He has remained in a constant state of ecstasy and bliss for 10 or 15 years. He sleeps less than 3 hours a day, because he controls his energies so well. He understands ‘truth’ 100%. He said that if he wanted, he could sit in one seat and stay there for the rest of his life, of course with his biological needs being provided. Compare that with what Leo has as a self actualized vision. It’s nowhere near. 

Seems like quite an ego dream instead of a selfless adventure into the unknown.

[Shanmugam]

43 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

  Enlightenment is a life long practice.  

What??? 

[Joseph Maynor]

25 minutes ago, Shanmugam said:

What??? 

This might be the biggest area of disagreement in this work -- Is Enlightenment something that proceeds by degrees or not?  I argue that reality doesn't change but Ego-dissolution is something that takes a course of time to accomplish.  This is why there's the paradox that one must both seek and not seek Enlightenment.  The only way that you’re gonna get detachment is if the Mind realizes that the paradigms that it's clinging to are not the truth.  That takes some work to achieve.  Not just meditation and self-inquiry – but finding counter-theories to all your paradigms so the Mind realizes that those paradigms are false and then releases them.  You don’t release anything – the Mind has to.  Because we have so much cultural-conditioning, you're gonna have a shallow Enlightenment if you don't do this theoretical work.  This is where Leo's work is very on point and needed.

Edited January 27, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Shanmugam]

@Joseph Maynor I remember a thread started by you where you asked why people think of enlightenment as binary..

Let me tell you.. Enlightenment is binary.. either one can be enlightened or not enlightened. But that doesn't mean enlightenment is the end, it is a new beginning. It is the end of the life as a seeker and the end of the sense of lack or incompleteness.. But it is a beginning of a new life which deepens forever. That is why enlightenment is sometimes called as a rebirth. Also, there is no question that it takes time to get enlightened. It does take time. I am also aware of the teachings which say that enlightenment doesn't require time, but it is just a pointer. It is only said to make sure that people don't think of enlightenment as something that has to be gained.

[Leo Gura]

5 hours ago, How to be wise said:

In his latest video, Leo said the goal is to be in no-mind for most of the day. But Sri Sri Ravi Shankar said that he usually spends days and weeks on end without a single thought. He has remained in a constant state of ecstasy and bliss for 10 or 15 years. He sleeps less than 3 hours a day, because he controls his energies so well. He understands ‘truth’ 100%. He said that if he wanted, he could sit in one seat and stay there for the rest of his life, of course with his biological needs being provided. Compare that with what Leo has as a self actualized vision. It’s nowhere near. 

Hehehe....

That's like going to a channel that teaches fitness advice for ordinary people and asking, "But what about Arnold Schwarzenegger? Why not be like him? He can squat 700 lbs! Why tell people to squat 200 lbs? It's nowhere near!"

Dude... most people can't even stop playing video games or put down their smart phone. Forget about enlightenment.

Ravi Shankar is a once-in-a-generation individual. You ain't ever gonna be at his level. And if you are, you certainly ain't gonna do it watching YouTube videos or hanging out on this forum. You should be living in a cave and meditating 24/7. You are talking about a COMPLETE surrender of your life. Who is prepared to do that?

99% of people will not reach the bar of Actualized.org. If you're in the 1% who outgrows Actualized.org, then by all means go do it.

[Joseph Maynor]

Let me give another application to the need to seek and not seek paradox:

A newbie like me who lives under the Ego paradigm grasps the same reality as Shankar.  The only difference is that he has done more work detaching from the Ego.  But if Ego is a feature of your reality, then that is reality!  This is why Enlightenment is both unsought and sought.   Reality doesn't change.  What changes is your identification with it.  But to the extent that Ego is a feature of reality -- then Ego is contained within reality too!  This is kinda hard to get across. 

Videos on point to watch:

 

Edited January 28, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Speedscarlet]

@Joseph Maynor @Leo Gura 99% of people in this forum will not reach the actualized.org bar. We should announce that don’t you think?

Edited January 29, 2018 by Speedscarlet

[YaNanNallari]

@Speedscarlet Seems trivial to me to announce that. It's quite directly said already anyways in his videos

[Speedscarlet]

@YaNanNallari you are one of the 99%. If you read Leo’s post he said that you won’t become like Sri Sri Ravi Shankar whilst hanging out on this forum.

[egoless]

On 1/27/2018 at 11:25 PM, Shanmugam said:

@Joseph Maynor I remember a thread started by you where you asked why people think of enlightenment as binary..

Let me tell you.. Enlightenment is binary.. either one can be enlightened or not enlightened. But that doesn't mean enlightenment is the end, it is a new beginning. It is the end of the life as a seeker and the end of the sense of lack or incompleteness.. But it is a beginning of a new life which deepens forever. That is why enlightenment is sometimes called as a rebirth. Also, there is no question that it takes time to get enlightened. It does take time. I am also aware of the teachings which say that enlightenment doesn't require time, but it is just a pointer. It is only said to make sure that people don't think of enlightenment as something that has to be gained.

@Joseph Maynor I definitely agree to shanmu's point. Enlightenment happens one time. What you are refering to is what he said "But it is a beginning of a new life which deepens forever". Rupert Spira refers to it as post awakening sadhana. I really encourage you to follow Rupert when you feel stuck. 

 

[Forestluv]

On 1/27/2018 at 3:27 PM, How to be wise said:

He has remained in a constant state of ecstasy and bliss for 10 or 15 years. 

And how is that reflective of someone's "bar height"?

Would someone who became enlightened while being constantly tortured in prison for 10 or 15 years be at a "higher" or "lower" bar?

[Forestluv]

On 1/27/2018 at 5:25 PM, Shanmugam said:

@Joseph Maynor Enlightenment is binary.. either one can be enlightened or not enlightened. 

What metric would you use to determine that 90% enlightenment cannot exist?

[Shin]

If enlightenment is binary, why can i feel that reality is a dream and still not actually see it ?

Why can i see the soul of a tree, the sky, and basically everything, and still not see it as me ?

Why can I be conscious that the voice in my head is just thoughts but still identifying to it somehow ?

It's not an on/off switch, otherwise all of the above would be impossible.

[Shanmugam]

@Serotoninluv  @Shin Enlightenment is losing the sense of a separate self once and for all.. But there may be progress in terms of how much a person has understood certain things and is aware of his own mind. There is progress in terms of how much conditioning has been lost and how deep has his awareness penetrated through. 

From 2002 to 2014, there were 12 years of my life as a seeker. I was a seeker even before 2002, trying out all kinds of meditations and techniques without really understanding what I needed. But after 2002, I understood what spiritual path is really about and got my first glimpse too. Over the next 12 years, my understanding deepened, my awareness increased, I stayed for many hours in the state of flow every day and I was becoming more and more peaceful. I was also getting disidentified with my past. I was exploring various gurus and trying to understand what I am supposed to do. But only in 2012, duality completely disappeared. It was a deepening of awareness that continued for about 2-3 months in May, June and July 2014. It was only in July 2014, there was a complete destruction of separation(duality).  It was from then that I started to live in a complete oneness, without a sense of an 'other'.  Now I can understand very clearly that a person either lives in duality or not. 

In fact, getting enlightened is really about finding out what enlightenment is. Only after enlightenment, the person really understands what it is about because there is a clear difference between being enlightened and not being enlightened. Enlightenment is the end of the feeling of lack or incompleteness. You now know that there is nothing to achieve to make yourself complete because you are already complete.

Edited January 29, 2018 by Shanmugam