Reality grants everything

[DocHoliday]

Everything happens as it must happen. Reality is absolutely infinite, meaning everything that could happen, will happen at some point (in consciousness). That's what Leo tried to get across to you with his analogy of the infinte block of sand in which everything that could ever be shaped out of it, is in a sense already there. The same goes for his blog-video with the sheet of paper and the (adorable) little paper-figures. To grasp this is the ultimate proof for the fact that you don't have free will and just why God permits "evil" to occur - it just couldn't be any other way, you see? So, to apply this in some practical way to your life, whenever you wonder why you feel so stuck in your life or why you can't progress on your spiritual path and just why you seemingly can't achieve enlightenment or why bad things happen to you and why there are terrorists and why there are wars and all sorts of crimes commited against our own human kind and why we destroy our planet and just why life tends to play out for you as it does - remember that reality grants everything and that everything happens just as it has to happen. THIS IS IT FOLKS! It's the ultimate act of surrender, the final stage of complete ego-death - the moment when you truly realise that there is just absolutely no control whatsoever over anything that is or that happens. This is also what is meant by some other post floating around here titled "All mystics agree on this one thing...", which is that: "all is well". It's precisely for this exact reason that  e v e r y t h i n g   h a p p e n s   a s   i t   h a s   t o . You just can't escape it, you see? Every remaining resistance against this is remaining ego, is remaining self-deception, is remaining unnecessary suffering. To truly embrace this fact is what will make you flow with life in perfect union and harmony. This is in it's essence to not give a fuck, at all. You simply don't care about the outcome anymore - the total letting-go of absolutely everything. You will no longer care about whether you will achieve enlightenment or not, you won't care about the achievement of other "higher states of consciousness", you will no longer care about life or death, a t   a l l . You won't even care about the fact that you don't care. You simply let life happen as it happens by allowing everything. You are the super-conductor for life, as pure as it can be. I'd propose to you to contemplate this for a while.

Edited January 18, 2018 by DocHoliday

[star ark]

I believe collectively we do have free will but the individual can only react. For example Martin Luther King was only reacting to what was happening around him and the collective consciousness was ready to apply its free will and make a change. 

[SOUL]

You are just so full of beliefs....

[Jamie Universe]

7 minutes ago, SOUL said:

You are just so full of beliefs....

lol thinking the same thing

[Joseph Maynor]

3 hours ago, DocHoliday said:

Everything happens as it must happen. Reality is absolutely infinite, meaning everything that could happen, will happen at some point in "time". That's what Leo tried to get across to you with his analogy of the infinte block of sand in which everything that could ever be shaped out of it, is in a sense already there. The same goes for his blog-video with the sheet of paper and the (adorable) little paper-figures. To grasp this is the ultimate proof for the fact that you don't have free will and just why God permits "evil" to occur - it just couldn't be any other way, you see? So, to apply this in some practical way to your life, whenever you wonder why you feel so stuck in your life or why you can't progress on your spiritual path and just why you seemingly can't achieve enlightenment or why bad things happen to you and why there are terrorists and why there are wars and all sorts of crimes commited against our own human kind and why we destroy our planet and just why life tends to play out for you as it does - remember that reality grants everything and that everything happens just as it has to happen. THIS IS IT FOLKS! It's the ultimate act of surrender, the final stage of complete ego-death - the moment when you truly realise that there is just absolutely no control whatsoever over anything that is or that happens. This is also what is meant by some other post floating around here titled "All mystics agree on this one thing...", which is that: "all is well". It's precisely for this exact reason that  e v e r y t h i n g   h a p p e n s   a s   i t   h a s   t o . You just can't escape it, you see? Every remaining resistance against this is remaining ego, is remaining self-deception, is remaining unnecessary suffering. To truly embrace this fact is what will make you flow with life in perfect union and harmony. This is in it's essence to not give a fuck, at all. You simply don't care about the outcome anymore - the total letting-go of absolutely everything. You will no longer care about whether you will achieve enlightenment or not, you won't care about the achievement of other "higher states of consciousness", you will no longer care about life or death, a t   a l l . You won't even care about the fact that you don't care. You simply let life happen as it happens by allowing everything. You are the super-conductor for life, as pure as it can be. I'd propose to you to contemplate this for a while.

Awareness alone is curative.   We say this, but we don't really practice it.  I have learned to love practicing it.  Practice mindful awareness.  

Edited January 18, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Joseph Maynor]

8 minutes ago, Jamie Universe said:

lol thinking the same thing

Everybody goes through that stage.  I know I did too.  You gotta fill up your cup before you can empty it.  And people have different sized cups.  Oftentimes thinkers like me have huge cups.  This means that Enlightenment takes a long time because a lot of beliefs have to be crunched to satisfy an overly sticky Mind.  

Edited January 18, 2018 by Joseph Maynor

[Guest thesmileyone]

The sand thing, this is because everything is part of the same thing. Consciousness.

Ie the sand, the you observing it, the planet the sand is on and the universe that all 3 of them are in, are all part of the same thing. And that thing is infinite.

 

Quote

. This is in it's essence to not give a fuck, at all. You simply don't care about the outcome anymore - the total letting-go of absolutely everything. You will no longer care about whether you will achieve enlightenment or not, you won't care about the achievement of other "higher states of consciousness", you will no longer care about life or death, a t   a l l . You won't even care about the fact that you don't care. You simply let life happen as it happens by allowing everything. You are the super-conductor for life, as pure as it can be

Well, kinda. But there is still a you. And you still have will. Otherwise you fall into the trap of nhillisism because you think there is no point to life.

There is no you seperate to what is, there is just a you that is part of what is, with free will to do what you like.

[star ark]

1 hour ago, SOUL said:

You are just so full of beliefs....

Well just by virtue of saying "I believe" says I understand others do not. I don't say I know and that is why I say "I believe", it actually implies possibility of being wrong to me

[SOUL]

@star ark  Oh, I wasn't replying to you but yea if you believe it was..... you, too! Hehe

[DocHoliday]

I know that replying to this is kind of equivalent to beating a dead horse, but I'm going to do so anyway. You just don't understand what I'm saying here, that's why I was urging you to contemplate it for a while. In a sense my post was the most redundant post anybody could ever make because in it's essence it didn't really say anything. "You dont even care about the fact that you don't care", means what..? Exactly, you do care from time to time because it so irrelevant to you whether you do so or not. From time to time you do care about enlightenment and higher states of consciousness because, why not? You care about it because you think you can get something out of it, you think it will make your life better in some way and you think it will give you a one-up on everybody else who isn't enlightened, for what other reason would you do it? The pursuit of enlightenment and "higher consciousness" is one of the most egoic endeavours one could undertake. This is why when you simply don't care anymore whether you care or don't care, that is the point of true liberation. It just doesn't matter what you do or don't do because "life doesn't go anywhere". In that sense, @thesmileyone nihilism is what this will leave you with, but it's essentially nihilism taken to 110%, in the sense that all the negative connotations of nihilsim disappear and get converted in their counterpart: pure positivity. Yes, life is absolutely meaningless, yes, there is no point to life whatsoever, yes, it doesn't matter whether you shoot yourself right now or not, but, since we can realize that nothing at all matters, we might just as well care about things and take this game of life seriously. Taking it seriously is part of the game, but you have to come to terms with the fact that in the end, it just doesn't matter. The universe doesn't care about your enlightenment, it doesn't make you any differnt than the craziest, highly neurotic mass-murderer you could find. 

7 hours ago, SOUL said:

You are just so full of beliefs....

@SOUL So what? Whether you think that I am full of beliefs or not, does that change anything? And by the way, how could the fact that "everything is as it is" and "everything happens as it must happen" be a belief? It is the most basic and fundamental observation one could come up with (hint to you @Joseph Maynor , you master-observer of the universe:P), because if it would be a belief, there'd have to be a counter-belief to it to contrast it against, saying "everything does not happen as it must happen" and "everything is not as it is". For things to not happen as they must happen, there would need to be a plan accordingly to which "everything must happen" in the first place, thus, this plan is essentially represented by your ego and your desire to manipulate and warp reality accoringly to your preferred paradigm of the world. So, when you say that everything is in its essence perfect as it is, nobody gets offended or hurt by that, should they truly realise it for themselves. Reality just can't play out in any other way than it does. Every choice you make and every decision of yours is essentially already there, that is to say, it is predestined to some extent. The notion of free will therefore only occurs by the fact that reality is in it's essence absolutely infinite. Every choice you make and every decision of yours is essentially already there. @Mighty Mouse You've said it yourself there already.  "Nothing as in without appearance." Yes, therefore it can take on

10 hours ago, Mighty Mouse said:

I must say, Leo's video about absolute infinity is total nonsense. I don't know what he "glimpsed" with his psychedelics, but no appearance has any objective existence whatsoever. When an appearance does not appear, it's not anywhere. So adding them all together doesn't actually amount to anything. No more than adding up all images amounts to a mirror.

Nor does adding up countless finitudes ever amount to infinity, any more than adding up countless jail cells amounts to freedom.

All the mind can do is think in terms of appearance, as though they objectively existed, so that's what it will do when trying to think about the absolute. But the absolute can not be described in terms of appearance, so it can't be described at all, except in terms of what it's not. It's not anything. There's nothing mysterious or mystical about it, it's just void. Nothing, as in without appearance. But everything, as in that which actually exists, irrespective of appearances.

The absolute/void is that which exists and the source of all appearance. The relative/appearance only appears to exist, just like images in a mirror. Existence is nondual, appearance is dual.

any appearance it wants to take on - its possibilities of appearance are infinite. How could it be otherwise? "Nor does adding up countless finitudes ever amount to infinity" -> it's not necessarily about the adding up of it, it's about the mere possibility for the existence of finitudes and that the only possible way for finitudes to exist in the first place, is that they must be derived from the absolute infinite, that is by its nature boundless and includes all finitudes. You see, realitiy is so absolutely infinite that there can never exist anything "outside" of it, since that would make it finite and it would simply "break reality" - it's as if there'd be an "ERROR 404: universe.exe stopped working".

[SOUL]

6 hours ago, DocHoliday said:

how could the fact that "everything is as it is" and "everything happens as it must happen" be a belief?

Those two beliefs aren't the same.

The first is very close to the genuine definition of belief itself which is 'accepting that something exists or trust in someone/something'. So we are just accepting it, by definition it doesn't necessarily imply any interpretation of what exists that we are accepting. We can have very few ideas, concepts, beliefs, explanations and interpretations or very many of them and our belief in them doesn't make them true or exist, just that we believe they do., we accept/trust they do in our own mind.

That first one also doesn't imply a necessity of things as they are, just that it is as it is and it also doesn't imply we have no input or influence in things as they are. The second one says everything "must" happen as they do which says a requirement to happen, that there is no other potential way for it to happen. Of course if the universe is of infinite potential as you also suggest in your opening post then that second belief is an inaccurate reflection of what really is because it says potential restricting "must happen".

Although, it explains why you then believe a very "no control" belief paradigm in thinking that we have no freedom to willfully intend anything other than what "must happen". Yet again, if the universe is infinite then our ability to have the freedom to willfully intend is a potential that can be....so "must" be? Hm? The universe just doesn't "must happen" to produce musicians, people willfully intend to make instruments, learn to play them and do play, without willful intention there would be no music.

So, yes, 'accepting what exists' is a basic belief and a fundamental observation as you suggest, yet, the complex belief paradigm that may spread from the "must happen" can be a spider web of "why's" that could entrap someone into feeding the identity. Our ego wants everyone else's ego to surrender to it's own belief paradigm because it needs to be validated just as it seeks our own belief in it's construct to be empowered.

Yes, this just may be my own perspective, experience and fundamental observation so you don't have to believe a word of it, there is no must requirement.

 

Edited January 18, 2018 by SOUL

[Dodo]

18 hours ago, DocHoliday said:

Everything happens as it must happen. Reality is absolutely infinite, meaning everything that could happen, will happen at some point (in consciousness). That's what Leo tried to get across to you with his analogy of the infinte block of sand in which everything that could ever be shaped out of it, is in a sense already there. The same goes for his blog-video with the sheet of paper and the (adorable) little paper-figures. To grasp this is the ultimate proof for the fact that you don't have free will and just why God permits "evil" to occur - it just couldn't be any other way, you see? So, to apply this in some practical way to your life, whenever you wonder why you feel so stuck in your life or why you can't progress on your spiritual path and just why you seemingly can't achieve enlightenment or why bad things happen to you and why there are terrorists and why there are wars and all sorts of crimes commited against our own human kind and why we destroy our planet and just why life tends to play out for you as it does - remember that reality grants everything and that everything happens just as it has to happen. THIS IS IT FOLKS! It's the ultimate act of surrender, the final stage of complete ego-death - the moment when you truly realise that there is just absolutely no control whatsoever over anything that is or that happens. This is also what is meant by some other post floating around here titled "All mystics agree on this one thing...", which is that: "all is well". It's precisely for this exact reason that  e v e r y t h i n g   h a p p e n s   a s   i t   h a s   t o . You just can't escape it, you see? Every remaining resistance against this is remaining ego, is remaining self-deception, is remaining unnecessary suffering. To truly embrace this fact is what will make you flow with life in perfect union and harmony. This is in it's essence to not give a fuck, at all. You simply don't care about the outcome anymore - the total letting-go of absolutely everything. You will no longer care about whether you will achieve enlightenment or not, you won't care about the achievement of other "higher states of consciousness", you will no longer care about life or death, a t   a l l . You won't even care about the fact that you don't care. You simply let life happen as it happens by allowing everything. You are the super-conductor for life, as pure as it can be. I'd propose to you to contemplate this for a while.

This doesn't tell us about free will. What if the very mechanism by which infinity is ever growing is free will itself.

For example, right now you have an uncountable amount of actions you can make. Me also. Just between the two of us deciding to do something spontaneous at the same moment, we make an iteration of reality which has never existed before, adding one more possibility to infinity.

Look at infinity as something ever growing in all directions. It's not something set in stone.

All possibilities do not already exist, otherwise they would be a finite number. They need to be increasing exponentially. 

Do you get my line of reasoning? 

[egoless]

@Dodo who makes the action. You?  

Think again.

and yes there is infinite freedom but you don’t exist and you don’t have free will. It just seems to you so. Ilussion. Nice ilussion though...  

Edited January 18, 2018 by egoless

[Faceless]

Illusion

somthing that u play with lol

[Dodo]

9 minutes ago, egoless said:

@Dodo who makes the action. You?  

Think again.

Doesn't matter if we call it me or God ultimately. There is a touch of free will. Depending on your point of view and conditioning. 

Robots are incapable of acting spontaneously, being creative and so on. Those are God qualities,  consciousness qualities. Qualities of being effortlessly self aware. 

The problem with talking about no free will is that it looks as though we are simply biological robots. Humans are not just biological robots. There is also awareness, which is beyond this world. That is a major part of what a human is.

Such awareness cannot be developed in time - robots cannot be aware in the sense we are. Robots dont have free will. We do, this is our God quality. 

We are helping infinity grow by making microscopic changes in the big picture. Those changes in my view are fresh and new. We aren't living something that has been lived before is what I'm trying to communicate. We're infinity's little helper.

Edited January 18, 2018 by Dodo

[egoless]

@Dodo you are missing some of the critical points in your reasoning. 

1) there is no time, therefore everything is already “there”. Infinity exists now.

2) If you have experienced the nonduality of existence you would know that essentially and existentially there is no distinction between forms of manifestation. Word human is artificially created word of distinction.

3) there is absolutely no choice. There is only the illusion of choice. Which ultimately comes from one source.

So if you really understand the non dual nature of existence you would stop arguing about anything. Because ultimately no choice and choice are the same. It’s all about perspectives...

Edited January 18, 2018 by egoless

[Dodo]

6 minutes ago, egoless said:

@Dodo you are missing some of the critical points in your reasoning. 

1) there is no time, therefore everything is already “there”. Infinity exists now.

2) If you have experienced the nonduality of existence you would know that essentially and existentially there is no distinction between forms of manifestation. Word human is artificially created word of distinction.

3) there is absolutely no choice. There is only the illusion of choice. Which ultimately comes from one source.

So if you really understand the non dual nature of existence you would stop arguing about anything. Because ultimately no choice and choice are the same. It’s all about perspectives...

I'm not really arguing. Im offering exactly what you said with the last statement. The other side of the coin. 

You are arguing for the other side presenting it as ultimate? I guess me too! Doesn't matter. That's what is. Or it does matter, because that's what is. Pick your poison. Who picks tho..

[DocHoliday]

I realise that language is indeed a tricky and difficult tool to use in order to describe what I mean/meant here. There are certainly numerous valid and totally justified points of reasoning from all of you guys. 

2 hours ago, SOUL said:

Those two beliefs aren't the same.

The first is very close to the genuine definition of belief itself which is 'accepting that something exists or trust in someone/something'. So we are just accepting it, by definition it doesn't necessarily imply any interpretation of what exists that we are accepting. We can have very few ideas, concepts, beliefs, explanations and interpretations or very many of them and our belief in them doesn't make them true or exist, just that we believe they do., we accept/trust they do in our own mind.

That first one also doesn't imply a necessity of things as they are, just that it is as it is and it also doesn't imply we have no input or influence in things as they are. The second one says everything "must" happen as they do which says a requirement to happen, that there is no other potential way for it to happen. Of course if the universe is of infinite potential as you also suggest in your opening post then that second belief is an inaccurate reflection of what really is because it says potential restricting "must happen".

Although, it explains why you then believe a very "no control" belief paradigm in thinking that we have no freedom to willfully intend anything other than what "must happen". Yet again, if the universe is infinite then our ability to have the freedom to willfully intend is a potential that can be....so "must" be? Hm? The universe just doesn't "must happen" to produce musicians, people willfully intend to make instruments, learn to play them and do play, without willful intention there would be no music.

So, yes, 'accepting what exists' is a basic belief and a fundamental observation as you suggest, yet, the complex belief paradigm that may spread from the "must happen" can be a spider web of "why's" that could entrap someone into feeding the identity. Our ego wants everyone else's ego to surrender to it's own belief paradigm because it needs to be validated just as it seeks our own belief in it's construct to be empowered.

Yes, this just may be my own perspective, experience and fundamental observation so you don't have to believe a word of it, there is no must requirement.

 

What other way of things happening could there ever be? Surely, you could also say "everything happens as it can happen", but that's once again only referring to the sheer potential of how things can/could happen. But what I'm actually getting at here is the particular occurrence of things that actually "do happen". For example, when one person aggravates and ceaselessly insults another, eventually the one who's been insulted will punch the other one in the face. This happens because it must happen. On the other hand, in case the one who's being insulted is highly advanced in self actualisation and will not take the insults as seriously and decides to not punch him in the face - this also, happens because it must happen in this way, you see? Even vice versa if the self-actualised guy did punch the other guy in the face, that still happened because it must have happened this way. So, again, I'm not talking about the potential of things to happen but I'm talking about the actual act of the happening itself. This is what I mean when I said "things are as they are/everything is as it is". When a tree crashes onto my car, then I guess this is as it is and there's nothing changing that. Of course, one could come in with his (in this case absolute ridiculous and redundant) non-dual argumentation of "Well, it is and it simultaneoulsy isn't, so don't worry about it!". Fuck that, there is a tree rammed into the windshield of my car and that's how it is in this instance, so consequently, the tree falling onto my car happened as it must have happened, there's no way around that.

Also, even though I did actually say in my opening post that "everything that could happen, will happen at some point (in consciousness)", I didn't really mean it in the sense that "absolutely everything just has to happen at some point" because in that statement the happening and non-happening of a particular event or occurrence is implied at the same time. So, even if something does not happen, this non-happening is still true to the statement "everything happens as it must happen". I apologize for phrasing it in such a weird way. Therefore, if something appears, it appears as it must appear and when something does not appear, it also does not appear, as it must. 

[SOUL]

@DocHoliday  Well, I know what I must not do and that is  to continue on in this conversation.

Enjoy your beliefs and live your life as you see fit but  I suspect you will still confuse your own personal truth for an absolute one since you really don't have any choice not to..... it must happen, right?

So be it.

Edited January 18, 2018 by SOUL

[DocHoliday]

@SOUL Haha. that's exactly what I was saying.  But I do indeed apologize if I came off during this discussion as somewhat condescending or arrogant or egocentric because I certainly didn't intend to do so. If I could, I'd give you a hug right now. All is well in the end, right?