Raising your consciousness

[Faceless]

@Serotoninluv

not really an altered state. Maybe I shouldn’t use state as an explanation. More like no state...

Yeah I use to run a lot to. That would qualify as a altered state. But ultimately still a movment of will or by the center or thought. 

This “centerlessness” is far from an altered state. It’s totaly unbounded. It’s unconditional quality makes for beauty on a whole nother realm. It’s almost like there’s only an experience when explained. But at the actual “moment” of centerlessness it does not qualify as an experience. 

This centerlessness is total joy without “reduction” if I can use that word, due to fragmentation and distortion of thought. 

This make sense buddy? Verbally as an explanation. Because this description is not the actuality itself. Just a pointer??

Edited January 20, 2018 by Faceless

[Nahm]

2 hours ago, Mighty Mouse said:

In a nutshell:

https://www.actualized.org/forum/topic/17699-reality-grants-everything/#comment-180805

It's not about any of his trips but about what he says absolute infinity is, as I recall he actually made separate videos about it. And this actually speaks directly to the difference between enlightenment and mysticism, as I've talked about before.

It's entirely possible that it has no relevance for any particular reader, so for whatever it's worth. I'm just sharing my shit. It's a phase... I think

What is your difference between enlightenment & mysticism? Sounds interesting. 

Also, if you’re willing, What is embodiment?

[Forestluv]

@Faceless The state of consciousness after running 40 miles is totally different than short distances. In some ways there is overlap with psychedelics. I’ve had more intense hallucinations toward the end of ultramarathons than psychedelics. After an IronMan triathlon, my cognition had aspects of a no-self being. I needed medical attention for hours.  

There have been happenings of “no state” consistent with your description - with and without psychedelics. Yet I am unable to understand or describe this “no state” through language, which is inherently dualistic. And I am unable to limit this “IS” by asserting it “IS” in only certain conditions. 

In terms of rational thought: I think it would be very difficult to argue “no state” cannot be with pschedelics because 1. Psychedelucs are an “outside agent” or 2. The biochemical effects of psychedelics on the brain. To me, both use an absolute framework that would be untenable under closer scrutiny.

Regarding the idea of “chasing” a previous psychedeluc experience. . . 

For me, psychedelics are a manner of being. Just like long distance running, extended meditatation or international travel.  The perspective you offer seems to distinguush psychedelics as an “outside agent”. Yet, all the activities described above also involve “outside agents”. My object is contionuos with the environment and they flow together. When I travel abroad, I’m not really chasing a previous experience. I never know what will surface. I suppose one could argue that I am still chasing a novel experience. Yet one still couldn’t limit psychedelics to the “chasing” argument. The inherent intention within chasing would include a vast array of activities. 

I can see the point that psychedelics may lead to the delusion of “no state”. Yet the same could be said about those claiming “no state” through meditation, long distance running or immersion with remote foreign tribes. The “outside agent” part doesn’t seem to apply.

[Faceless]

@Serotoninluv

I understand my friend

 

Outside agency being any chemical substance, method, technique, system, practice, routine, which never the less becomes mechanical and perpetual movements of thought. For example, any movement made by the center “thought” to capture that which is immeasurable. All movements and motives by the self being desire, will, ambition, hope, and so on. Any movement by the “i”  “you” to sustain itself through volitional activities. The objects of volition vary of course. 

 

Have I made myself a little clearer my friend? 

 

[Forestluv]

What you’ve written is consistent with an Ayahuasca ceremony I attended. It’s actually one of the best descriptions of the indescribable I’ve read.

[Faceless]

@Serotoninluv

I’ve never heard of  Ayahuasca.. what is that? 

 

[Forestluv]

17 minutes ago, Faceless said:

@Serotoninluv

I’ve never heard of  Ayahuasca.. what is that? 

 

It’s a combination of two molecules from a plant found in south america. The ceremonies vary. Mine were in a temple and also involved meditation, etheral music, singing and burning of some type of incense/dried plant.

[Faceless]

@Serotoninluv

hmm thats interesting...

and that sounds like a cool scene?

Since then can this centerlessness or timelessness act without the consumption of that plant? 

 

[Forestluv]

17 minutes ago, Faceless said:

@Serotoninluv

hmm thats interesting...

and that sounds like a cool scene?

Since then can this centerlessness or timelessness act without the consumption of that plant? 

 

Yes, for occassional brief periods

Yet I also met plenty of travelers in Peru doing these Aya ceremonies as a lifestyle - perhaps “chasing” as you termed it.

[Faceless]

@Serotoninluv

ah i see. Isn’t it beautiful this freedom? 

This timelessness seem to extend for longer periods at a time. I refer to it as being headless. My girlfriend hates it lol 

 

Edited January 21, 2018 by Faceless

[Nahm]

@Mighty Mouse Thanks. Very interesting views. Did you arrive at those perspectives after you experienced the absolute or before?

[Moreira]

On 14/1/2018 at 1:49 AM, Joseph Maynor said:

You are always doing something, think about it.  All of us are hard workers at doing whatever it is that we’re doing.  The only thing Enlightenment does is remove all your garbage ideas that are inclining you to do things that are not honoring your authentic values and strengths.  So, once you clean that garbage out of your head, and once you start to develop a taste for simply looking at reality, your actions will auto-correct on their own.  It’s important that you understand — you are not doing anything!  All you’re doing is becoming more aware of reality.  That’s it.   

I thought the enlightened person had lost all his will from the ego (samskaras). Osho once said he didnt dream anything because he had no wishes or goals. Are you telling me that enlightened ones still have desires?

[Faceless]

@Moreira

The entity that wants to rid themselves of desire is in fact desire lol 

It’s not about getting rid of desire. Because the desire to get rid of desire is a movment of desire. It’s implied once one goes deep enough that the perception and insight that the self “thought” is a manifestation of desire. To see this fact doesn’t rid one of desire. But one can become aware of this movment of volition therefore has a capacity to not react to its mechanical process or pattern. To see the truth that thought “the self” or desire is the manifestation of fragmentation becomes its own action in freedom from desire. 

Does this make sense? If not don’t jump to any conclusions, just investigate the very mechanism that is used to inquire. The mechanism of thought. 

And I’m not sure who Osho is but I am quite certain from my own experience that dreams do cease all together when there is order in ones mind. ?

great question friend 

 

Edited January 21, 2018 by Faceless

[Faceless]

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[Serge]

@Moreira Enlightened ones realise that what people call "desires" are false desires. Your true desires are all you currently are and have. If you have cancer - it's your wish right now to have cancer, if you are fat and ugly - it's your wish to be so, if you wish a lot of money and success - it's your wish to wish a lot of money and success.

 

Then he put his hand on their eyes, saying, As your faith is, let it be done to you.

Matthew 9:29