Does Just Born Human Enlightened?

[Parki]

If idea "I'm the body and the mind" is no more then just an illusion that imply one of these things.

1. The illusion is a social construct.

2. The illusion is inborn.

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If the first is true we know how to fix it, but if the second that's make me WTF is going on this planet.

I want your thougths on it.

[ZenMonkey]

Maybe it's because of language. When our parents adress us with "you" and we start to refere to us as "I" our mind creates a idea of ourselves. But does it matter?

[FindingPeace]

1 hour ago, ZenMonkey said:

Maybe it's because of language. When our parents adress us with "you" and we start to refere to us as "I" our mind creates a idea of ourselves. But does it matter?

Good point. I wonder, if we didn't have language, then how would we address ourselves? How would it change our self-concept?

If only we could see in to the mind of another species that has no language and see what that is like.

There would be no 'I' or 'me'. Just a self-awareness. In fact how much more present and mindful would a being without language be? No inner-dialogue going on. And is this the state we are trying to pursue?

On 27/02/2016 at 5:14 AM, Parki said:

1. The illusion is a social construct.

2. The illusion is inborn.

I say self-awareness is inborn. But the concept of 'I' is a social construct, and a function of language.

[cetus]

I remember when I was a young child a very special feeling that would suddenly come over me. It was the feeling that I and the world around me were one. Existence was comforting me and caring for me. Hugging me. I could feel myself existing within it, but belonging to it in every way.  It felt wonderful. That didn't happen all the time. But when it did, it was very special. It was everything. It would often happen when I was outside, in nature (the back yard) by myself. Sometimes it was just "me" playing, and sometimes it was something much more than just "me" that was happening.

[drelamore]

I remember as a kid that i used to look in the mirror and kept repeating my name, because i could not fathom the idea that what i was seeing in the mirror was me, not until i was 10 or 11.

[Parki]

@drelamore what you thought you are?

[drelamore]

@Parki I didn't think anything about that i didn't care, i was experiencing the world through my eyes without being concious of my image

[BHL_20]

20 hours ago, ZenMonkey said:

Maybe it's because of language. When our parents adress us with "you" and we start to refere to us as "I" our mind creates a idea of ourselves. But does it matter?

That's an easy theory to come up with but how do you enlightened people refering to themselves as "I" with no problems at all? 

Edited March 1, 2016 by BHL_20

[Neo]

My whole life I have occasionally been touched by a feeling of "I exist!" just during the course of my day. Not regularly, just a few times. And I don't mean the "wonder of existence" or "how amazing" but I believe it is truly experiencing what it is to exist in that moment. I used to call it "mind expanding" because that's the only way I can think of describing it.

[FindingPeace]

16 hours ago, drelamore said:

I remember as a kid that i used to look in the mirror and kept repeating my name, because i could not fathom the idea that what i was seeing in the mirror was me, not until i was 10 or 11.

To this day I look in the mirror and don't really see 'me'. I see a body standing there looking back at me. But I've never truly identified with it. Very weird feeling.

[cetus]

2Yea, same here. (Is that me?)  Maybe that's not that uncommon?? Not sure. I watched a documentary and most children don't identify themselves with the image in the mirror until the age of 24 months or so.

Edited March 1, 2016 by cetus56

[drelamore]

@cetus56 That's different though, that's referring to mental ability of children to create this notion of me when they look in the mirror.

The point is, just because you become more capable as you grow up to create and believe lies, doesn't make them significant or, most importantly, true.

[drelamore]

@FindingPeace Well then, you are lucky as far as enlightenment work is concerned 

[cetus]

Yes, the illusion of "self " begins. Not just the image in the mirror but the whole concept that goes with that self identity. Than one day you realize, this isn't true! How did this happen and how did I ever get so far into this idea of self? That's the sleep we walk in, of course and awaken from. I was just reading about a woman's NDE and how she became so depressed after realizing that she is not what she thought she was. She is now searching for that middle ground. She said that "life now feels like thick peanut butter to me". She is searching other NDE's to relate her personal experience too.

[ZenMonkey]

On 1.3.2016 at 3:02 PM, BHL_20 said:

That's an easy theory to come up with but how do you enlightened people refering to themselves as "I" with no problems at all? 

God says "I am" as well as the devil says "I am"....your real self says "I am" and ego says "I am"

You were born with the feeling of "I" but you attached things to it when you grew up.