Age, Open-mindedness, And Enlightenment

[Markus]

Here is something interesting than has occasionally crossed my mind. The self, a subject/object distinction, develops somewhere in early childhood. My earliest memory seems to be something that doesn't contain a "me" (and the only one that doesn't, in fact), it is just a memory of two pigs eating. It's allegedly been researched that people generally don't remember events without the event involving "them" doing something, which could be one of the reasons there are basically no memories from early childhood - in the period where the child could already use language but didn't perhaps have such a strong sense of self.

Wouldn't it perhaps be true that the sense of self, as it gets constant reinforcement, continues strengthening itself all throughout life? It certainly seems to me that middle-aged and elderly people are considerably more stubborn than people of my own age (late adolescence). From this I would hypothesize that older people will have more layers of bullshit to work through, if they try to pursue enlightenment, and will thus have a path of more suffering, on average.

The reason this even caught my interest is because there is all this talk about the emotional labor of doing self-inquiry. I just finished a 2.5-day home retreat of doing it and wouldn't say it were so bad. Yes, I did have occasional bouts of hatred and resentment towards other people and at one point seemingly every object come up but nothing worse than I've experienced in 45-minute sessions of simple meditation. 

The other thing that I already have once made a thread about, but what certainly confirmed itself, is that I rarely experience the self coming up with answers to "What am I?" I get into a deep state of meditation where I can inquire "What am I?" and silently wonder (Which is great, I guess, but certainly doesn't trigger an enlightenment experience).  I was walking on a footpath while doing that. Yet as soon as a person would approach me, I could feel the self-activity re-emerge. It's almost as if I'm paranoid about self-inquiry not working because it seems too easy.

[Ken Lecoq]

6 hours ago, Markus said:

Here is something interesting than has occasionally crossed my mind. The self, a subject/object distinction, develops somewhere in early childhood. My earliest memory seems to be something that doesn't contain a "me" (and the only one that doesn't, in fact), it is just a memory of two pigs eating. It's allegedly been researched that people generally don't remember events without the event involving "them" doing something, which could be one of the reasons there are basically no memories from early childhood - in the period where the child could already use language but didn't perhaps have such a strong sense of self.

Wouldn't it perhaps be true that the sense of self, as it gets constant reinforcement, continues strengthening itself all throughout life? It certainly seems to me that middle-aged and elderly people are considerably more stubborn than people of my own age (late adolescence). From this I would hypothesize that older people will have more layers of bullshit to work through, if they try to pursue enlightenment, and will thus have a path of more suffering, on average.

When I spent time with my grandparents, I can see the same behaviour, a very big sens on self. Moreover, they are spending 4 or 5 hours a day in front of the God "TV" xD. 

Even if it seems to be this way for almost everybody in this society, it's not true. Enlightenment is something beyond our current understanding of reality. It's totally possible for someone completly blind to have an enlightenment experience and to start a path toward the ultimate truth. It's less probable, for sure, but possible anyway. 

We cans say that, as a general rule in today's society, that's right. But not totally. 

Congrats for your 2,5 days home retreat ^^

Edited February 27, 2016 by Ken Lecoq

[Emerald]

7 hours ago, Markus said:

Here is something interesting than has occasionally crossed my mind. The self, a subject/object distinction, develops somewhere in early childhood. My earliest memory seems to be something that doesn't contain a "me" (and the only one that doesn't, in fact), it is just a memory of two pigs eating. It's allegedly been researched that people generally don't remember events without the event involving "them" doing something, which could be one of the reasons there are basically no memories from early childhood - in the period where the child could already use language but didn't perhaps have such a strong sense of self.

Wouldn't it perhaps be true that the sense of self, as it gets constant reinforcement, continues strengthening itself all throughout life? It certainly seems to me that middle-aged and elderly people are considerably more stubborn than people of my own age (late adolescence). From this I would hypothesize that older people will have more layers of bullshit to work through, if they try to pursue enlightenment, and will thus have a path of more suffering, on average.

The reason this even caught my interest is because there is all this talk about the emotional labor of doing self-inquiry. I just finished a 2.5-day home retreat of doing it and wouldn't say it were so bad. Yes, I did have occasional bouts of hatred and resentment towards other people and at one point seemingly every object come up but nothing worse than I've experienced in 45-minute sessions of simple meditation. 

The other thing that I already have once made a thread about, but what certainly confirmed itself, is that I rarely experience the self coming up with answers to "What am I?" I get into a deep state of meditation where I can inquire "What am I?" and silently wonder (Which is great, I guess, but certainly doesn't trigger an enlightenment experience).  I was walking on a footpath while doing that. Yet as soon as a person would approach me, I could feel the self-activity re-emerge. It's almost as if I'm paranoid about self-inquiry not working because it seems too easy.

I think that older people tend to get further and further away from themselves. It's a shame. This pattern is probably responsible for most of society's biggest issues. The people running the show (adults) are the least in touch with the truth of who they are. I would recommend Spiritual Autolysis for self-inquiry. It's where you attempt to write something you believe is true and then deconstruct the thought to find false assumptions. 

[Donald]

 

2 hours ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

I think that older people tend to get further and further away from themselves. It's a shame. This pattern is probably responsible for most of society's biggest issues. The people running the show (adults) are the least in touch with the truth of who they are. I would recommend Spiritual Autolysis for self-inquiry. It's where you attempt to write something you believe is true and then deconstruct the thought to find false assumptions. 

@Markus Is the belief system that they have been building up their whole life . I notice it in my parents .Sometimes they tend to be so dogmatic and I haven't met them in few years ( work outside of my country) and all this  time I have been doing  self help and all  of that jazz . I'm really looking forward to meet my parents again and see how my awareness has changed the way I used to think . 

[Leo Gura]

10 hours ago, Markus said:

I rarely experience the self coming up with answers to "What am I?" I get into a deep state of meditation where I can inquire "What am I?" and silently wonder

You're not supposed to get an answer to the What am I question.

The answer is the enlightenment itself.

So don't worry about it. Stillness and quiet is the perfect state to be in for this lightning to strike.