High Status vs. Pickup skills

[Hardkill]

I know that high status men get and retain the women they want; however, so do guys with great seduction skills. Yet, if we had to choose between the successful pickup artists and the high status men, who would ultimately come out as being the most seductive to women. I ask because maybe achieving high status from either my career or social circle or wealth or  can completely substitute the need to learn how to attraction women through "game" with your personality. Like Leo said "pickup isn't the only way to attract girls you know. 99% of men do not know pickup, and yet they still manage to get laid." Hell the most well known men in the world who have gotten the hottest women out there have very likely never tried pick up in their entire life.

[Frylock]

Yeah sure, most men don't do pickup and yet get laid, but these men don't usually have any abundance with women. The men that become masters at pickup and seducing women are surrounded by a world of opportunities. Top 20% of men are having sex with most of the women, etc.

Most men aren't high status, either. And even then, being high status may get you into the door for getting laid, but it doesn't guarantee you even know to emotionally hook women long-term, or develop a seductive demeanor and charisma that can really attract women.

If you want to become a great seducer, then pickup is not an option. You're not going to become a master of ebb and flow of masculine/feminine energy unless you consistently put it into practice. 

Edited December 19, 2017 by Frylock

[Joel3102]

Go pickup I think. It'll provide more growth through having to learn social skills and putting yourself outside of your comfort zone more. Those skills will stay with you for the rest of your life. Do career, wealth, or social circle as an end in themselves because you want to. You don't want to be relying on indicators such as wealth because it may attract the wrong kind of women into your life.  Also if you play the social circle game, you're probably going to have to surround yourself with people who aren't into self actualisation in order to get access to the hottest girls. That'd involve club promoters, DJ etc who live the part animal lifestyle, which would be a distraction.

[Spiral]

I've found that status works to some degree, but even if the girl seeks you out. You need to be relatively capable otherwise she will lose interest. So you don't really need to do the regular pickup, but you instead need have status somehow. For me, since i'm always around girls(even right now as i'm writing this) girls tend to be interested to find out why. Although you need to start somewhere right?

If you are bad with girls it's not because you are inherently bad at pickup, but pickup can show you what you are doing wrong.

Seeking out status is kind of unattractive, you just get it because you happen to be good at something. 

Girls are not the most important thing the world, I was all about this when I was 19. You get some and then you want more.

[Hardkill]

4 hours ago, Spiral said:

I've found that status works to some degree, but even if the girl seeks you out. You need to be relatively capable otherwise she will lose interest. So you don't really need to do the regular pickup, but you instead need have status somehow. For me, since i'm always around girls(even right now as i'm writing this) girls tend to be interested to find out why. Although you need to start somewhere right?

If you are bad with girls it's not because you are inherently bad at pickup, but pickup can show you what you are doing wrong.

Seeking out status is kind of unattractive, you just get it because you happen to be good at something. 

Girls are not the most important thing the world, I was all about this when I was 19. You get some and then you want more.

So are u saying that I should neither try to raise my status nor learn pickup?

[Spiral]

@Hardkill Sure unless you need pickup for social/confidence reasons. 

[aurum]

19 hours ago, Hardkill said:

I ask because maybe achieving high status from either my career or social circle or wealth or  can completely substitute the need to learn how to attraction women through "game" with your personality.

No, no, no, no.

If you think just having cash or career success is going to get you girls just by itself, you’re wrong. Those are surface level solutions.

Those things are useful IF you have some degree of game. Because then you can leverage them to get better logsitics / access.

But without game, you’ll just be a rich guy who tries to buy his way into sex.

Yes, there are guys who never did pickup who are great with women. That’s because game is not pickup. Pickup is just a practice to improve your game. 

But you do have to do something. Something that will install those behavior changes.

[Hardkill]

5 minutes ago, aurum said:

No, no, no, no.

If you think just having cash or career success is going to get you girls just by itself, you’re wrong. Those are surface level solutions.

Those things are useful IF you have some degree of game. Because then you can leverage them to get better logsitics / access.

But without game, you’ll just be a rich guy who tries to buy his way into sex.

Yes, there are guys who never did pickup who are great with women. That’s because game is not pickup. Pickup is just a practice to improve your game. 

But you do have to do something. Something that will install those behavior changes.

So then how do the vast majority of high status guys who have never pickup ever before in their entire life ever land the hottest women? How did they get enough game?

[Zephyr]

Yes acquiring materialistic things and careers with high reputation will definitely get girls going wet for you

[Girzo]

3 hours ago, Hardkill said:

So then how do the vast majority of high status guys who have never pickup ever before in their entire life ever land the hottest women? How did they get enough game?

Not everyone is created equal, get over it. They had different childhood and teenage experiences; their psychology is different; they are more physically attractive; they are born with natural charisma; they are just self-confident. Plenty of reasons can play a role here.

On the other hand you have things like abusive parents, early-developed porn and masturbation addiction, lack of female friends, etc. All those factors can contribute to having problems with girls.

[Hardkill]

3 minutes ago, Girzo said:

Not everyone is created equal, get over it. They had different childhood and teenage experiences; their psychology is different; they are more physically attractive; they are born with natural charisma; they are just self-confident. Plenty of reasons can play a role here.

On the other hand you have things like abusive parents, early-developed porn and masturbation addiction, lack of female friends, etc. All those factors can contribute to having problems with girls.

No no. Something doesn't add up. Are you telling me that ALL of the most successful men in world who are businessmen, lawyers, athletes, actors, singers, politicians, princes, kings, models, etc., and who we know can get any woman they want, have always had great charisma since the day they were born? None of them ever had to work hard on developing their charisma? 

Also, good looks don't mean shit for men (I know from personal experience), except for a few of the freebies you may get on rare occasions. 

[Girzo]

There are different ways of developing charisma and confidence than pickup. 

Stop being a victim.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Girzo

[Hardkill]

53 minutes ago, Girzo said:

There are different ways of developing charisma and confidence than pickup. 

Stop being a victim.

How? I’ve tried practically everything there is. There seems to be no guarantee that I will be able to improve my charisma. However I am absolutely certain that I can raise my status in some way. 

Also, don’t tell me there are no guarantees in life because while that may true in the grand scheme of “life”, it’s a unhelpful cliche that does put me at ease. It makes me feel powerless and I know that there are certain things in life that can be ensured.

[Girzo]

I am trying to figure it out for myself right now, so I can't share with you any proven method. Currently I am trying to write down a report everytime I go out and analyze my mistakes. It's hard, so fucking hard. To get more aware of what is right and wrong I watch Charisma on Command videos and read books like Deida's "The Way of The Superior Man" and then analyze stuff I have written again. I don't know, maybe you haven't tried that approach.

You ask so many questions that I actually believe one day you will break-through and succeed. Just don't give up trying.