Experience After An Insight - Perceptions Falling In On Themselves

[Emerald]

So, last night I was doing Spiritual Autolysis and came out with a really great insight about "perception" that had been getting in my way.

I realized that I was thinking that sight, sound, taste, smell, and touch were perceptions in the sense that they were being sensed. But maybe "perceptions" aren't perceptions at all. Maybe they just exist as they are. Maybe they are (for want of a better term) the thing-in-itself.

So, after I had this insight, I went to bed and woke up at around 5 am. I was awake, so I decided to do some empirical investigation while lying there. I focused on the sensations of the body and tried to experience them free from my concept of what a perception is.

As I became aware of this, I got this "void-like" feeling like my perceptions were empty and falling in on themselves. There were only sensations and my mind was a bit more distant from me. 

Then fear came up and the thoughts started becoming louder and pulling me out of the experience. The thoughts were invoking ideas of insecurity about my looks and my life situation. So, I got distracted by the insecure thoughts, and snapped out of it. The ego used these thoughts to keep itself alive.

At least I now have a first-hand experience of how the ego uses insecurity to sustain itself.

Any thoughts?

[cetus]

Just wanted to share something. I just came out of meditation. There exists now an infinite silent emptiness. I look at the total forum and it's almost painful by compairison. So many ideas and perceptions and thoughts happening at one time. It's  a traffic jam with 10000's of horns blowing in contrast to this vast emptiness. I'm not saying this in a negative way. Just bringing that to light while the experience is still fresh. It's starting to wear off now. Wow, what a contrast that was.

Edited February 25, 2016 by cetus56

[Ayla]

1 hour ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

"void-like" feeling

This is still being felt by something. 

 

1 hour ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

how the ego uses insecurity to sustain itself

Yes. As long as you believe those insecurities, it will go to vast resources to do so. 

 

[WelcometoReality]

@Emerald Wilkins

4 hours ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

I realized that I was thinking that sight, sound, taste, smell, and touch were perceptions in the sense that they were being sensed. But maybe "perceptions" aren't perceptions at all. Maybe they just exist as they are. Maybe they are (for want of a better term) the thing-in-itself.

As I became aware of this, I got this "void-like" feeling like my perceptions were empty and falling in on themselves. There were only sensations and my mind was a bit more distant from me. 

At least I now have a first-hand experience of how the ego uses insecurity to sustain itself.

Yes, they are perceptions without a perceiver that is distorting them.

And what is it that is aware of this void?

You'll be more prepared next time for the games ego play.

Edited February 25, 2016 by WelcometoReality

[Emerald]

3 minutes ago, Pinocchio said:

That fear is the deep suspicion that there is no foundation to anything. The true foundation of existence can not be experienced because it is that which experiences. So beliefs are formed to serve as a surrogate foundation. Those are your reference points, and they are all being undermined now, quite literally. You're taking a closer look and the imaginary foundation of your existence is being threatened. All your reference points are suddenly shown to be dangling in empty space. The entire edifice is shown to be an air castle.
What to do, what to do...

Indeed. Have you had any similar experiences? Could it be a sign of awakening to the truth, or is it just another state of mind? It reminded me of my deeper experiences with OBE where I'm just floating in a void, but more intense. Most of the time in OBEs I'm walking around in my environment or some other environment, but I've had a few where I was just floating in the void. But I consider OBEs to be another part of the dream and not actually waking up. So, I'm wondering if it's a step toward awakening, or if it's just another novel "spiritual" experience. 

[cetus]

 

Lets watch this together. O.K.

[Azrael]

6 hours ago, Emerald Wilkins said:

Any thoughts?

I find your observation quite interesting. My first big paradigm shift about sensations were a few months ago when I was doing a lot of strong determination sittings.

Now, I see that perceptions for most people - me included - are for most parts still thoughts. There is something involved in a perception that as you say exists for itself - but as we normally experience it is always combined with a preconceived thought. We basically have no idea what a perception really is.

I had this realization after I sat for 90 minutes straight the first time. I went through that phase of immense suffering but I got through that to the phase in which you simple see pain. Now, real pain is just another sensation. It is not bad at all. Suffering makes pain bad. But you can't see that for the most time because you have never experienced pain.

You just know suffering, which could be described as non-acceptance of the pain. And where does this non-acceptance come from? Probably from a lot of very basic understandings of how this world works and what do to and what not to + a lot of sense experiences.

Now, non-acceptance is just made up. It's just another thought. So the actual perception of pure pain doesn't reveal itself to you if don't use techniques like strong determination sittings to provoke that.

As you do that and break the foundations of your common reality apart, not only a lot of things in your deep psyche seem to rearrange but you also feel like you were fooled the whole time. I had times in which I gained intense please and ecstasy from the feeling of pain because I got rid of the suffering.

So, to sum it up. In my experience are perceptions a great way to see what is real and what is not. Go deep on that one. Question everything there is 'till there is nothing left then pure it. Think about it, as you read the lines there is a voice in your head reading and understanding it w/o much effort.

Are you really perceiving this? Or are there a series of automatic thoughts involved and everything you sense is a very abstract product of the actual sensed perception.

@Emerald Wilkins Thank's for your great realization, it's an interesting topic

@Pinocchio Man, you are so nuts. If I read your lines it's like pure gold is dippin' in my face. Thanks for your wisdom, you made my evening!

[Emerald]

29 minutes ago, Pinocchio said:

Where is all of that when you look closely.

If enlightenment is about waking up to the truth behind all things, and you're finding out how all things are false, then that would have to be quite a significant discovery.

 

That's what I was thinking. I still get caught up in pre-conceived notions of enlightenment, so it's time to tear into that.  

[Emerald]

16 minutes ago, cetus56 said:

 

Lets watch this together. O.K.

Great video.  

[Emerald]

9 minutes ago, Arik said:

I find your observation quite interesting. My first big paradigm shift about sensations were a few months ago when I was doing a lot of strong determination sittings.

Now, I see that perceptions for most people - me included - are for most parts still thoughts. There is something involved in a perception that as you say exists for itself - but as we normally experience it is always combined with a preconceived thought. We basically have no idea what a perception really is.

I had this realization after I sat for 90 minutes straight the first time. I went through that phase of immense suffering but I got through that to the phase in which you simple see pain. Now, real pain is just another sensation. It is not bad at all. Suffering makes pain bad. But you can't see that for the most time because you have never experienced pain.

You just know suffering, which could be described as non-acceptance of the pain. And where does this non-acceptance come from? Probably from a lot of very basic understandings of how this world works and what do to and what not to + a lot of sense experiences.

Now, non-acceptance is just made up. It's just another thought. So the actual perception of pure pain doesn't reveal itself to you if don't use techniques like strong determination sittings to provoke that.

As you do that and break the foundations of your common reality apart, not only a lot of things in your deep psyche seem to rearrange but you also feel like you were fooled the whole time. I had times in which I gained intense please and ecstasy from the feeling of pain because I got rid of the suffering.

So, to sum it up. In my experience are perceptions a great way to see what is real and what is not. Go deep on that one. Question everything there is 'till there is nothing left then pure it. Think about it, as you read the lines there is a voice in your head reading and understanding it w/o much effort.

Are you really perceiving this? Or are there a series of automatic thoughts involved and everything you sense is a very abstract product of the actual sensed perception.

@Emerald Wilkins Thank's for your great realization, it's an interesting topic

@Pinocchio Man, you are so nuts. If I read your lines it's like pure gold is dippin' in my face. Thanks for your wisdom, you made my evening!

I have decided to come back to Strong Determination Sitting again. It really made me aware of the separateness between thoughts and perceptions. I figured that now, with my recent insights, this will really help me make a lot of progress. 

[cetus]

Everything else becomes a sub-space to the field of perfect emptiness .

[Emerald]

Just now, cetus56 said:

Everything else becomes a sub-space to the field of perfect emptiness .

Can you explain what you mean by sub-space?

[cetus]

This space that our minds and body's occupy exists within that "Alpha" space. It is the larger field that surrounds us always. It is the canvas for this existence to be expressed.

[Guest]

@ArikThanks for that post..

That second paragraph just helped me understand my senses a bit more..