Why Am I Not Enlightened When Im Present?

[Viking]

when I stop thinking, there is that space awareness which is basically nothing. what is the difference between that and enlightenment? does that sense of spaciousness change with practice ? and how so?

[Echoes]

@Ilya There are a lot of subtle and unconscious assumptions/beliefs that distort the perceiving "of" reality without you even noticing it. Beliefs who fall in this category for example: "I am a human" "Planet earth exists" "I have a face" "I was born" "I have a personal life" etc. You need to find these (subtle) and taken for granted assumptions first and truly question them, because they affect the "modus of perceiving" even if you think your mind is still

[Viking]

@Echoes do i do this in addition to self inquiry? because self inquiry doesnt really cover that for me, because all i do is focus on the sense of self

[Echoes]

@Ilya Yes, you can do this in self-inquiry. Ultimately, everything has to do with the sense of self.  There is also the method of "Spiritual Autolysis" by Jed Mckenna, where you basically write down everything you think/belief is true about reality and yourself and question it. If you really do this with full dedication and intent, all ignorance starts to break down and  true, authentic "not knowing" can be realized. 

 

Edited August 6, 2017 by Echoes

[Viking]

@Echoes @Echoes thanks

[Leo Gura]

@Ilya The brain's Default Mode Network is constantly operating in the background, generating your current level of consciousness. Your current level of consciousness is the problem. It must be broken out of. Just being "present" with your Default Mode Network running, doesn't break you out of ego. You're just present as ego.

[Yali]

On 8/6/2017 at 3:19 PM, Leo Gura said:

You're just present as ego.

@Leo Gura Then what's the point of meditiation if I'm only ever going to be present as Ego? It's as if you're dismissing meditiation and claiming only psychedelics capable of breaking the brain's Default Mode Network.

Edited August 8, 2022 by Yali

[amanen]

6 hours ago, Yali said:

@Leo Gura Then what's the point of meditiation if I'm only ever going to be present as Ego? It's as if you're dismissing meditiation and claiming only psychedelics capable of breaking the brain's Default Mode Network.

Long term meditators have been shown to have decreased DMN activity. The activity will decrease, but it will probably not reach the same level as you would with a very high dose psychedelic.

However keep in mind that psychedelics do far more than just this, notably they make different brain areas connect to many different areas that would usually never communicate with each other (There's a great visualization of this if you search google for placebo vs psilocybin).  There's probably far more going on too, given to how many receptors most psychedelics bind to.

[Razard86]

10 hours ago, Yali said:

@Leo Gura Then what's the point of meditiation if I'm only ever going to be present as Ego? It's as if you're dismissing meditiation and claiming only psychedelics capable of breaking the brain's Default Mode Network.

After I took a psychedelic mushroom it literally rewired my brain and supercharged my meditations. Here are a couple of things it did.

1. It quieted the mind. Made my thoughts not as loud so it is easier to not get pulled into thought thus increasing my concentration and ability to be present.

2. It increased my awareness slightly, allowing me to have increased meditation practices. Just in the last 2 days I almost left my body twice off meditation (the fear stopped me lol) so psychedelics are VERY important to this process. Ignore any Guru who says otherwise. 

What almost happened to me: https://www.iflscience.com/you-can-meditate-yourself-into-a-neardeath-experience-and-if-you-practice-you-can-get-better-at-it-50898

3. I have only done a mushrooms once, and ate an edible once and I have never drank or smoked or did any drugs prior to this and those two things gave me a Kundalini Awakening. So I can confirm that psychedelics are a powerful tool that will prevent you having to spend decades doing meditation and I thank Leo for revealing this.

But at the end of the day it is your decision.

Note: I am not a master or experienced meditator I just started doing meditation this year and psychedelics have pushed me further than a beginner would normally be at.

Edited August 8, 2022 by Razard86

[Inliytened1]

On 8/6/2017 at 1:03 PM, Viking said:

when I stop thinking, there is that space awareness which is basically nothing. what is the difference between that and enlightenment? does that sense of spaciousness change with practice ? and how so?

Enlightenment is mystical.  You will know. 

[BipolarGrowth]

Because you’re not actually present. There is no such thing as being present and not being fully enlightened, however, there are countless people who think they are present when they are not.