Understanding Absolute Infinity

[egoless]

1 minute ago, Dodo said:

Nobody is enlightened 

Then? What are you trying?

Edited August 4, 2017 by egoless

[egoless]

8 minutes ago, Dodo said:

Nobody is enlightened 

@egoless The practice to find you are nobody is Self inquiry 

Did you find that you are nobody and are you sure of it now?

[cetus]

13 hours ago, Azrael said:

When you go to absolute infinity the membrane flips inside out. Meaning that everything you know is seen as relative and through that your identity also flips inside out. You realize that you are absolutely infinite and that everything finite you ever perceived is just an relative aspect of it.

It flips the whole dream inside out, the way how your perceive everything and your identity as a whole

I think I may be getting some traction here. So would it be fair to say that the finite is sort of a projection (for lack of a better word) of the infinite? Is that what you mean by 'flipping it inside out'?  If that's what you mean, I've experienced that. It happened only after transcending (annihilation) of the mind.  It was infinite and contained everything without containing a single thing. I know that sounds like a paradox, but that's how it was experienced. When I came back, this reality was realized as an aspect (or projection) that was happening within the infinite. In truth they are one in the same, but I must speak in dualistic terms for clarification from a first person perspective experience.  And on the level of mind they are separate in a way, but only (and that's a big only) because the mind creates a huge partition. This get's back to my original question, 'Is the mind the membrane?'. Just for clarification, I'm seeing what you are referring to as a 'membrane' as what I am thinking of as a sort of a 'partition'. But maybe I'm misunderstanding the use of the word 'membrane' because of limited experience? Or maybe I'm not but there is more to this 'membrane' you speak of than just the partitioning mind keeping me from experiencing absolute infinity?

But anyhow, since that experience I see the partitioning mind the creator of the illusion of life and death. Or in other words, it creates all the illusion of separation between finite and infinite.  But that too is dualistic thinking? So to sum up, if I understand correctly, what you are saying, is- this too is part of the all inclusive- absolute infinity. Am I getting any closer? haha Thanks Az

I gotta experience 5meo sometime but I don't know if my heart could take it. Does physical death count in lieu of doing 5meo? I've got that on my list of things to experience someday.

 

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, egoless said:

Did you find that you are nobody and are you sure of it now?

There is a sense/feeling of self or I-ness, sensations, but that is also seen in the wider space of awareness which encapsulates my entire experience, which also includes any and all identifications with subtle form I might still have -as long as it doesnt remain an unconscious belief. 

You are asking about the content of my experience when you should stop asking and practice for yourself. 

It's a process of dissolving, it's not instant, that's why it requires practice.

It's only the beginning for me. To new beginnings!

[egoless]

20 minutes ago, Dodo said:

There is a sense/feeling of self or I-ness, sensations, but that is also seen in the wider space of awareness which encapsulates my entire experience, which also includes any and all identifications with subtle form I might still have -as long as it doesnt remain an unconscious belief. 

You are asking about the content of my experience when you should stop asking and practice for yourself. 

It's a process of dissolving, it's not instant, that's why it requires practice.

It's only the beginning for me. To new beginnings!

What you expect in the end? Will it make your life happier and more fulfilled? And since you think that 5 Meo is part of that practice - What is 5 Meo in your opinion? Should not it be also nothing? And how could nothing within the nothingness open your "eyes" and make you awake? 

[Dodo]

42 minutes ago, egoless said:

What you expect in the end? Will it make your life happier and more fulfilled? And since you think that 5 Meo is part of that practice - What is 5 Meo in your opinion? Should not it be also nothing? And how could nothing within the nothingness open your "eyes" and make you awake? 

I've never taken psychedelics and my first trip will be end of this year(but not 5meo) .

Leo has stated that taking meo is like taking a concentrated dose of awareness as far as I can remember. You become more aware, more yourself - probably because it's removing the fog of ego (ego death).

Who knows - a dream substance helping a dream entity to transcend the dream doesnt sound so outrageous to me!

I started doing spiritual practice to improve the quality of my life, but to be honest now it is just super interesting to do this investigation into my true nature. 

Edited August 4, 2017 by Dodo

[egoless]

9 minutes ago, Dodo said:

I've never taken psychedelics and my first trip will be end of this year(but not 5meo) .

Leo has stated that taking meo is like taking a concentrated dose of awareness as far as I can remember.

Who knows - a dream substance helping a dream entity to transcend the dream doesnt sound so outrageous to me!

But it should sound outrageous based on the way you formulated it. Maybe your belief that you are actually moving towards the Truth prohibits you to question it and does not allow it to appear outrageous to you? Since you have no awareness of that Truth yet as you tell me. Then it means that you are following your belief of the possibility to become aware of that Truth. We come to the same dilema here. What is the difference between "you" and a religious person. They also say : First you have to believe to see it. And if we question everything there should be no room left for belief right? I know this conversation with me maybe becoming annoying to you because it seems we are talking the same things - but I do this because I really want you to get my point about what moves you towards the direction you have chosen. It is belief that you will become aware... belief is initial inertia

Edited August 4, 2017 by egoless

[Dodo]

3 minutes ago, egoless said:

But it should sound outrageous based on the way you formulated it. Maybe your belief that you are actually koving towards the Truth prohibits you to question it and appear it outrageous to you? Since you have not awareness of that Truth yet as you tell me. Then it means that you are following your belief of the possibility to become aware of that Truth. We come to the same dilema here. What is the difference between "you" and a religious person. They also say : First you have to believe to see it. And if we question everything there should be no room left for belief right? I know this conversation with me maybe becoming annoying to you because it seems we are talking the same things - but I do this because I really want you to get my point about what moves you towards the direction you choosed. It is belief that you will become aware...

OH i am aware of the truth. Thats when maturing begins.

If you are aware that you are aware  you are aware of the truth

Edited August 4, 2017 by Dodo

[egoless]

5 minutes ago, Dodo said:

OH i am aware of the truth. Thats when maturing begins.

If you are aware that you are aware  you are aware of the truth

Nevertheless let's turn the time back when you were not aware then. Story is the same... Belief was the initial inertia... and belief is part of your ego. 

Edited August 4, 2017 by egoless

[Dodo]

2 minutes ago, egoless said:

Nevertheless let's turn the time back when you were not aware then. Story is the same... Belief was the initial inertia... and belief is ego thing.

There is only the present moment, nice try though hehehe!

Initial inertia for what... I am always aware. Ego is only an illusion, it's just as real as Santa

[egoless]

8 minutes ago, Dodo said:

There is only the present moment, nice try though hehehe!

Initial inertia for what... I am always aware. Ego is only an illusion, it's just as real as Santa

I think you have grasped my idea. The rest is subjective. How open minded will you and me contemplate each other's ideas. I promise that I will do my best to contemplate yours with no subjective foundations.  

P.S taking time out of the equation does not change the fact that initial inertia was belief. For what? For your ego to believe that it can achieve awareness. And to make practical changes to do it.

Edited August 4, 2017 by egoless

[Dodo]

11 minutes ago, egoless said:

I think you have grasped my idea. The rest is subjective. How open minded will you and me will contemplate each other's ideas.  

I told you I am not investigating ideas, but the one to whom the ideas appear. Thats the essense of my inquiry.

Let me give you a taste of one of my favourite type of self inquiry : I like to visualise something with closed eyes (from as simple as a dot, to a face or whatever) and then contemplate what is seeing that. It's like the eyes trying to see themselves. 

Then I simply hold awareness on that presence that is seeing the object of visualisation, because I've found that this is the best mirror I can put in front of it, as it cannot be seen as an object, as it is always the subject. 

Putting awareness on awareness is the best mirror for awareness to know itself.

I do this also with sounds "Who hears?", sensations,  etc, everything can be used for this practice.

 

If you hold a mental image of truth or who you are, dont be interested in that. Be more interested in the one to whom they appear. 

Edited August 4, 2017 by Dodo

[egoless]

6 minutes ago, Dodo said:

I told you I am not investigating ideas, but the one to whom the ideas appear. Thats the essense of my inquiry.

Let me give you a taste of one of my favourite type of self inquiry : I like to visualise something with closed eyes (from as simple as a dot, to a face or whatever) and then contemplate what is seeing that. It's like the eyes trying to see themselves. 

Then I simply hold awareness on that presence that is seeing the object of visualisation, because I've found that this is the best mirror I can put in front of it, as it cannot be seen as an object, as it is always the subject. 

I do this also with sounds "Who hears?", sensations,  etc, everything can be used for this practice.

 

It feels like point between the closed eyes is seeing these visualizations. I have tried too. But what if who we really are is attached to our pineal gland somehow. Ancients did not call it "third eye" for no reason...Also notice that if you close your eyes and walk around. That sense of you is following your body even with your eyes closed. What if it is really located in your body somehow? (Example of pineal gland)

Edited August 4, 2017 by egoless

[Dodo]

14 minutes ago, egoless said:

It feels like point between the closed eyes is seeing these visualizations. I have tried too. But what if who we really are is attached to our pineal gland somehow. Ancients did not call it "third eye" for no reason...Also notice that if you close your eyes and walk around. That sense of you is following your body even with your eyes closed. What if it is really located in your body somehow? (Example of pineal gland)

That might be true if there was evidence for a body other than the knowing of it. The sense of having a body is clearly inside your awareness. 

This is the paradigm problem again 

Edited August 4, 2017 by Dodo

[egoless]

2 minutes ago, Dodo said:

That might be true if there was evidence for a body other than the knowing of it. The sense of having a body is clearly inside your awareness

Why does reality has egos? Is there only my ego? Or are there yours Leo's and etc.? 

Edited August 4, 2017 by egoless

[Dodo]

18 minutes ago, egoless said:

It feels like point between the closed eyes is seeing these visualizations. I have tried too. But what if who we really are is attached to our pineal gland somehow. Ancients did not call it "third eye" for no reason...Also notice that if you close your eyes and walk around. That sense of you is following your body even with your eyes closed. What if it is really located in your body somehow? (Example of pineal gland)

I want to add here, dont stop at what your feeling is. Now investigate who is having this feeling. 

2 minutes ago, egoless said:

Why does reality has egos? Is there only my ego? Or are there yours Leo's and etc.? 

Ego is not my interest, my interest is knowing who I am existentially.

[egoless]

Just now, Dodo said:

I want to add here, dont stop at what your feeling is. Now investigate who is having this feeling. 

Ego is not my interest, my interest is knowing who I am existentially.

So you don't know answer on egos? What is your opinion just tell me that.

P.S let's say pineal gland has this feeling.

[Dodo]

10 minutes ago, egoless said:

So you don't know answer on egos? What is your opinion just tell me that.

P.S let's say pineal gland has this feeling.

Samsara has egos, reality has truth is my opinion. 

What is the pineal gland but a concept in awareness. If you're the pineal gland in your experience thats interesting. Not gonna do your inquiry for.you,im far from a teacher,  I am a bad student still

 

 

Edited August 4, 2017 by Dodo

[egoless]

9 minutes ago, Dodo said:

Samsara has egos, reality has truth is my opinion. 

What is the pineal gland but a concept in awareness. If you're the pineal gland in your experience thats interesting. Not gonna do your inquiry for.you,im far from a teacher,  I am a bad student still

 

 

My awareness experiences reality like this: it is absolutely everything possible made out of nothing. Nothing to be nothing has to be opposite of everything that's why nothing feels like everything in my opinion. That's why nothing awares itself like everythig if that makes sense to you. So absolutely everything must include limited perspective versions of ourselves too right? And thats who we are! Limitations within Nothing! And that's what I call "Me".

[Dodo]

21 minutes ago, egoless said:

My awareness experiences reality like this: it is absolutely everything possible made out of nothing. Nothing to be nothing has to be opposite of everything that's why nothing feels like everything in my opinion. That's why nothing awares itself like everythig if that makes sense to you. So absolutely everything must include limited perspective versions of ourselves too right? And thats who we are! Limitations within Nothing! And that's what I call "Me".

However being, or being aware is limitless. From my inquiry it looks like I am not that which appears in nothingness, but the nothingness itself.

Now I need to stop talk and be a good student

Edited August 4, 2017 by Dodo