Ketamine- An Unfruitful Endeavour

[I Am That]

With the positive research coming out on Ketamine and depression, I had higher hopes for this compound for relieving depression and also consciousness related work. Whilst admittedly I was not using it in a formal therapeutic environment, it would seem that plant based entheogens are far more pleasant and safer. One of the main drawbacks of Ketamine is its apparent potential for addiction. I can't say I found it remotely addictive and I have a rather long history with alcohol & tobacco addiction. My doses of Ketamine were over a month apart. But, going by reports on the net, many do succumb to the addictive qualities. I'm guessing when working with a trained therapist the potential for addiction and bladder related issues are going to be greatly reduced. In a medical setting, Ketamine has an excellent safety profile- its clinical use wouldn't be so widespread otherwise.  

For me, I found the experiences very cold, distant and dark, but not definitely not overwhelmingly negative. There is a severe loss of motor control and a numbness to the extremities. In my first experiment, I was so dissociated that when I played a song that I love I felt absolutely nothing, it was as pleasurable as listening to nothing at all. Sub-ego death doses of Ketamine are really so very different to trytamines- if I was listening to that same song on mushrooms I would have been blown to pieces emotionally. Dose wise, I aimed for the lower end of what others reported online would bring about a "k-hole"/full ego dissolution but did not experience anything like that. On my second experiment I ingested a total of 200mg of Ketamine via two different ROAs and had a very similar experience to the first time. I even incorporated some heavy intentional breathing/circular type breath work and even this was not enough to encourage any substantial feelings to emerge. I tried the Wim Hof method (intentional breathing) on Acacia root bark/DMT and Syrian rue last week and the bliss was immense. I think the worst side effect of Ketamine has to be the grogginess after you come around. It's just simply not really worth moving for a while. You won't be able to walk well at all. Why and how people use this stuff at raves just seems utterly insane to me. Be safe if you plan on doing this drug outside of a clinical setting! Consider your body position- laying down or propped up in bed is best. Also consider the potential for addiction, some people really seem to like the feeling this drug induces. I can't say i'm one of those people.

[Leo Gura]

Be careful with ketamine. Addiction potential and bladder damage are real concerns. I would urge most people to avoid it.

Thanks for sharing your discoveries though.

[Loreena]

@Leo Gura  Thank you for alerting people.

 

 

 

[I Am That]

@Leo Gura

I appreciate you providing a platform in which to share these matters.

As I pointed out, I believe in a clinical setting the risk of addiction and bladder issues are greatly reduced. This is noteworthy because Ketamine infusions administered by a psychiatrist may be able to really help someone overcome depression. It may well save someone from killing themselves. I don't wish to scare people away from that option if they have the money and live in the right part of the world. In relation to truth seeking/shadow work endeavours, there are safer choices.

 

[Leo Gura]

@I Am That The counter-argument would be: Why not just use LSD or mushrooms, which are just as effective and have very little harm potential?

Mushrooms and LSD are so effective and benign that it's almost too good to be true. I'm continually amazing at how awesome our tools for consciousness work really are. It's easy to imagine a universe in which they wouldn't exist. Then people would be really screwed, resorting to shooting up horse tranquilizers and sniffing Crazy Glue

I like your avatar. The perfect metaphor for infinity.

[I Am That]

@Leo Gura

Haha cheers. Yes, I do agree. I guess some folk aren't confident enough to explore psychedelics on their own and worry about the legal side of things.

Not me though. Foraging for wild mushrooms in the bush with my Border Collie running about is one of my favourite winter activities. A universe where mushrooms do not exist? That's a little scary. I'm so grateful for how accessible mushrooms are in Australia. I've been using them on and off for 13 years now and never paid a cent for them.

[Arkandeus]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@I Am That The counter-argument would be: Why not just use LSD or mushrooms, which are just as effective and have very little harm potential?

Mushrooms and LSD are so effective and benign that it's almost too good to be true. I'm continually amazing at how awesome our tools for consciousness work really are. It's easy to imagine a universe in which they wouldn't exist. Then people would be really screwed, resorting to shooting up horse tranquilizers and sniffing Crazy Glue

I like your avatar. The perfect metaphor for infinity.

for me lsd and mushrooms are the obvious ''glitch in the matrix''
how can a mere plant make you use your human brain more effectively?
following modern society's mindset we're supposedly the most evolved beings on this planet, and suddenly mere plant matter can you feel alive, can show you the potentials of your own brain, can make you feel connected to others and to yourself in ways you would have never imagined.   
''a fucking plant knows better how to use my brain then I do'' that was my main thought
lost all respect for society and started respecting nature and the universe

it is not a coincidence that we have certain ways to unlock higher consciousness

[MM1988]

Tried it this weekend recreationally. It's a pretty special effect. Like you are floating above your head. Really dissociated, but other than that I felt quite sober. I didnt find it especially good or bad. I think I would have freaked out had I not had 3 or 4 beers before. Dont ever mix this drug with alcohol, I'm an idiot! I'm just too anxious on every drug. Ironically I'm always concerned about health when on a drug sober, but with the anti anxiety effects of alcohol its no problem even though its a greater risk.

[Seed]

  @I Am That  Ketamine is a drug which you need to learn how to use properly. It takes a good 3- 4 times trips, before you know exactly how to work with it and not against it. Firstly, little and often amounts (very, very gradual is key!) too much in one go and you've ruined the whole thing. It's slows down the processing in your mind.. so obviously too much is overkill!

For me, it's the best tool I've ever used, clear, clean and completely mind twisting to the highest extreme! Mushrooms although powerful, are too distracting and busy for me and I've yet to try LSD. 

However, I know a friend who's life was screwed over by it.. So I don't go near it now. It will destroy your bladder! No spiritual endeavour is worth permanently destroying your health. Look after yourself - living inside an illusion is far better than addiction and bladder incontinence. We're here, enjoy it. Whatever is it. It's us - now. :-)

 

 

Edited January 22, 2018 by Seed

[Azrael]

I would not recommend to anyone to do Ketamine. Addiction potential is way too high and damages as well. Stick to normal psychedelics, it's enough. If you suffer from depression or emotional suffering, go for mushrooms. Scientists are researching it quite heavily atm.

[MM1988]

I didnt really see the addiction potential other than getting some distance from emotions maybe. But its subjective of course. Bladder problems usually dont occure before heavy daily use.

[Moreira]

Where I live DMT is llegal and 5meo really hard to find and expensive, so I would like to try keta since its more accessible. Does it really helps to our medi-actualized purposes or just colorful patterns and hallucinations?

[MM1988]

@Moreira I cant talk about high doses that would put you in a k-hole (basically make you pass out) but on lower doses there are no colorful patterns or hallucinations. Your vision is affected and things trace a bit if you look around but thats about it visually.

Try it if you can, its worth an experience and not that harmful - recreational doses are way lower than what you would get from a doctor during anesthesia. There is a psychological addiction potential and heavy use will give you serious bladder problems. Its best snorted in small doses with at least 20min between them so you can stop when its too much. Lasts about an hour. It does not have much spiritual potential and is not a true psychedelic.

Edited August 21, 2018 by MM1988

[outlandish]

Ketamine is fucking weird. It's kind of worth trying just to have that different experience, but don't be looking to it for any kind of "raising consciousness". It's got very little in common with 5-MeO-DMT imo, aside from being a mind altering substance - trying to use it as a substitute is just not going to work.

It's not that addictive, but some people definitely get into unhealthy habits with it, so watch out for that. Seems like there's some kind of allure to the dissociated state for some people, and it seems to be one of those drugs you can just keep redosing without tolerance building up.

I'm not into it, but don't regret trying it.

[I Am That]

On 22/01/2018 at 10:38 PM, Azrael said:

I would not recommend to anyone to do Ketamine. Addiction potential is way too high and damages as well. Stick to normal psychedelics, it's enough. If you suffer from depression or emotional suffering, go for mushrooms. Scientists are researching it quite heavily atm.

Yeah mate, all well and good if you are stable enough to experiment with these compounds, some people aren't and it could end in a disaster. One of my best friends experimented with LSD, it fractured his mind completely and ruined him beyond repair. He eventually ended up committing suicide.

 

On 22/01/2018 at 10:47 PM, MM1988 said:

I didnt really see the addiction potential other than getting some distance from emotions maybe. 

Yes well you missed something rather significant there, as that's the very root of addiction- distance from unpleasant emotions. 

 

On 22/08/2018 at 6:51 AM, outlandish said:

it seems to be one of those drugs you can just keep redosing without tolerance building up.

This is utter nonsense and quite frankly a dangerous statement. Please be mindful of making such assumptions. Ketamine tolerance builds up very quickly and this is noted among addicts. This is why you find addicts needing to consume 2, 3 even 5+ grams a day.

[I Am That]

@Moreira
Unless you are suffering from chronic depression or chronic pain, I don't think it's an avenue worth exploring. Even then, you would want to track down a medical professional trained in administering Ketamine infusions. The additional concerns of the purity of street grade Ketamine are too large to ignore. 

[Shadowraix]

From my personal experience I have always seen dissociatives as this cousin to psychedelics and oh boy when you combine the two you get such an amazing result. Never done Ketamine but I have extensive experience with DXM. LSDXM was my first full blown nondual experience.

Its kind of like psychedelics make me hyper aware of my perceived reality but the added dissociation expands the water to explore infinity just a little further than usual.

[GeoLura]

K-hole is amazing for realizing that your reality is not as solid as you think it is. I personally have nothing but good experiences with ketamine. Last time i tripped, i for example: Lived as an Japanese girl in 2100 Japan. It was as vivid as this reality, and it's hard to remember, but it felt like i lived as her for 20 years atleast. Then i went back to my teens and watched myself play bioshock for hours on friday, after school in 2010 . It felt like the trip lasted for a life time, when only ~30 mins were passed and i was so shocked to see that i was just tripping.

[Azrael]

On 13.10.2018 at 1:06 AM, I Am That said:

Yeah mate, all well and good if you are stable enough to experiment with these compounds, some people aren't and it could end in a disaster. One of my best friends experimented with LSD, it fractured his mind completely and ruined him beyond repair. He eventually ended up committing suicide.

I'm sorry for your friend, but that's why all the people warn so deliberately that you should be ready to do this. If you are unstable and do it w/o supervision, you can be fucked for sure.