Elon Musk Life Style

[Leo Gura]

@Edvard When the world is burning to hell, who do you think is gonna get to go to Mars? The compassionate, wise, enlightened people? Or the richest, most powerful, most ruthless billionaire oil tycoons and Trump-like businessmen?

[art]

@Leo Gura WORD! JUST GIVE HIM SOME GOD DAMN 5-MEO ??????‍???‍???✨

[Ananta]

 

1 hour ago, art said:

Wow!

[Edvard]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

@Edvard When the world is burning to hell, who do you think is gonna get to go to Mars? The compassionate, wise, enlightened people? Or the richest, most powerful, most ruthless billionaire oil tycoons and businessmen?

Firstly, Elon Musk plans it to be so that everyone who wants can go, aiming for a ticket cost of eventually $200K, if things go well. I don't know, but my impression is that the least conscious people tend to be the slowest to realize that there is any reason to escape Earth, and religious fundamentalists doubtfully will be the first to leave Earth. So I would expect a population on Mars to consist of only orange+ stage people. Not perfect, but at least humanity survives, and gets a chance to continue its history and develop its consciousness. 

Who knows what the future will bring, and there is really no definite answer. The point is that at some point, the Earth will be unlivable, so having a backup plan seems reasonable to me. Of course, this could have negative effects on lots of things, but when you see how fast technology is accelerating, along with global warming, bacteria resistence, AI, who knows how much time we have? Maybe it's too late. That doesn't mean we should give up Earth, but I think humanity is determined to explore other worlds and eventually star systems out there. So we can't stop this, so what if high conscious people help it instead, making this going more smoothly?

As you have said, any society goes through the different stages of consciousness. The future of humanity, it being on Earth or on other planets, will be a better version of us. If Earth turns out to be doomed, and we don't leave, humanity will go extinct - and that may be fine to some. But if you don't want that... well, what other option is there but leaving?

Edited July 18, 2017 by Edvard

[Ananta]

Interesting, very interesting, I haven't heard of this guy until now. Watched both videos. I don't keep up with science or technology too much and I don't watch the news, so most of this was "news" to me. 

My impression of him is that he's completely driven. I don't think it's for money or power (could be wrong), perhaps status, but I suspect he's brilliant and thats what drives him, he probably has tons of ideas coming to his mind so quickly that he just doesn't have enough time in the day for them all.

 Reminds me of the movie, I think it was called Phenomenon with John Travolta. Where he had a brain tumor and he had all these genius problem solving ideas coming to him at lighting speed and didn't know what to do with them. 

So, I guess it's like any genius type, whether it's math, science, music, art, writing...they are "driven" by the universe. If he wasn't meant to be doing what he's doing, he wouldn't be doing it.

 

 

[Edvard]

His plan.

[Leo Gura]

@Edvard You're missing the point. There is a lesson to be learned from Musk (not the one you think), and you're not learning it.

[Edvard]

@Leo Gura Or maybe I'm caviling too much... ;). People scold me from that sometimes. I just wanted to get to the bottom of whatever lesson you can learn within what we talk about. It's my life purpose, after all. If I spot some seemingly important hole in an argument, I feel a need to understand it deeply. You just seem so sure about everyone. You go right on: «classic workaholic.....». It's fine, but if I'm gonna change my mind about someone I've admired for a long time, I have to go deep with it, from different angles, don't you think?  I'm starting to see it, though... and I do think an Elon Musk lifestyle is stressful, and not that nice, but that's sort of what I have admired about him too. All that he's been through. He's had and has a tough and uncomfortable life. I never really thought that money and success made him fulfilled, but his purpose. Now,  I guess the lesson is that you should spend more time being conscious before changing the world, and that's what you view as important. What stage do you think Musk is at, orange or green (I would guess green)?

Edited July 18, 2017 by Edvard

[art]

@Edvard I admire the especially the younger Musks bravery and"rudeness" in terms of starting risky value-based businesses and challenging established norms.

I consumed a low dose of Al-lad some months ago which made me almost freak out (bad setting) and to calm myself down I saw some youtube clips of trump (what a fucking chimp!!) and musk, and I realized musk is an alpha chimp just mind fucking other chimps. I remember laughing so hard because he challenged the other chimps reality and foundation for alpha-proudness (battery driven cars and making fucking normal people going to mars) 

A way to fuck up and change space hierarchies, oil industries and what a sport car should be

like.

Even he is a genious chimp he is still a chimp?

Just my thoughts. As a chimp I worship him too.

[art]

Well, I guess a solution to this, since he is a critical mind is to give him the right epistomological questions which will show his blind spots and lead him into the path of consciousness.   But seriously though, he has some good thoughts on critical thinking. I think there is much to learn from him in regards of being a visionary, find out how things work and making changes in his fields of domain from a first principle standpoint, rather than by heavily influenced academia, culture, scientists etc. There is some similarities to Peter Ralston methods of investigation, even though it is not as deep. 

Also about making big egos turning to making their egos getting peaks by positive impact on environment and medicine would serve the world better than an ego mind trying to be a old school media- whore like Trump? I may be wrong about his positive impact  on planet earth in the end, but there is a lot to learn from Musk both ways. We can have two conversations here at the same time??‍??‍?

(this is the video I saw on AL-LAD) thinking he was a genious chimp. Charismatic, alpha-chimp wanting to radical change the world. Impact seems like his biggest motivation according to the videos I've seen of him, and his foundation of his biggest companies in Internet, Space, Self-sustaining energy and now AI. Well, give him some 5-meo and some of Leo videos, how about that..

Edited July 18, 2017 by art
Ralston

[Brivido]

On 18/7/2017 at 3:48 AM, Leo Gura said:

You're missing the point. There is a lesson to be learned from Musk (not the one you think), and you're not learning it.

What if Musk is trying to achieve success just for the joy of doing it and success is his personal spiritual practice? (Probably not the case but still) Don't you think that achieving success could be in his own way a spiritual practice? On your path to success you will have plenty of opportunities to destroy your ego.

There are certainly plenty of people who try to achieve success in the wrong way, but I think that is possible to become successful in the right way.

Sometimes you sound a lot like a Zen Devil when you say extreme things such as "successful people are not happy". I personally want to become successful not because I need it to make me happy, but because I still don't want to go spend the rest of my life on a mountain on the Himalayas. I try to become successful as an active meditation. Of course, from time to time I get attached to things but that's the whole point of the practice. 

Saying that successful people are not happy is a dangerous thing. Someone could misunderstand you and think that there is no reason why they should improve their life. And that's what most people that are deep in spirituality already do, they tell lies to themselves to accept the fact that their life sucks. Have a look at the people that go to Eckhart Tolle's events they are just fucking lost. I think there is a middle ground in this paradox of spirituality and success. And it looks like you can't see it. 
 

 

Some jedi shit at minute 40:00, Dominick says that in order to come back from his many injuries he had to let go of the need to be a champion and a fighter. And as soon as he detached his ego from the outcome of being the champion his body started to recover. Spiritual lessons can be learned in different ways, not just by sitting on top of a mountain, anyway that's just my opinion.

[WaveInTheOcean]

On 17/7/2017 at 8:24 PM, Leo Gura said:

Classic workaholic, addicted to success and progress, but lacking consciousness.

Addiction to success isn't about getting more money. It's about addiction to more, more, more...

He's a hamster in a wheel and doesn't even know it.

The proper move for him would be to quit all his businesses and go live in a Zen monastery for 10 years. Then he'd understand what's up. But that's almost impossible for him to do at this point. Because he's so invested in his work and the identity he's created for himself. The media's idolization of him isn't helping. It just feeds into his identity even more.

Can you imagine how psychologically difficult it is for him to abandon everything he's worked to hard to build?

The problem here is really simple: don't confuse success, progress, wealth, or contribution to mankind with happiness, consciousness, or growth. Sounds like this would be obvious enough that such a smart guy as Musk would get it. But it takes real self-honesty and awareness to grasp the significance of something so obvious and counter-intuitive.

The amount of arrogance in this post is astounding.

Consider for a moment, Leo, that you are addicted to becoming enlightened. Like out-of-this-world addicted.

"The proper move for him would be to quit all his businesses and go live in a Zen monastery for 10 years." 

Proper move in relation to what? To his overall long-term happiness? Or To what exactly? Do you really claim to know what will make him most happy in his life? A counter-argument could be that as long as he is pursuing some goals, like working with problems that feels meaningful to him, then I guess he will be pretty happy? Your life problems are related to becoming conscious of reality/seeing through the illusion of separation(/mind/self/ego), and while that problem may be the 'the mother of all games' that you can play in life, it's still a game. We're all playing.

Success can be defined in many ways. Your post reflect that clearly. Don't bullshit yourself that you're not chasing success. It's extremely obvious -- and of course you know this yourself -- that you're chasing success in terms of becoming enlightened/free of self. In other words, you also have a metric of success you judge yourself against, and that metric is to which degree you've dissoluted your ego / how close you are to becoming enlightened.

The funny thing is that you will never become enlightened with this mindset of chasing enlightenment. Give up Leo. Stop bullshitting yourself. After all, the one wanting to get rid of the ego is the ego itself.

[Leo Gura]

4 hours ago, Brivido said:

What if Musk is trying to achieve success just for the joy of doing it and success is his personal spiritual practice? (Probably not the case but still) Don't you think that achieving success could be in his own way a spiritual practice? On your path to success you will have plenty of opportunities to destroy your ego.

No, it's the opposite. It's an escape from spiritual practice.

The mind is extremely crafty. It's sole job is to keep you a hamster in a wheel.

2 hours ago, WaveInTheOcean said:

The amount of arrogance in this post is astounding.

Consider for a moment, Leo, that you are addicted to becoming enlightened. Like out-of-this-world addicted.

"The proper move for him would be to quit all his businesses and go live in a Zen monastery for 10 years." 

Proper move in relation to what? To his overall long-term happiness? Or To what exactly? Do you really claim to know what will make him most happy in his life?

It may appear arrogant, but I'm just explaining a deep dynamic of how the egoic mind works. It's nothing personal.

A proper move in relation to living life and being a good human being. This is not a subjective thing. If he did what I'm saying, he himself would come back in 10 years and tell you, "OMG!!!!! I was so wrong that way I used to live. My life has been saved."

It's sorta like you find a mental patient hitting his head against the wall and you tell him, "Hey, it would be better if you stopped doing that." And he responds, "What?!! How dare you tell me what will and won't make me happy! Do you really claim to know what will make me most happy in his life? You're so arrogant!"

With a bit of awareness, it's not a giant leap to realize that hitting one's head against the wall cannot lead to happiness, no matter how well its done. This is not a matter of personal style or values. It's just a feature of being human. Humans don't like getting their heads beat in.

Success has zero to do with happiness. Success is about ego-perpetuation. Success is specifically designed to NEVER make you happy. Because that's counter to what is necessary for the ego's survival. The ego wants you in constant action without fulfillment. Because fulfillment means the end of action under that paradigm.

Look behind all the sophistication, and you'll see that Elon Musk is just a hamster in a wheel chasing an imaginary piece of cheese. A chimp in outer space is still a chimp.

I don't say that to be mean to Musk. He's a decent guy trying to do the best he can. And he's certainly better than 90% of businessmen out there. But I say it because there's a deep lesson here that you guys are still failing to grasp: the ego utterly dominates all your motivations and desires. So much so that you're having a hard time seeing it. It has corrupted you through and through.

This has nothing to do with me chasing enlightenment. Or trying to preach enlightenment at people. I just understand success. It's EXTREMELY addictive. There's really very little difference between a heroin addict and a businessman, other than how our culture frames it. Except businessmen are actually 1000x more dangerous and harmful to society than heroin addicts.

Start to mindfully observe how every day you're being a hamster in a wheel. You will be SHOCKED at what you find. Don't be surprised if a few days of such careful observation sends you into a depression. That's about appropriate.

Success is like food. Some degree of it is necessary for survival. But you can eat consciously, or your can eat unconsciously the way 99% of people do.

[Edvard]

@Leo Gura But how do you know that Musk is addicted to success? To me it seems like he has created a vision for himself, he really wants to do good, and he doesn't care about money, at least that was his intention. If you read my earlier post, I wrote about him in his young 20's selling paypal for $300M to eBay. He could live off of that his hole life. Instead, he decided to risk EVERYTHING in what he even himself and others thought would most likely fail, and he would spend his LAST PENNY on it. Many times he has talked about it on television, the importance of going for your business idea, pointing out that people are too AFRAID to lose all their money, saying like, "you're not gonna starve to death". If you have read his life story (I don't know if you have), I have read a 400 page book about him, you can't ultimately say that success is what drives him. He has since childhood wanted to make a big impact to the world. Of course, you can't know for sure what his intentions are, you can't read his mind, but saying that Musk is egoic, and that egotism is his problem, to me is just hard to be true. Maybe deluded, maybe thinking about his reputation a little (although, why? He's not stupid, and he can retire and live happily now, he thinks we live in a simulation after all, so reputation is his problem?), but you have no way of knowing that? Is he more egoic than the other silicon valley CEOs who retired after a big win, and didn't want to make a good contribution to the world? 

OK, there is a lesson about egotism for a lot of business people that Musk may seem like, and maybe there is a lesson to learn about how Musk chooses to live his life, but I don't agree that it is because of Musk's EGO. That just makes zero sense if you have read about him and know his life. Sure, some ego he probably has, like everyone elso who aren't enlightened, but his problem in terms of his purpose is not about him wanting success for success itself, but simply for wanting to reach his goal. How is he chasing success? He doesn't personally want money or success, or don't you believe that?

Edited July 19, 2017 by Edvard

[Joseph Maynor]

47 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

No, it's the opposite. It's an escape from spiritual practice.

The mind is extremely crafty. It's sole job is to keep you a hamster in a wheel.

It may appear arrogant, but I'm just explaining a deep dynamic of how the egoic mind works. It's nothing personal.

A proper move in relation to living life and being a good human being. This is not a subjective thing. If he did what I'm saying, he himself would come back in 10 years and tell you, "OMG!!!!! I was so wrong that way I used to live. My life has been saved."

It's sorta like you find a mental patient hitting his head against the wall and you tell him, "Hey, it would be better if you stopped doing that." And he responds, "What?!! How dare you tell me what will and won't make me happy! Do you really claim to know what will make me most happy in his life? You're so arrogant!"

With a bit of awareness, it's not a giant leap to realize that hitting one's head against the wall cannot lead to happiness, no matter how well its done. This is not a matter of personal style or values. It's just a feature of being human. Humans don't like getting their heads beat in.

Success has zero to do with happiness. Success is about ego-perpetuation. Success is specifically designed to NEVER make you happy. Because that's counter to what is necessary for the ego's survival. The ego wants you in constant action without fulfillment. Because fulfillment means the end of action under that paradigm.

Look behind all the sophistication, and you'll see that Elon Musk is just a hamster in a wheel chasing an imaginary piece of cheese. A chimp in outer space is still a chimp.

I don't say that to be mean to Musk. He's a decent guy trying to do the best he can. And he's certainly better than 90% of businessmen out there. But I say it because there's a deep lesson here that you guys are still failing to grasp: the ego utterly dominates all your motivations and desires. So much so that you're having a hard time seeing it. It has corrupted you through and through.

This has nothing to do with me chasing enlightenment. Or trying to preach enlightenment at people. I just understand success. It's EXTREMELY addictive. There's really very little difference between a heroin addict and a businessman, other than how our culture frames it. Except businessmen are actually 1000x more dangerous and harmful to society than heroin addicts.

Start to mindfully observe how every day you're being a hamster in a wheel. You will be SHOCKED at what you find. Don't be surprised if a few days of such careful observation sends you into a depression. That's about appropriate.

Success is like food. Some degree of it is necessary for survival. But you can eat consciously, or your can eat unconsciously the way 99% of people do.

I am fortunate I've never been addicted to success.  I had my head in the philosophy books too much for that.  So I had the opposite problem, kind of an eschewing of success, a pooh-poohing of success.  And that caused a lot of suffering in my life and for my business.  I think there's a balance.  Do your business, but try to keep it as green as possible.  Chasing success was something I was never able to do, although there were moments in my life where I really wanted to.  Those all backfired on me.  Ego ultimately backfires.  Business isn't inherently bad though, as long as you keep your priorities straight and your head screwed on tight.  Business is a way of sharing your gifts with the world.  I have a little business myself which could use a couple heaps of love and care.  We forget that our businesses are like organisms, like systems, which need the right kinds of care to survive, let alone flourish.

Edited July 19, 2017 by Joseph Maynor

[Edvard]

50 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Success is like food. Some degree of it is necessary for survival. But you can eat consciously, or your can eat unconsciously the way 99% of people do.

What about life purpose, what about you telling me to accept drudgery. A funny thing is that you in a video even pointed out these two examples (among some others) of life purposes (this was what I recall you saying, approximately):

* Maybe your life purpose is to build a city at the bottom of the ocean, and presented that as an openminded example, but no problem.

* Maybe you want to make a city on Mars? (No problem there either) 

(Hope it's not too much content)

So if Musk wanted this purpose for his life, watching you videos in his teens, he would take your suggestion but at the same time couldn't listen to what you're saying about how negative the proper life style in order to fulfill that goal is. The way he lives his life is totally in line with this purpose, and now you're saying it's bad? 

(Of course, you made these videos couple of years ago, though, don't know how much you've changed your mind about this since then)

Edited July 19, 2017 by Edvard

[Juan Cruz Giusto]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Success has zero to do with happiness. Success is about ego-perpetuation. Success is specifically designed to NEVER make you happy. Because that's counter to what is necessary for the ego's survival.

Hmm... I agree that no amount of success will make you happy since you will be arriving for more and more, for decades until you finally die. Success without awareness is plain wrong and will create the suffering you are describing.. Ambition is a gift and Elon is a really good example of people who are trying to improve society. 

Having said that, i believe the wisest move is to separate spiritual development/happiness from success.. They are just not in the same line of development. Yes, you can be incredibly successful and not happy at all or you can be a beggar and be extremely and unconditionally happy. We should strive for success and for liberation.. I would love to see a fully enlightened guy being the CEO of a conscious, big and successful company and in my world, these things don't collide.. Just look at Eckhart Tolle, Sadhguru, etc. 

Success is wrong when you do it to be happy but it's necessary if you want to live an abundant life with the freedom you desire (economically speaking). What we have to learn from Musk is that he is definitely not happy since he is not enlightened. Most of what you do before you realize there is no self is fueled with a need for love and happiness.. What we can learn is the ability to be successful.. So I would strive for: Ellen Musk + Enlightenment = Ultimate Life. We definitely need more people as ambitious as Musk but with a high degree of spiritual development because, even though at an absolute level, everything is perfect as it is, at a relative one we are still human beings and we should all try to improve our society. 

 

[ValiantSalvatore]

Who would be a great example for a person who has high consciousness and is also successful in terms of what the "real" world thinks success is? 

I can just imagine authors, writers or musicians someone who has the privilege of a lot of free time. Personally, the best example would be Eckhart Tolle for me or Deepak Chopra. I don't quite understand how being successful in life cannot be combined with a spiritual lifestyle only in terms of time available for a spiritual pursuit. I think it could slow the process of spiritual development down, yet also fuel it to a degree (living in a monastery or so is still way more effective). 

Are there also some people who realize that striving for success is just another illusion and they continue their business out of compassion or they just simply enjoy doing it? I bet there are even if they are rare. I cannot come up with a decent example. 

I googled and found this on Quora: (only read the first comment )

https://www.quora.com/Can-an-enlightened-being-become-successful-in-business

 

[Ananta]

Success is in the eye of the beholder. One cant look at anothers life and call it a success, as you do not have their subjective perspective. Striving for betterment of one's life is part of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Once you obtain one level, their is another, until actualization. 

On a personal note, I was 34 when I went to nursing school to become an RN. I'm now an administrative nurse. I was completely driven back then, I know longer have that kind of drive, but it did allow me to have a career now where I don't have to worry about money, but I'm not an excessive spender either. Having to earn money is part of life, unless you have someone taking care of you. Might as well earn a good living, why not?

 

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Edvard said:

What about life purpose, what about you telling me to accept drudgery. A funny thing is that you in a video even pointed out these two examples (among some others) of life purposes (this was what I recall you saying, approximately):

* Maybe your life purpose is to build a city at the bottom of the ocean, and presented that as an openminded example, but no problem.

* Maybe you want to make a city on Mars? (No problem there either) 

(Hope it's not too much content)

So if Musk wanted this purpose for his life, watching you videos in his teens, he would take your suggestion but at the same time couldn't listen to what you're saying about how negative the proper life style in order to fulfill that goal is. The way he lives his life is totally in line with this purpose, and now you're saying it's bad?

Nothing is bad per se.

Life purpose is one small piece of a larger puzzle. It won't make you truly happy. It's designed to help you pursue success in a better way, but it still has its limits. At least until you realize that success is a hamster in a wheel type of thing. Once you do, you'll still be able to pursue success, but CONSCIOUSLY rather than compulsively. You will stop hoping for success to bring you happiness.

There are different levels of growth and advice. Some is for newbies, some is more advanced.

Someone like Elon Musk obviously doesn't need more success. He's maxed out on it. You, on the other hand, probably need a bit more success in your life. But it still won't make you happy ultimately.

Part of the value of success is acquiring it just to convince yourself that it wouldn't make you happy. Because your mind will not listen to me. You're gonna have to learn this lesson the hard way. But Musk is clearly not learning this lesson. He keeps doubling down on the strategy of: more success! Which is how we know he's a hamster in a wheel.