Are Drugs Really Necessary?

[Jamesc]

I feel as if naturally being sober is the only "state" of being which you can authentically grow in terms of a forever type basis. Becoming enlightened I believe is being able to experiencing non-duality through all preconceived notions of it, the process, in the most comfortable mundane state of mind. That it shouldn't matter what I have seen it to be out of my ego. As that may as well be changing all the time. 

I have been high as a kite in the past and I have had some deep influx emotions that have been on completely new levels but I don't feel as if it matters at all as long as I am forever knowing it gets deeper. 

Edited July 13, 2017 by Jamesc

[Azrael]

37 minutes ago, Jamesc said:

I feel as if naturally being sober is the only "state" of being which you can authentically grow in terms of a forever type basis.

Yeah, that's wrong. Leo has like tons of hours of video explaining how to grow yourself with psychedelics and you'll find a bizzilion trip reports and opinions on this forum. Is it the only way? Of course not. Is it one of the fastest ways? Probably ...

[Jamesc]

1 minute ago, Azrael said:

Yeah, that's wrong. Leo has like tons of hours of video explaining how to grow yourself with psychedelics and you'll find a bizzilion trip reports and opinions on this forum. Is it the only way? Of course not. Is it one of the fastest ways? Probably ...

Fastest way to understand it gets forever deeper? The level to which you are in tune with that? I'm struck.

Edited July 13, 2017 by Jamesc

[Azrael]

Just now, Jamesc said:

Fastest way to understand it gets forever deeper? The level to which you are in tune with that? I'm struck.

5-MeO-DMT.

[Jamesc]

3 minutes ago, Azrael said:

5-MeO-DMT.

That means nothing, at all.

[Azrael]

Just now, Jamesc said:

That means nothing, at all.

I must have forgotten. You tried it 100 times and came to this wise conclusion, I guess.

[Jamesc]

Would it not be an egotistical move to operate on a "wanting to separate myself" in a dual way to experience these things?

Edited July 13, 2017 by Jamesc

[Guest Annetta]

No they are not necessary, do whatever feels right for you on the path.

[Joseph Maynor]

I don't do a lot of drugs and have been making huge progress lately.  I've done psychedelics in the past, so I can draw from that.  Maybe for the most advanced work psychedelics can be useful.  But you can make huge progress with enlightenment without drugs.  What you need to do is change some paradigms.  So it is a belief issue.  A theoretical issue ironically.  The irony is there because after learning the theory and seeing the Truth, you gotta dump the theory.  I can tell you this though -- alcohol destroys consciousness.  Booze is the enemy for mindfulness.  I don't drink anymore, but now I think this is why booze destroys lives and causes a lot of social problems.  Booze and ego go together like ham and eggs.

Edited July 14, 2017 by Joseph Maynor

[Heart of Space]

I've been around the block with psychedelics.  I've done them, I've researched them a ton, I've been around many people who've done them.  

They are useful for showing you something more, and motivating you to find something more.  That's about it.  They don't really give you really any long term growth.  You lose pretty much everything you gained from tripping over time.  You won't hear this opinion a lot from people who've done psychedelics, but that is because most people who use them are either new to them, or don't have a full picture of what these drugs do to you.  

You don't need drugs at all, nor are they a "faster" way of gaining spiritual growth.  I'd recommend if you're going to do them to only do one or two trips and then hang up the phone once you get the message.  You just need one good one and you will have gained everything you can meaningfully gain from these substances.  Or don't use them, that's a perfectly fine path too.  

Not to mention many, if not most users enter what I see to be one of the nastiest spiritual traps after using them.  

Edited July 14, 2017 by Heart of Space

[Dodo]

2 hours ago, Joseph Maynor said:

I don't do a lot of drugs and have been making huge progress lately.  I've done psychedelics in the past, so I can draw from that.  Maybe for the most advanced work psychedelics can be useful.  But you can make huge progress with enlightenment without drugs.  What you need to do is change some paradigms.  So it is a belief issue.  A theoretical issue ironically.  The irony is there because after learning the theory and seeing the Truth, you gotta dump the theory.  I can tell you this though -- alcohol destroys consciousness.  Booze is the enemy for mindfulness.  I don't drink anymore, but now I think this is why booze destroys lives and causes a lot of social problems.  Booze and ego go together like ham and eggs.

If consciousness could be destroyed *

But I get what you mean, more toxic clouds in the sky, covering up the consciousness is better way to put it I think