Explain Gross Vs Subtle Experiences ?

[harisankartj]

In the "fundamentals of self-actualization" page( the "Start Here" tab in actualized.org) , Leo states that one of the biggest traps of this work is 

"Valuing and pursuing gross experiences vs subtle ones."

What can we call gross experience ? What can we call subtle experience ? Are the pleasures of subtle experience truer and more long lasting than the "gross" ones? 

Appreciate any insights on this. 

 

[ajasatya]

@harisankartj i'll give you some examples

• gross experiences:
  • going to heavy parties to get drunk and stunned;
  • being addicted to sexual satisfaction;
  • clinging to massive social/media acknowledgment;
  • craving for material ostentation.
• subtle experiences
  • drinking tea mindfully;
  • talking to other person while making full eye contact;
  • listening deeply to the environment and contemplating your breath;
  • walking slowly without any achievements in mind, not even a place to get to.

[Toby]

What is the difference if someone who longs for a Ferrari and someone who longs for exceptional subtle or mystical experiences? There is none. Both are ego.

[ajasatya]

3 minutes ago, Toby said:

What is the difference if someone who longs for a Ferrari and someone who longs for exceptional subtle or mystical experiences? There is none. Both are ego.

this is a horrible advice for beginners. as beginners, we do need to perform a shift on the things we value in our lives. we need the willpower to go from unhealthy to healthy.

when we play the role of those who provide guidance, it's also a chance for us to expand our own consciousness due to the fact that we need to be truly humble and compassionate, since it's not about our correctness.

[Toby]

I guess you have a different definition of "subtle experiences". You think of them more as "mindful experiences". And from that standpoint I agree with you. I was talking more about things like chasing spiritual highs like bliss which is actually not mindfulness.

Edited July 12, 2017 by Toby

[harisankartj]

@ajasatya Thanks for the  reply. I think i understand now.

@Toby even though its not a "high" i am searching for, its true that i seek some form of satisfaction in life. The satisfaction of "subtle experiences" are kinda new to me,hence my topic.