Examples Of Systemic/ Holistic Thinkers?

[Genghis Khan]

In the Spiral Dynamics theory, each colored stage represents different modes of thinking, or perspectives of the world with different sets of values and behavior. For each stage we find clear examples in the real world, except for the higher stages.

For example, the Blue stage is exemplified by religious fundamentalism, the Amish, authoritarian states, and ideological puritans. Orange is exemplified by shrewd businessmen and corporations, self-interested strategic planners, the Industrial revolution, etc. Green is exemplified by organizations like Greenpeace, hippies, environmentalists, world peace movements, egalitarian and altruistic ideas, etc.

After Green, one reaches the 2nd tier, and there is stage yellow (systems thinking), followed by the turquoise stage (holistic thinking) and at this point there appears to be difficulty in pointing to a clear example of somebody who personifies the yellow stage. It is even more difficult to find someone who is at the turquoise stage.

So in this thread I would like to see if anyone can point me to any famous person who is a good example of a systems thinker (yellow), or a holistic thinker (turquoise).

 

[Dan Arnautu]

@Genghis Khan

• Obama
• Gandhi
• Sadhguru
• Alan Watts

I will edit and add more when they come to mind.

Edited June 12, 2017 by Dan Arnautu

[Joseph Maynor]

Will Durant.  I recommend everybody read "the Story of Philosophy" -- listen to the Audible version.  Also check out his 11 volume magnum opus "The Story of Civilization".  That's also available on Audible.  

Ralph Waldo Emerson.  Read "the Essays".  Also available on Audible.  Read "the Divinity School Address", available online for free.  These works changed my life.

I'd like to carve a middle ground between Will Durant and Ralph Waldo Emerson myself.  That's what inspires me.  The factual mind marries the poetic mind; fact and symbol had a baby.  Not to stereotype either man, since both were very complex.

 

Edited June 12, 2017 by Joseph Maynor

[Juan Cruz Giusto]

Ken Wilber, Eben Pagan, Elon Musk, Da Vinci, many Greek Philosophers, many of the social entrepreneurs are between green and yellow, Einstein are some. 

Careful not to confuse spiritual development with the Spiral Dynamics model.. Their correlation is not tight. 

[Afonso]

Ken Wilber? He has written some pretty good books.

[Genghis Khan]

Some of these have confused me a bit. Obama? How can a modern politician be 2nd Tier?

Gandhi also confused me a bit, he was the same man who said, "Your Petitioner has seen the Location intended to be used by the Indians. It would place them, who are undoubtedly infinitely superior to the Kaffirs, in close proximity to the latter."

May I ask, what is the common criteria to determine, or at least estimate, whether a celebrity is on the 2nd tier of the Spiral Dynamics model?

[Dan Arnautu]

@Genghis Khan Well, if Trump is orange, that does not mean that all politicians are orange. Not all politicians treat problems as superficially as Trump does.

Gandhi, being in the forefront of the indian nation and the nonviolent resistance, sometimes his followers would go amuck and kill guards and other british people (which was against what he preached). He knew that the system (the majority of the indian society) would stop the error (killing guards) if the leader (him) would not eat until the killing stopped. That proved that he looked at the indian nation and his followers as a system with levers that can go either good or bad if a certain decision is made.

The criteria to determine their level in the Spiral Dynamic model is their documented actions and way of approaching problems during their years of active work.

Edited June 12, 2017 by Dan Arnautu

[Genghis Khan]

1 hour ago, Dan Arnautu said:

@Genghis Khan Well, if Trump is orange, that does not mean that all politicians are orange. Not all politicians treat problems as superficially as Trump does.

Gandhi, being in the forefront of the indian nation and the nonviolent resistance, sometimes his followers would go amuck and kill guards and other british people (which was against what he preached). He knew that the system (the majority of the indian society) would stop the error (killing guards) if the leader (him) would not eat until the killing stopped. That proved that he looked at the indian nation and his followers as a system with levers that can go either good or bad if a certain decision is made.

The criteria to determine their level in the Spiral Dynamic model is their documented actions and way of approaching problems during their years of active work.

It's important to remember that what we perceive Trump to be may simply be a result of his public image, and not what his mode of thinking may be in private. The same applies to Obama, who may appear more "high minded" than Trump, but in private he may or may not operate in a fashion that more closely resembles stage Orange. It's easily possible that Trump gives us this perception because his public image is crafted to appeal to an Orange constituency.

Another factor to point out is that thinking in terms of systems (in the sense of calculating decisions based on examining systematic repercussions) is essential to run a modern state, and most heads of state are surrounded by advisors, minimizing any rash political decision. Why wouldn't it be possible for a politician to engage in systemic thinking within their political career, but not in their personal life?

For me, there's so many factors involved that it's very difficult to determine if someone is 2nd tier, unless they have a collection of written work to indicate it.

Edited June 12, 2017 by Genghis Khan

[Vi Gia]

On 13/06/2017 at 1:30 AM, Dan Arnautu said:

@Genghis Khan

• Obama
• Gandhi
• Sadhguru
• Alan Watts

I will edit and add more when they come to mind.

Well, about Gandhi...
I've just read this in the most recent book of Don Beck about Spiral Dynamics (image below).

 

[okulele]

Paul Chek. A holistic coach and an extremely wise man talking about so many aspects of life. Check out his youtube channel, which is mostly fitness based as that is his domain of mastery, but not only.

A great, I dare say, turquoise stage video would be:

 

[Guest Quanty]

Your own breath surpasses all the knowledge of the world. Master it.