Question about why is there something rather than nothing video

[Eskilon]

Just now, Sugarcoat said:

“You are here right now” just because it seems like it doesn’t mean it’s the case

Still if it isn't the case, where is that confusion occuring? Who's really pondering?

[Breakingthewall]

4 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

So if everything would suddenly freeze and be still then that would be nothing?

I thought something is just something limited with a border, separate 

If there is no change there is nothing. Something is limited by the movement, all the reality is vibrating. Is reality would be absolutely still, there is nothing, not limits or differences,  but if in any moment there is movement again, the stillness never happened. As the reality has the potential of movement, it always happen. Saying that movement is illusory or real means nothing, that idea is another movement, another vibration of the reality. 

[Eskilon]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Saying that movement is illusory or real means nothing

It is illusory in the sense that it isnt happening anywhere, and that means it never happened at all.

Your life never happened.

[Breakingthewall]

12 minutes ago, Eskilon said:

It is illusory in the sense that it isnt happening anywhere, and that means it never happened at all.

Your life never happened.

That doesn't mean nothing different that it really happened, this differentiation is something that you are doing. Anywhere or nowhere is the same, movement is and thats it. what would be the difference about if your life is real or not? What means real? Right now movement is happening, reality is flowing, that's everything 

[Nilsi]

1 hour ago, integral said:

@Nilsi the epistemic vocabulary leo has introduced is extremely useful. I think you’re throwing the baby out of the bathwater.

You need to provide a very strong steel man of Leos position in order to get him to acknowledge anything.

Are you serious? I’m not here for his approval.

[integral]

Just now, Nilsi said:

Are you serious? I’m not here for his approval.

I didn’t mean approval, I meant if you want him to see the truth in what you are saying you have to steal man his position.

All I see is you guys disliking what he saying and then shouting your belief louder than he does.

Belief vs belief. That’s not gonna go anywhere.

You have to carefully steal man and pinpoint exactly where truth is incomplete like a surgeon

[Nilsi]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

Nothing escapes logic, it can escape to the logic that I can see, and if you realize that logic is absolutely sublime, finding logical perfection does not flatten beauty but highlights it. Logic is literally infinite. Everything has infinite ramifications absolutely logically synchronized 

I guess I'm just surrounded by autists.

Nothing about consciousness is logical. The fact that experience happens at all - and that it's infinitely deep - is radically alogical. Sure, you can construct logical models about consciousness, explain its function, its structure, whatever. But the raw qualia remain utterly beyond logic. So what are we even arguing about?

[Nilsi]

2 minutes ago, integral said:

I didn’t mean approval, I meant if you want him to see the truth in what you are saying you have to steal man his position.

All I see is you guys disliking what he saying and then shouting your belief louder than he does.

Belief vs belief. That’s not gonna go anywhere.

You have to carefully steal man and pinpoint exactly where truth is incomplete like a surgeon

The reality is, 9 times out of 10 I approach him with respect and empathy - yet it's never reciprocated.

So spare me the moralizing; what kind of double standard are you trying to impose here?

[Sugarcoat]

57 minutes ago, Eskilon said:

Still if it isn't the case, where is that confusion occuring? Who's really pondering?

It’s occuring in me. The two most obvious things are I am and there is something . But that doesn’t mean it’s actually the case

[Eskilon]

11 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

But that doesn’t mean it’s actually the case

How so? You just said there is something. Let's say there's an evil demon tricking you right now, there you have it, an evil demon, and where is here btw? What if there`s an evil demon tricking him too? What if god constructed a dream where there's nothing but demons tricking each other for infinity? But don't miss the point: THE One who's constructing or allowing things to happen, the thing that percolates all layers of deception/dreams, is God. Do you see that the meaning of there's no ground is both there is something and there isnt? That's literally the awe of God

Edited Saturday at 07:39 PM by Eskilon

[Mannyb]

Chill out 

Thats just life 

how about love?

how about not knowing?

embracing the mystery of life 

let’s get together and feel alright 👍 

[Sugarcoat]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

If there is no change there is nothing. Something is limited by the movement, all the reality is vibrating. Is reality would be absolutely still, there is nothing, not limits or differences,  but if in any moment there is movement again, the stillness never happened. As the reality has the potential of movement, it always happen. Saying that movement is illusory or real means nothing, that idea is another movement, another vibration of the reality. 

I know by science that everything is constantly moving but it’s still hard to grasp why it is like you’re saying. It’s hard for the mind to grasp these concepts that are so fundamental 

One thought that came to me is how are we able to recognize change(for example a hand moving) if there is no time? This moment is immediate, but somehow our brain still recognizes change through time. It’s weird 

And yes I agree whatever we say is still within this reality 

[Breakingthewall]

50 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

guess I'm just surrounded by autists.

No, it's just that your understanding is not deep enough 

50 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

Nothing about consciousness is logical. The fact that experience happens at all - and that it's infinitely deep - is radically alogical.

It's absolutely logical and inevitable. The reality is absence of limitations, nothing else. absence of limitations means total potential, it's logical.  total potential is equivalent to the realization of that potential, because nothing is limiting it. Conciousness is nothing special or magic, it's just the perception of the change. If there is potential for change , change is a fact. If change is a fact, change is infinite. If change exist, perception of change is a possibility, then perception or conciousness is an absolute reality totally inevitable. It's logical, simple, inevitable. It's just the reality, what is happening now. 

But look: conciousness, change or movement are not the reality. Are manifestation of the reality. Reality is absence of limits, nothing else. It's logical.

Edited Saturday at 07:58 PM by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

14 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

One thought that came to me is how are we able to recognize change(for example a hand moving) if there is no time? This moment is immediate, but somehow our brain still recognizes change through time. It’s weird 

Time is the same than change, is the perception of the change. Change exist because absence of change is nothing, then if there is absence of change and change ,and change is perceived, there is change, because absence of change can't be perceived. In absence of change conciousness stop, but then it start when there is change, what means that always is change because absence of change is "never", but both are essentially the same essence or nature, the absence of limitations, just that change is perceived and absence of change isn't 

Edited Saturday at 08:04 PM by Breakingthewall

[HMD]

Understanding how everything = nothing is a really advanced thing. It took me a lot of contemplation to reach the point where it clicked. It was an insight rather than a logical conclusion. I think understanding how everything = nothing can’t be done using logic. Understanding the concepts is essential, but the final insight needs to come from beyond concepts (or the rational mind). 
 

Leo gave a great example of this in one of his videos, where he mentioned how a child suddenly grasps (numeric) infinity. You start counting from 1, and after a certain point, the child gets an insight that this never ends. 
 

[Breakingthewall]

@Sugarcoat and another thing. Absence of limitations doesn't mean that everything is possible. Absolute movement is impossible, because is absence of limits there are not references, it's the same here or there, then any movement is relative, that means in relationships with another movement. Then they must be synchronized because if they aren't simply they don't exist because they are relative, not absolute. Then, if there are 2 relative movement, there are infinite relative movement, and all are synchronized, then not everything is possible, only what is synchronized is possible, and all the infinity is already developed, it's not exploring, it's already total, and it's absolutely, impossible to understand and grasp with the mind

[Nilsi]

22 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

No, it's just that your understanding is not deep enough 

It's absolutely logical and inevitable. The reality is absence of limitations, nothing else. absence of limitations means total potential, it's logical.  total potential is equivalent to the realization of that potential, because nothing is limiting it. Conciousness is nothing special or magic, it's just the perception of the change. If there is potential for change , change is a fact. If change is a fact, change is infinite. If change exist, perception of change is a possibility, then perception or conciousness is an absolute reality totally inevitable. It's logical, simple, inevitable. It's just the reality, what is happening now. 

But look: conciousness, change or movement are not the reality. Are manifestation of the reality. Reality is absence of limits, nothing else. It's logical.

This is some of the most vulgar shit I’ve ever read.

Yes, consciousness is pure magic - that was my point exactly. I was speaking to the alogic of qualia, which you conveniently ignored just to tell me I’m not smart enough to appreciate the wisdom of your pre-schooler prose.

Again, I’m not denying that there are logical arguments - even mystical insights - into what consciousness is and why it exists. But the qualia, the sheer fact of experience in all its infinite diversity, remains utterly outside the realm of logic and understanding. That’s what I was pointing to - and what you persistently refuse to engage with.

Edited Saturday at 08:20 PM by Nilsi

[Ishanga]

On 4/17/2025 at 10:32 AM, ShardMare said:

Even nothing, a void is something i get this.

Leo asked in the video What could hold back nothing from spountaneusly turning into something? Leo said: nothing!

But isnt this just a play with words? Just logical reasoning?

If we think in this way then we could ask why would nothing stop being just nothing? Nothing!

This reasoning is kinda like answering with "oh why not?"

And also why does Leo speaks about asymmetry and being biased towards the world (in this situation a void) being just itself and maintaining just that voidness. Whats the problem with that?

And also does this philosophy means that there are infinite amounts of realities? I mean worlds, entities what god can imagine?

 

 

I've studied allot of philosophies and spiritual stories about Creation and Reality, my basic temporary conclusion (which can change at anytime), is that there really isn't "Nothing", there is No Thing meaning a realm of non physicality, non materialism I believe, but what is the void, the space or whatever that was there before Creation happened? IMO it was a Grand sort of Intelligence, Absolute is this Intelligence, its not ruled by memory or has no basis or cause, its just always there, and its a Potential/Possibility Machine for lack of better words...Shiva means "That which is Not", its the Source Code for all Creation, and all Creation has this Source Code encoded within It!

As Human Beings we have the most Potential to be Conscious of this force on this planet, that is all, hence why we have thousands of Spiritual Practices, Methods, Ideologies and tons of Guru past and present to bring it forth into the World so we have a chance to make this place better than it was before and for Absolute to know itself...

[Breakingthewall]

15 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

This is some of the most vulgar shit I’ve ever read.

Yes, consciousness is pure magic - that was my point exactly. I was speaking to the alogic of qualia, which you conveniently ignored just to tell me I’m not smart enough to appreciate the wisdom of your pre-schooler prose.

Again, I’m not denying that there are logical arguments - even mystical insights - into what consciousness is and why it exists. But the qualia, the sheer fact of experience in all its infinite diversity, remains utterly outside the realm of logic and understanding. That’s what I was pointing to - and what you persistently refuse to engage with.

You don't understand , little clown, I'm looking the doors of infinity right now, I'm one with the totality, and I talk from the absolute openenss to the total and unfathomable abyss or the reality. 

But I'm not absolutely open to it in the sense of absence of resistance. I'm still always a entity, someone who wants to survive and put barriers, my heart is not totally open, and the real thing, the absolute, is in the heart. I just become partially open in some moments to glimpse the glory. But even it's divine and total, the absolute fullness is absolutely logical: it's just a absence of limits . In my mind my clarity is close of total, you can see it

Edited Saturday at 08:34 PM by Breakingthewall

[The Crocodile]

6 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

This is some of the most vulgar shit I’ve ever read.

Yes, consciousness is pure magic - that was my point exactly. I was speaking to the alogic of qualia, which you conveniently ignored just to tell me I’m not smart enough to appreciate the wisdom of your pre-schooler prose.

Again, I’m not denying that there are logical arguments - even mystical insights - into what consciousness is and why it exists. But the qualia, the sheer fact of experience in all its infinite diversity, remains utterly outside the realm of logic and understanding. That’s what I was pointing to - and what you persistently refuse to engage with.

👍