How could feelings be just about survival and nothing else?

[UnbornTao]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Time, activity -- same thing.

You are taking time and activity to mean something it doesn't mean.

Activity is Absolute as much as anything else.

Here comes the absolute again, uninvited.

Different words are used for a reason. We live in the relative. A body is different from boredom which is different from yourself, etc. A feeling isn't experienced as not-feeling. We live as having different experiences, which are in part determined or shaped by what they are not. When we feel joyful, we don't say we are experiencing a tree, or hunger, or the color blue. We say we are having a distinctive, particular experience called "joy", even though we might resort to our beliefs or to intellectual games to avoid acknowledging what's experienced "as is". Even the feeling "X" itself is an interpretation. Not saying this is the case for you, but it happens. 

Edited Monday at 02:23 PM by UnbornTao

[Leo Gura]

2 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

Here comes the absolute again, uninvited.

The Absolute invites you to realize that everything relative is Absolute.

[Natasha Tori Maru]

27 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I do not preclude the exploration of feeling, or anything else.

Nor do I preclude the doing of human relations.

It's just a matter of priority and emphasis.

My teachings are not anti feelings nor relations. Those are all part of a well-rounded developmental path.

Just because I don't release many videos about feelings does not mean my work somehow denies or ignores them. I understand their importance, my work just has a different focus.

I guess what I don't understand is, your work is about Truth.

This has to incorporate feeling in some respect.

Unless you are saying, your work doesn't address all aspects of truth? You have a separate focus within truth?

There is a lot of depth to the feeling aspect of existence that I feel is necessary to elaborate on.

The only reason I drill down on this is I feel you haven't given a valid reason to omit this deep dive.

Edited Monday at 04:33 AM by Natasha Tori Maru

[UnbornTao]

27 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

The Absolute invites you to realize that everything relative is Absolute.

At that point why would you contemplate what anything is? Whatever's true must be investigated on its own terms. The question here is: What is feeling?

In any case, a feeling isn't your car, or a body, or a vacation. In your experience, you already live with these being distinct. 

Edited Monday at 04:36 AM by UnbornTao

[Leo Gura]

21 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

At that point why would you contemplate what anything is? Whatever's true must be investigated on its own terms. The question here is: What is feeling?

You can do both and the relative and absolute will nicely connect with each other.

You can eat a sausage from both ends and meet in the middle.

[UnbornTao]

59 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You can do both and the relative and absolute will nicely connect with each other.

You can eat a sausage from both ends and meet in the middle.

But what is feeling -- one's experience of it? 

Edited Monday at 05:38 AM by UnbornTao

[Leo Gura]

24 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I guess what I don't understand is, your work is about Truth.

This has to incorporate feeling in some respect.

Of course.

24 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Unless you are saying, your work doesn't address all aspects of truth? You have a separate focus within truth?

Yes.

Although it's not like I will never talk about feelings. I have and will.

24 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

There is a lot of depth to the feeling aspect of existence that I feel is necessary to elaborate on.

Sure.

And I have so many topics to cover that it will take me years before I get to the topic of feelings.

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

But what is feeling and our experience of it? 

Stick your tongue on a 9v battery and contemplate What is feeling?

Can't get any more direct than that!

Edited Monday at 04:42 AM by Leo Gura

[UnbornTao]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Stick your tongue on a 9v battery and contemplate What is feeling?

Can't get any more direct than that!

So something has to occur for it to take place, then.

Physical sensations are a start, although sensation itself isn't feeling. In your example above, the shock at sensing electricity pulse through the body may be called feeling (or is it still sensation?), and the resulting worry would be an emotion, although that's another topic.

To be clear, some people will hear "not existential" as an invalidation, likely to their belief system in this case, as if the thing were being called false. The assertion here, though, is that no activity is "true" -- it is not existentially the case, but rather comes to exist as a process. What process is that for "feeling"? What comprises feeling?

Edited Monday at 06:10 AM by UnbornTao

[Natasha Tori Maru]

Any-who back to the original topic at hand!

I argue that feelings are a power source or propellant for self will.

Anger over exploitation - take action. Affection for someone - action. Love - care & sacrifice. 

However I do feel that will can overpower feelings. You may break up with someone despite loving them due to incompatibility, or you're tempted to cheat but maintain honesty to your lover. So you choose to take a course of action counter to your feelings. This would be an execution of logic.

However to break the above down further: the decision to impose self will to override feelings is the result of the feeling. 

To impose self will to override feelings is a drive to avoid a feeling. So there is a feeling behind the feeling. 

So what appears as a logical action, is driven by a feeling - avoiding the feeling of 'anxiety' that may result in lack of action.

This is why I feel even logical acts are motivated by feelings.

Cold logic in a detached way is an attempt to control, maintain order. Avoid chaos. 

Also an attempt to avoid anxiety

“Reason is the slave of the passions.” — Hume

 

[BlueOak]

Recently i've been trying to raise my awareness of what exists before sensation or feeling is realised more. I've always done this intellectually to ponder why a feeling occurred or in moments of emotional/visual integration of past memories/trauma, but i've been seeking to experience it more directly.

This relates to the topic, as feelings then become more defined as one of our senses more clearly, which i'd considered before but not subtly tried to experience like this. It also gives some more space to exist. If you've ever sat in meditation and become aware of which part of you a thought originates in, its like that but its seeking whats always present more readily.

[UnbornTao]

[Salvijus]

There is no experience without a feeling. Experience itself is a feeling. Even a no-feeling state is a feeling. Feeling is sentience itself. It's conciousness. It's Knowledge with a capital K. 

Edited Monday at 08:19 AM by Salvijus

[Natasha Tori Maru]

36 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

There is no experience without a feeling. Experience itself is a feeling. Even a no-feeling state is a feeling. Feeling is sentience itself. It's conciousness. It's Knowledge with a capital K. 

I completely agree.

This is just so obvious when I enter coherent meditative states. It simply smacks you right in the face when on psychedelics.

Because I view all as consciousness - even a tree - I don't accept when Leo says 'A tree is not a feeling. I don't know any clearer way to explain it.'

This is why I raised the issue of feelings being defined and framed wrong. That humans have a limited view on what I feeling is.

I raised in a previous post - I view feelings as simply forces arising from thoughts 'electrical impulses' in synapse, with feelings being the 'magnetism' that arises similarly to how electricity through a wire induces a magnetic field. I just think we haven't even tried to understand feelings in any other limited way than some wishy washy feminine crap.

Feelings are just this force that induces coherence in a system. That system could be parts that give rise to photosynthesis of a tree. Or simply someone having the impulse to give another person a hug. 

To my understanding, it is feelings that create coherence in us, which is the tap into ultimate intention & creation.

 

[BlueOak]

50 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Even a no-feeling state is a feeling. 

How so.

[Salvijus]

21 minutes ago, BlueOak said:

How so.

A feeling state feels different than a non-feeling state. All states have a unique taste to it. All Knowledge and experience will have a feeling that tells you what you're looking at. That feeling is infinetly intelligent. It knows everything. It's the intelligence of your heart center. There's is nothing that you can't know via feeling because it's the intelligence of God itself. 

Edited Monday at 08:58 AM by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

44 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

I completely agree.

This is just so obvious when I enter coherent meditative states. It simply smacks you right in the face when on psychedelics.

Because I view all as consciousness - even a tree - I don't accept when Leo says 'A tree is not a feeling. I don't know any clearer way to explain it.'

This is why I raised the issue of feelings being defined and framed wrong. That humans have a limited view on what I feeling is.

I raised in a previous post - I view feelings as simply forces arising from thoughts 'electrical impulses' in synapse, with feelings being the 'magnetism' that arises similarly to how electricity through a wire induces a magnetic field. I just think we haven't even tried to understand feelings in any other limited way than some wishy washy feminine crap.

Feelings are just this force that induces coherence in a system. That system could be parts that give rise to photosynthesis of a tree. Or simply someone having the impulse to give another person a hug. 

To my understanding, it is feelings that create coherence in us, which is the tap into ultimate intention & creation.

 

I agree with what you're saying, feelings being the basis of all activity, but I would give it more devine credit it deserves like this:

"All actions are run by feelings. It's the engine that moves everything. And the ultimate feeling that runs the whole universe is love. Not a single atom in the universe is indipendant from this feeling. Rather the entire existence is a consequence of this feeling. And it is sentient." 

Edited Monday at 09:18 AM by Salvijus

[Natasha Tori Maru]

15 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

I agree with what you're saying, feelings being the basis of all activity, but I would give it more devine credit it deserves like this:

"All actions are run by feelings. It's the engine that moves everything. And the ultimate feeling that runs the whole universe is love. Not a single atom in the universe is indipendant from this feeling. Rather the entire existence is a consequence of this feeling. And it is sentient." 

Agree with this. It aligns for me more as truth. My breakdown was just an attempt to put to words my understanding for any others who require a reframe <3

[Salvijus]

2 minutes ago, Natasha Tori Maru said:

Agree with this. It aligns for me more as truth. My breakdown was just an attempt to put to words my understanding for any others who require a reframe <3

<3

[BlueOak]

42 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

A feeling state feels different than a non-feeling state. All states have a unique taste to it. All Knowledge and experience will have a feeling that tells you what you're looking at. That feeling is infinetly intelligent. It knows everything. It's the intelligence of your heart center. There's is nothing that you can't know via feeling because it's the intelligence of God itself. 

Thank you for your perspective its interesting.

Have you ever experienced trapped patterns of feeling inside yourself from traumas or recurring cycles and patterns?