Russell Brand Charged With Rape In UK

[Princess Arabia]

50 minutes ago, Raze said:

Except women themselves demand men provide for them.

No one is demanding anything. Lots of men are knocking on doors, so to speak, to be able to provide for women. It's usually men who can't afford to, that thinks it's a demand. A provider man will actually leave a woman he's not providing for just to be with one he is. There are lots of men who thrive in this dynamic and will not be comfortable any other way. 

[Raze]

24 minutes ago, Elliott said:

That's not "tying them to railroad tracks".

Tying them to railroad tracks means limiting them to have a lane to be needed to be a “hero” 

[Raze]

Just now, Princess Arabia said:

No one is demanding anything. Lots of men are knocking on doors, so to speak, to be able to provide for women. It's usually men who can't afford to, that thinks it's a demand. A provider man will actually leave a woman he's not providing for just to be with one he is. There are lots of men who thrive in this dynamic and will not be comfortable any other way. 

Then why do women usually ask men to pay for dates and marry men who earn more than them? 

[Princess Arabia]

2 minutes ago, Raze said:

Then why do women usually ask men to pay for dates and marry men who earn more than them? 

Provider men don't need to be demanded and they'll never let a woman pay on a date. I'm saying they're men out there who are automatically like that and don't need to be demanded.

 

[Raze]

Just now, Princess Arabia said:

Provider men don't need to be demanded and they'll never let a woman pay on a date. I'm saying they're men out there who are automatically like that and don't need to be demanded.

 

They are like that because that’s what they think women want. 

[Princess Arabia]

4 minutes ago, Raze said:

They are like that because that’s what they think women want. 

No, because they are real men who understands that they're supposed to provide for their women and family. Men don't go around changing because that's what they think women want. It's just convenient for this to be a belief. A lot of guys are unaware of the different types of men out there. They assume every man, or most, are like them. There are men that thrive by providing. It gets them up and motivates them to succeed.

Edited Tuesday at 10:20 PM by Princess Arabia

[Princess Arabia]

15 minutes ago, Raze said:

Then why do women usually ask men to pay for dates and marry men who earn more than them? 

Also, it's usually the men that asks for a woman's hand in marriage and they're usually the ones that earn more because men like to impress women and feel needed, and it's hard to impress a woman in that way who earns more than you. Its not so much women marry men who make more, but men who make more than them will ask.

Edited Tuesday at 10:26 PM by Princess Arabia

[Raze]

6 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

No, because they are real men who understands that they're supposed to provide for their women and family. Men don't go around changing because that's what they think women want. It's just convenient for this to be a belief. A lot of guys are unaware of the different types of men out there. They assume every man, or most, are like them. There are men that thrive by providing. It gets them up and motivates them to succeed.

you’re proving my point. 
 

2 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

Also, it's usually the men that asks for a woman's hand in marriage and they're usually the ones that earn more because men like to impress women and feel needed, and it's hard to impress a woman in that way who earns more than you. Its not so much women marry men who make more, but men who make more than them will ask.

You are contradicting yourself. In one breath it’s about being a real men in the next it’s all men doing it and nothing to do with women.

That isn’t true. Survey data shows women say they are less interested in men who earn less then them. 
 

This is my point, you can’t complain about men wanting traditionalism to return while also defending men being binded to their own traditional roles as protector, pursuer, and provider. 

[Emerald]

52 minutes ago, Raze said:

Except women themselves demand men provide for them. You yourself reinforce this by saying masculinity is about men pursuing women with investment and being a paternal provider.

It is women who demand of men earn more than them, take the lead, and be protectors. 

When women continue these demands while also removing the male position to do that, obviously men will try to advocate for a rebalanced system.

What I was talking about is the competition that many men feel with the Masculinity of the societal structure itself... and the desire to erode social orders and tear down societal progress in order to re-establish a more rudimentary society that has less Masculine development and therefore more of a need for men to feel burdened to match up to Godlike roles because of the romanticization of those roles.

So, there is an unconscious jealousy many men feel towards Masculine systems (like governments and institutions) and a tendency to want to erode away the Masculine progress we've collectively made over the past several thousand years.

But I did not say that Masculinity is about men investing in women and being a paternal provider. Masculinity is far beyond its function within man/woman relationships... as is Femininity.

Masculinity is systems, algorithms, technology, forward movement, expansion, growth, intellect, abstraction, geometry, initiation, etc.

My advice in the other thread is specifically geared towards help women secure a good partner. So, I recommended asking the questions "Would I be able to be happy with him longterm?" and "Would he make a good father?"

But that doesn't necessarily mean that he has to specifically want to be a father... nor does it mean that the woman necessarily wants to be a mother. It's just a really important question to ask if you're going to consider inviting a man into your life.

But most women do tend to prefer their male partners to take the lead in some ways. But the expectation is typically subtle and reasonable, as most women also want a partner who is her equal.

She may want a guy who's a little taller than her, a little stronger than her, a little older than her, and who makes a little bit more money than her. But unless she comes from a poor background, most women do not desire a super intense imbalance... just a more subtle deferential.

So, women generally do not have Godlike expectations of men. Most women's expectations are pretty realistic.

But there are tons of arbitrary Masculine expectations that tend to be enforced in popular culture and more juvenile Masculine circles where it's like "NEVER SHOW A WEAKNESS EVER OR YOU'RE A WORTHLESS PUSSY BITCH THAT WOMEN WILL NEVER FUCK!"

And that is an intonation of the type of thing that used to be adaptive where men would police the Feminine out of men... but is now arbitrary and maladaptive.

It's just needless stress and shame towards basic human vulnerability. 

[Princess Arabia]

@RazeYou have missed my point entirely. I didn't say it has nothing to do with women. It has a lot to do with women, but not by demand. Also, I'm speaking about men who are already established and making or have the money to do so. If a guy is young and still in the work force trying to make ends meet, it's not expected of him to be the provider. It's that provider men are usually looking for women with standards and who will not settle for less than and they're happy to show that they can foot the bill and be a financial rock for the woman of his dreams. These men love this role, but only for the woman of his choice. 

[Emerald]

5 hours ago, Rafael Thundercat said:

@Emerald amazing summary.  

Thank you!

[Emerald]

5 hours ago, Wilhelm44 said:

@Emerald  Wow, much thanks.

You're welcome!

[Scholar]

On 07/04/2025 at 4:04 PM, Leo Gura said:

@Scholar Sigh...

 

Timestamped. Very funny, this is exactly what you did in the interaction here.