Understanding transgenderism.

[Breakingthewall]

4 hours ago, gettoefl said:

Chasing the preferred gender is all consuming for most people. To become the gender you prefer means you have what you seek in the mirror (and the boudoir of course) with all its allurement, magnificence and potentiality. A new wardrobe and a few surgeries if desired and voila you have solved the fundamental problem of humanity. Now that gender no longer has power over you. You are what you love and you can reap all the benefits.

It's not so simple. People with gender dysphoria truly hate their bodies and their gender and are obsessed with changing them. If you're obsessed with something, you do it. The case of bodybuilders is also extreme: crushing your body to weigh 125 kg of muscle, risking your health, working hours and hours in the gym just for more volume and definition. It's totally crazy, a sick obsession. But that's how the human mind works. Without obsessive people, humanity doesn't advance. I've been quite obsessive in the past and really wasn't very happy, but obsessions are satisfying; they allow you to escape your misery and move toward a golden goal. Then that goal maybe is nothing but the effort is something. 

[Twentyfirst]

The issue with trans is they are such a low population that nobody will ever give a shit

Lets make all the cars miniature because there are a few midget people instead of making all the cars normal size and offering a few accessible custom cars as a side industry 

[Yimpa]

3 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:

The issue with trans is they are such a low population that nobody will ever give a shit

This makes no sense. Trans wouldn’t be one of the top political issue if nobody gave a shit about it.

[Twentyfirst]

1 minute ago, Yimpa said:

This makes no sense. Trans wouldn’t be one of the top political issue if nobody gave a shit about it.

It became an agenda and it got packaged up with other things such as LGBTQ (the T is trans) and woke. Go to a Super Bowl party and ask if they care. They will likely care about the other issues more than the trans specific 

[Aaron p]

It's kinda weird cuz hey I mean people can do what they want...but now they're giving very young people drugs to alter their bio chemistry. 

In the year 2000 there were around 20K us citizens to experienced what was at the time called gender dysphoria, in 2024 that number skyrocketed to 2.3Million. of course then people will say that the reason that this happened is because the publicity and awareness of the subject and its tolerance was raised. The other side of the argument is that it has simply become trendy. 

On an empathetical level, anybody who isn't hurting themselves or others should really be accepted, but on a practical and normal level...it's a bit wacky. Like I see very young men dressing up as women and it is absolutely clear that they have no idea what they're doing... It's like a society has convinced them to completely debase themselves with a head on attack on masculinity. And I also see like 60 or 70 year old men dressing up in pink tights with little white hearts and fake tits with a handbag and sparkly blouses with lipstick. And they are fully aware of what they're doing... I don't know which ones worse.....

Once again it's not affecting me but I mean the idea that gender dysphoria just ceased to exist and now exists as a healthy, natural state under all circumstances... Is just obviously a complete delusion

[Yimpa]

4 minutes ago, Aaron p said:

but now they're giving very young people drugs to alter their bio chemistry. 

I was given antidepressants and antipsychotics and all that crap as a kid and it all failed me.

You’re pointing the blame the wrong way.

[Aaron p]

1 minute ago, Yimpa said:

I was given antidepressants and antipsychotics and all that crap as a kid and it all failed me.

You’re pointing the blame the wrong way.

Yeah I'm well aware that I could be very wrong on this one I haven't done my homework on this topic. Probably should've included this 

[Elliott]

2 hours ago, Aaron p said:

 

In the year 2000 there were around 20K us citizens to experienced what was at the time called gender dysphoria, in 2024 that number skyrocketed to 2.3Million. of course then people will say that the reason that this happened is because the publicity and awareness of the subject and its tolerance was raised.

I mean the idea that gender dysphoria just ceased to exist and now exists as a healthy, natural state under all circumstances... Is just obviously a complete delusion

Gender dysphoria was not diagnosed until 2013

Trans people were mentioned all the way back in the Bible even, ancient greece, ancient egypt. Not that I agree with your numbers, Google doesn't show anything near 2.3 million, but with Conservatives making it the rebel thing to do I'm sure some people do it for that, but it takes a specialized psychiatrist to prescribe any gender affirming treatment, it's not over the counter and doctors can lose their license for harming people.

 

What was the gay population in the 1950s vs now? Who do you think convinced everyone to be gay? And while you're at it, where did the witch population go, and the demon possessed population?

Edited Sunday at 04:58 AM by Elliott

[Twentyfirst]

2 hours ago, Elliott said:

Gender dysphoria was not diagnosed until 2013

Trans people were mentioned all the way back in the Bible even, ancient greece, ancient egypt. Not that I agree with your numbers, Google doesn't show anything near 2.3 million, but with Conservatives making it the rebel thing to do I'm sure some people do it for that, but it takes a specialized psychiatrist to prescribe any gender affirming treatment, it's not over the counter and doctors can lose their license for harming people.

 

What was the gay population in the 1950s vs now? Who do you think convinced everyone to be gay? And while you're at it, where did the witch population go, and the demon possessed population?

In the Bible does it mention those trans taking hormone blockers and going under the knife to switch sex organs or however the surgeries now work?

I think the key to the whole trans thing is just to copy Thailand. Every time I go there I see the trans integrated into society perfectly. Don't try to reinvent the wheel

[Breakingthewall]

What's crazy is giving sex-change hormone therapy to 12-year-olds, and it's done. There are parents who dress 6-year-olds as girls because they feel like girls. Let's see, when you're 6 years old, you don't know anything about that. They're creating people who base their emotional balance on their self-image. It's a symptom of a society centered on narcissism.

The problem with narcissism is that it's synonymous with profound unhappiness. The welfare state seems beautiful from the outside, but from the inside, it's rotten, just like a narcissist.

[Elliott]

4 hours ago, Twentyfirst said:

In the Bible does it mention those trans taking hormone blockers and going under the knife to switch sex organs or however the surgeries now work?

I think the key to the whole trans thing is just to copy Thailand. Every time I go there I see the trans integrated into society perfectly. Don't try to reinvent the wheel

Some castrated themselves. Suicide happened as well. Most transgender today don't get surgery, by the way. And plenty of non-transgender people take hormone blockers, Puberty blockers have been used for decades in cisgender kids who either are going through puberty too early, or, in some instances, kids who are going through puberty very quickly.

They also didn't use any other kind of modern medicine, I'm sure you're opposed to vaccines and cancer treatment too right?

Edited Sunday at 11:34 AM by Elliott

[Elliott]

43 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

What's crazy is giving sex-change hormone therapy to 12-year-olds, and it's done. There are parents who dress 6-year-olds as girls because they feel like girls. Let's see, when you're 6 years old, you don't know anything about that. They're creating people who base their emotional balance on their self-image. It's a symptom of a society centered on narcissism.

The problem with narcissism is that it's synonymous with profound unhappiness. The welfare state seems beautiful from the outside, but from the inside, it's rotten, just like a narcissist.

12 year olds haven't even gone through puberty, they're not getting "sex change hormones".

This stuff isn't over the counter, it's from an endocrinologist and psychiatrist that will lose their licenses if they're reckless.

6 year olds definitely start making decisions for themselves and preferences. I remember crushing on a girl in kindergarten, and I got a love note in 1st grade(7 year olds).

 

This isn't something being pushed by whackjobs, children and people are suicidal and other types of distress. There's thorough testing and evaluation and monitoring.

Edited Sunday at 11:41 AM by Elliott

[D2sage]

14 hours ago, Twentyfirst said:

Trans wouldn’t be one of the top political issue if nobody gave a shit about it.

Except that it wasnt a "political issue" at all. 

Google removed LBTQ, Pride, and Black History month from their calender. Meta now Allows you to call trans people mentally ill.

The mask has fallen of:

THEY NEVER GAVE A FLYING BIRD.

 

Like what's so strange to me is when got caught in a middle of a Pride parade: they used firetrucks and ambulances..

Blocking the road.

Like, we get it ,we get it: you are gay, its fine. But please can you get out of the way so I can get to the grocery store and buy me some milk.

People dont care, its the truth. We have our own demons and problems to think of.

Chop of your dick. Hell, sew in another one. Nobody really gave a flying bird about this. Just look at the tech companies what they did.

Edited Sunday at 11:07 AM by D2sage

[Breathe]

I can relate to what a lot of you are saying here because I felt the same wzy.

• I didn't understand them
• I thought they were mentally ill
• I would not use pronouns

Since moving to a city with lots of trans people, being around them a lot, them being kind to me, I now support them.

I don't care what the reason is, I will be kind and respectful and treat them like people deserving lo love and respect. The same as all of you hjere

 

Part of growing up is love , tolerance and accepting of people who are different from you. Don't forget that

[Breakingthewall]

45 minutes ago, Elliott said:

12 year olds haven't even gone through puberty, they're not getting "sex change hormones".

This stuff isn't over the counter, it's from an endocrinologist and psychiatrist that will lose their licenses if they're reckless.

6 year olds definitely start making decisions for themselves and preferences. I remember crushing on a girl in kindergarten, and I got a love note in 1st grade(7 year olds).

 

### **1. Types of Treatments and Typical Ages:**  
#### **a) Puberty Blockers (GnRH Analogs):**  
- **What they are**: Medications that temporarily pause puberty (reversible upon discontinuation).  
- **Ages**:  
  - **Netherlands** (pioneering protocol since the 1990s): Initiated around **Tanner Stage 2-3** (ages 9-12), after psychological evaluation.  
  - **UK**: Until 2022, the *Tavistock Clinic* prescribed them starting at age 12, but the **Cass Review** (2022) recommended restricting their use to research settings.  
  - **Sweden** and **Finland**: Since 2021–2023, limited to clinical trials or exceptional cases.  
  - **Spain**, **France**, and **Germany**: Permitted from age 12 with parental consent and multidisciplinary assessments.  

#### **b) Cross-Sex Hormones (Testosterone/Estrogen):**  
- **What they are**: Hormones that induce secondary sex characteristics of the desired gender (partially irreversible).  
- **Ages**:  
  - **Netherlands**: From **age 16**, after years on blockers and rigorous evaluation.  
  - **UK**: According to the *National Health Service (NHS)*, only from **age 16** (with parental consent for minors).  
  - **France** and **Spain**: Similar to the Netherlands (16+), though exceptional cases have reported starting at **14–15 years**.  
  - **Sweden** and **Finland**: Since 2022–2023, restricted to **age 18+**, except in clinical trials.  

#### **c) Gender-Affirming Surgeries:**  
- **Ages**: Rarely performed on minors under **18** in Europe. Exceptions include mastectomies at 16–17 in the Netherlands with judicial approval.  

---

### **2. Documented Cases and Controversies:**  
- **UK**:  
  - The closure of the *Tavistock Clinic* (2023) following the **Cass Review** revealed that between 2011–2021, **2,383 minors** received puberty blockers, and **1,334** received cross-sex hormones (mostly over 16). Only a handful under 13 were prescribed blockers, linked to precocious puberty.  
  - *Detransition* cases (e.g., **Keira Bell**) fueled criticism of inadequate evaluations.  

- **Sweden**:  
  - The *Karolinska Hospital* (Stockholm) halted blockers and hormones for under-18s in 2021, except in trials, citing unstudied risks (e.g., bone health, psychological impact).  

- **Spain**:  
  - Units like *Hospital Sant Pau* (Barcelona) report starting cross-sex hormones at **16+** after 2-year evaluations. The 2022 *Trans Law* allows access from **age 16 without parental consent**, though this remains contentious.  

---

### **3. Key Regional Differences:**  
| **Country**     | Puberty Blockers                              | Cross-Sex Hormones             | Notes                                  |  
|------------------|-----------------------------------------------|---------------------------------|----------------------------------------|  
| **Netherlands**  | From ~9–12 years (Tanner 2–3)                | ≥16 years                      | Pioneering protocol, now scrutinized for lack of long-term data. |  
| **UK**           | Restricted to research (post-Cass Review)    | ≥16 years (with restrictions)  | NHS reviewing all prior cases.         |  
| **Sweden**       | Only in clinical trials (since 2021)         | ≥18 years                      | Most conservative policy in Europe.    |  
| **Spain**        | ≥12 years with consent                       | ≥16 years                      | Trans Law (2023) sparks debate.        |  
| **France**       | ≥12–14 years with evaluation                 | ≥14–16 years (rare exceptions) | National Academy of Medicine urges caution (2022). |  

---

### **4. Controversies and Current Trends:**  
- **Growing Scrutiny**: Countries like the **UK**, **Sweden**, **Finland**, and **France** have tightened policies, citing:  
  - Lack of robust evidence on benefits vs. risks (e.g., 2023 **Nordic Council of Ethics** report).  
  - Exponential rise in cases (e.g., UK saw a 1,000% increase over a decade).  
  - Concerns about rushed diagnoses and detransition rates.  

- **WHO Stance**: In 2021, it declassified gender dysphoria as a mental illness but offers no specific guidelines for minors.  

 

Edited Sunday at 11:49 AM by Breakingthewall

[Elliott]

47 minutes ago, D2sage said:

Except that it wasnt a "political issue" at all. 

Google removed LBTQ, Pride, and Black History month from their calender. 

The mask has fallen of:

THEY NEVER GAVE A FLYING BIRD.

The Trump administration threatened to sue them and break up google and meta if they didn't. 

Edited Sunday at 11:53 AM by Elliott

[D2sage]

1 hour ago, Elliott said:

The Trump administration threatened to sue them and break up google and meta if they didn't. 

They were going to do this in mid 2024 before the election. In addition they are saying these holidays were "unsustainable" which makes zero sense. This seems more like the reps of Google trying to spin reasons for why they are doing this.

They said it was to make this change globally to align only to calendar events listed on timeanddate.com.

And trump was threatening to sue and break Google Chrome, the web browser. 

Edited Sunday at 12:14 PM by D2sage

[Elliott]

@Twentyfirst @Breakingthewall

 

[Elliott]

28 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

 

### **1. Types of Treatments and Typical Ages:**  
#### **a) Puberty Blockers (GnRH Analogs):**  
- **What they are**: Medications that temporarily pause puberty (reversible upon discontinuation).  
- **Ages**:  
  - **Netherlands** (pioneering protocol since the 1990s): Initiated around **Tanner Stage 2-3** (ages 9-12), after psychological evaluation.  
  - **UK**: Until 2022, the *Tavistock Clinic* prescribed them starting at age 12, but the **Cass Review** (2022) recommended restricting their use to research settings.  
  - **Sweden** and **Finland**: Since 2021–2023, limited to clinical trials or exceptional cases.  
  - **Spain**, **France**, and **Germany**: Permitted from age 12 with parental consent and multidisciplinary assessments.  

#

Puberty blockers are not sex change hormones, cis gender, non-transgender kids have taken them for decades.

Edited Sunday at 12:18 PM by Elliott

[Elliott]

Just so we're clear here.

@Twentyfirst @Breakingthewall

You're advocating against treatment that prevents suffering, and suicide even, without you ever doing any research on this subject. You're advocating for people to be harmed.