Killing vs Sexual Violence: why is one more acceptable?

[integral]

In movies, we often depict killing all the time effortlessly in every horrific way possible killing and torture are shown in movies and none of us seem to take offence to it.

But sexual violence in any kind is normally avoided at all cost and great lengths are taken to remove this kind of material from book adaptations.

There’s always issues when race or sex is involved in a controversial way in movies, but killing in every horrific form of it gets no attention at all. It’s completely normalized.

Why do people have such a resistance to sex but not to killing?

Why is sex offensive but not killing?

Edited March 6 by integral

[integral]

OK, so it’s about the context.

If a person is fighting to the death in a war scenario, then there’s justifiable reason for them to die and it can be exciting and interesting to watch

But sexual violence, it’s impossible to depict it in a justifiable way, making it uncomfortable for the viewer to watch

If killing is depicted in a violating way or something is being taken, then it can make the person feel uncomfortable.

So it’s the depiction of someone being violated that we are rejecting.

killing can be depicted as heroic while sexual violence can never be depicted that way.

The twist is: we don’t view killing as selfish most of the time, but we view sexual violence as always selfish in every scenario.

Edited March 6 by integral

[Eskilon]

@integral I think a factor is that we don't see sexual violence outside the human domain. While we do see a lot of killing happening in nature. So for us that feeds into our minds that killing, while ugly, it's justifiable because to survive we need to kill(meat eaters and stuff like that), but we do not need to abuse someone sexually to survive.

Edited March 6 by Eskilon

[Leo Gura]

A boobie is more offensive than a bullet to the head.

Puritan logic.

Edited March 6 by Leo Gura

[Letho]

@integral Both are forms of objectification, just with different philosophies.

It’s a fine line between defacing dignity and being reduced to pure utility.

We want the means and the end to align. When they don’t, we ask, did the end justify the means, or did the means corrupt the end beyond redemption?

Understanding this frames all future simulations of what we consider acceptable or unacceptable, assuming all things are equal.

A gun to the head, I could push out a formula. But if AI could do the same, would anyone care if I was gone?

[Shodburrito]

@integral

 

I believe it reflects our collective relationship with distance and intimacy. Violence in film allows us to maintain psychological separation—we process it as "happening to others" and thus comfortably distant from our personal reality, while sexual content breaches this boundary by connecting to our most vulnerable, intimate experiences that can't be easily compartmentalized.

This isn't coincidental but mirrors how our consciousness processes different types of human experience—violence reinforces our sense of separateness while sexuality threatens the dissolution of the boundaries our egos maintain. The resistance isn't to the acts themselves but to what they represent in our emotional landscape: we readily accept content that preserves our psychological defenses while rejecting that which might force us to confront our authentic vulnerability and interconnectedness.

[manuel bon]

 

9 hours ago, integral said:

we don’t view killing as selfish most of the time

When you're dead your family suffers, but you don't. It's easy to not get personified with an irrelevant character (or their family) that dies in a book or movie. Rape is more intimate, it's also a psychological kind of abuse, and even if it's an irrelevant character you still feel them cause it's so deep. 

I would prefer to be killed than being raped (I know it's selfish to some extent, but still).

[gettoefl]

The abused will speak and one day you will get your comeuppance.

The killed haven't a voice or a lobby so you are safe from them.

Moreover, to depict killing and/or violence means you are are somehow endorsing it.

Killing won't come back to harm you but violence may very well do so.

Seeing violence normalises violence.

The only people who can depict violence and get away with it and those who suffered at its hands.

Even they will often be terrorised. 

Watch oscar-nominated Black Box Diaries to see how a Japanese rape victim took to the big screen and has been made a pariah because of it.

Edited March 6 by gettoefl

[Lise]

Are all of you cis, hetero men? Because perhaps the truth is this: as humans, it's natural to grab the most we can. We don't try to combat the privilege that benefits ourselves, and sometimes we think we're virtuous and combatting privilege when this again becomes a kind of way of having privilege. Sexual violence is a kind of grabbing the most you can while killing can be kind of selfless. And we're all guilty of trying to grab the most we can, in the sexual domain this is especially over represented by cis, hetero men, with all of the negging and the banality of rape. Damn, the end to which somebody can be oppressed so that another group can grab the most they can is almost limitless. And this is a part of the human nature residing in us all. When we all want to deny the ability in us for sexual violence, the truth is that it hits a nerve.

[gambler]

On 3/5/2025 at 8:35 PM, Leo Gura said:

A boobie is more offensive than a bullet to the head.

Puritan logic.

How so? You have to go to the dark web to see that shit, whereas you can view a boobie in a playboy magazine off the shelf of a store. 
 

When you depict violence in movies, it’s all fake. No head is actually being chopped off. A boobie however will make you pickup on sex signals. That’s real. That’s not fake. So you’re comparing fake vs real. And when you’re with a group watching a movie, I don’t think you came to fight back your penis from slowly growing in length down your thigh. 

Edited March 21 by gambler

[Yimpa]

On 3/5/2025 at 7:35 PM, Leo Gura said:

A boobie is more offensive than a bullet to the head.

Puritan logic.

 

Edited March 21 by Yimpa

[Ulax]

Id say it’s because sexual violence dehumanises. It is the sheer use of another person and strips the victim of their dignity.

Murder doesn’t seem to me to really dehumanise so much. But I agree with gettoefl also on the dead don’t talk point to 

[Aaron p]

It's all completely imaginary. A lot of what people call rape and sexual assault these days (like a guy having sex with his sleeping gf, or hand placed on a specific bodily area at an incorrect time) is nothing other than exaggerated horse shit and it only becomes "traumatising" for the "victim" when they are told to be traumatised, almost as if the people involved are intentionally going for dramatic effect. To me it points to major collective and individual psychological immaturity. Unbelievable levels of immaturity. 

I'll be a proud owner of the following statement: sexual assault is massively exaggerated in society today. MASSIVELY. Much of the time It's not as big of a deal for the people it happens to than what we and they are being led to believe and is only as big as it is today because jackass governments, with high degrees of idiocy, have put a LOT of money and effort into making it look as bad as possible... probably because it makes them a lot of bonuses of the cash money variety. "Ohhh you can't say something like that in this day and age". Watch me.

Most cops involved either consciously or subconsciously know this of course...but why would they stand up against mainstream dumbassery (that is extremely damaging)...when that would risk their comfortable job, their nice salary and their convenient government pension. "Who cares if our inaction destroys people's lives. Nah, let's just keep rolling with it...don't rock the boat." 

The only caveat I'll add to my statement is that I have major respect for law enforcement entities that do stand up for it. Though they are few are far between. The real heros that put the lives of young people above their profession stability. These kinds of agents are badasses of the Sylvester Stallone variety.

Edited Saturday at 05:38 AM by Aaron p

[Basman]

6 hours ago, Aaron p said:

It's all completely imaginary. A lot of what people call rape and sexual assault these days (like a guy having sex with his sleeping gf, or hand placed on a specific bodily area at an incorrect time) is nothing other than exaggerated horse shit and it only becomes "traumatising" for the "victim" when they are told to be traumatised, almost as if the people involved are intentionally going for dramatic effect. To me it points to major collective and individual psychological immaturity. Unbelievable levels of immaturity.

The problem is it is often very hard to prove for or against sexual crime by nature. The legal system just isn't well equipped to deal with rape. I think people tend be a bit puritanical in order to compensate. 

You have to be careful about making broad sweeping generalizations in the opposite direction because it delegitimizes victims in a he-said-she-said situation.

[Schizophonia]

Because sex is too intimate, so it doesn't add anything to a film.
Netflix movies throw sex scenes everywhere, but that's because the directors are far-left fanatics, there's an agenda, otherwise it's pointless.

War, on the other hand, is easy to identify with and it's pleasant, at least if you're an average man.

Edited Saturday at 06:37 PM by Schizophonia

[Aaron p]

8 hours ago, Basman said:

The problem is it is often very hard to prove for or against sexual crime by nature. The legal system just isn't well equipped to deal with rape. I think people tend be a bit puritanical in order to compensate. 

You have to be careful about making broad sweeping generalizations in the opposite direction because it delegitimizes victims in a he-said-she-said situation.

(This set of insights is extremely selfless and accurate and will likely trigger many egos)

Yeah bro that's why I used the word "much" of course there are many legit cases, but the government have not yet found a way to deal with evil people (many of whom are female) who are either extremely mentally ill or just insanely sadistic to exaggerate or fabricate information to policing bodies. I think some people just have so little going on in their lives or their identities are so unfound and hopeless that they need to find their abuser so they can claim "some" form of an identity (in this case a victim identity). Very central truth in a lot of emerging cases these days. This doesen't discount from the legitimacy of real cases, but young mens lives are being annihilated over exaggerations.

First and second wave feminism was extremely good and wholesome, but now much of third wave feminisms is just predicated on the single central assumption that all men are bastards.

These kinds of people will seriously need to watch their backs over the next 40 years as the pendulum will inevitably swing back in the opposite direction, likely causing themselves a degree of destruction.

 

Edited Saturday at 08:01 PM by Aaron p

[Basman]

1 hour ago, Aaron p said:

Yeah bro that's why I used the word "much" of course there are many legit cases, but the government have not yet found a way to deal with evil people (many of whom are female) who are either extremely mentally ill or just insanely sadistic to exaggerate or fabricate information to policing bodies. I think some people just have so little going on in their lives or their identities are so unfound and hopeless that they need to find their abuser so they can claim "some" form of an identity (in this case a victim identity). Very central truth in a lot of emerging cases these days. This doesen't discount from the legitimacy of real cases, but young mens lives are being annihilated over exaggerations.

Women are more likely to under-report sex-crimes than make false allegations. Legit rape reports hardly lead to any charges let alone false allegations. The majority of false accusations don't even name anyone. Don't blow things out of proportion.

Edited Saturday at 08:36 PM by Basman

[Aaron p]

3 hours ago, Basman said:

Women are more likely to under-report sex-crimes than make false allegations.

Correct. But they do make fabricated or exaggerated allegations. Also males do it now too so it's not just girls.

3 hours ago, Basman said:

Legit rape reports hardly lead to any charges let alone false allegations.

This depends on where your from. Many legit perps don't get charged yes but have you considered the teenaged adult who's religious parents never educated what consent was...or that they just advanced too fast in a sexual interaction... Or perhaps the man who has consensual sex with a woman who has had six glasses of wine as opposed to four. That a simple lack of mindfulness or social skills could result in growing numbers of young people to be forced to live as rapists. And what about the straight up false allegations... What happens when they lose their careers and families and experience permanent psychological devastation? Even if found innocent. People will assume the results are just as you've described...incorrect. these are innocent lives being devastated (targeting young people who don't understand it).

3 hours ago, Basman said:

The majority of false accusations don't even name anyone.

Well either your country or region operates differently to mine and many countries I see this happening in, or your statement is inaccurate. Could you substantiate your claim that false allegations don't name people..

3 hours ago, Basman said:

Don't blow things out of proportion.

This statement reveals to me that you have not been deeply exposed to the reality of how much damage this area can truly inflict. Society just brushes this extreme damage under the rug so that well off people don't have to think about it. 

Edited Sunday at 12:17 AM by Aaron p

[Basman]

17 minutes ago, Aaron p said:

This statement reveals to me that you have not been deeply exposed to the reality of how much damage this area can truly inflict. 

You have to put things into proper perspective though. More people are maimed and die in traffic accidents than there are men who's lives are ruined by a false allegation, but no one is saying that society is falling apart because of cars (unless you're Dutch). In a sense, it is a cost we've accepted because cars are that useful to us. False rape accusations only represent 2-10% of all accusations while overall accusations that lead to actual charges are rare. And that is before accounting that sex crime is overall highly under-reported. You could rape someone today and odds are you would get away with it.

If you want to end false rape allegations then you have to solve the inherent difficulty of processing sex crime so it is less of a murky he-said-she-said affair. You would have to figure out a way to reliably extract hard evidence of a crime while also protect victims from negative social stipulations for reporting rape. Then it would be a matter of just presenting the evidence. But that is almost an impossible task.

28 minutes ago, Aaron p said:

Well either your country or region operates differently to mine and many countries I see this happening in, or your statement is inaccurate. Could you substantiate your claim that false allegations don't name people..

I can't find the source where I read that right now. Sorry.

[Aaron p]

So firstly id like to just say thank you for your cordial replies, it's nice to be able to have a genuine intelligent conversation about a subject that can be somewhat emotionally charged and polarising.

So in the UK in 2024 there were a recorded 67,460 reports of r made to the police. 2% - 8% of which is estimated are false allegations.With 2% - 3% of being convicted. 98% - 99% of which were male with the "vast majority" of accusers being female. (Per year)

So that's 67460 r allegations, 1349-5397 of which are estimated to be fabricated, with around 66111 not convicted for any reason. (Per year)

So my first observation is that we have a broken system. Quite clearly. In the UK it's safe to assume that many (probably most) of these are published and the UK names and shames people, the outlets also freely fabricate additional facts that the "perpetrators" can do nothing about...if they contact the outlets the outlets just report again. 

So we are talking realistically estimated around 2000-4000 innocent [mostly] males per year who have been reported as having been investigated for r per year. Also just because there are more people who have their lives destroyed by car accidents doesn't mean that we can continue allowing a broken system to destroy three thousand innocent men's lives every year. 

I see what you're saying and I of course deeply empathize with people who have horrific rape experiences and the terrible trauma that causes. But let me illuminate something about this system using the base statistics. 

As you have quite correctly stated, and as the statistics back up, in the UK at least around 97% of cases are not convicted. The police are aware of this statistic, as such they rely on media reporting to be a strong deterrent. It would definitely be fair to say that the media reporting is probably the strongest thing the police are leaning on to to combat this problem. I think this is quite obvious. The problem is they are reporting on hundreds of thousands of men over the years who have been investigated but not been convicted and tens of thousands the police know are innocent over the years. And there are no doubt multiple thousands of people who we have labeled perpetrators who simply don't understand that if they have sex with a girl after having 4 glasses of wine, then have sex with her again after she has 2 more...their careers could be ended, their family relationships could be ruined, the legacy that they have worked their entire lives to create could be annihilated. And by such a simple mistake (possibly galvanised by a sadistic female).

Put yourself in this man's shoes... He has now been convicted of r because he had sex with her again after she she two more glasses of wine. How does this man's daughter feel about her daddy who is now a convicted rapist and how does the mother feel, looking at her newly brandished rapist of a son. After he is forced to leave his job, he'd be lucky if he could get a job in McDonald's as a newly convicted rapist. 

Or the young person who places a hand on a girls body too fast during kissing. How does this young person now feel about his future as a freshly convicted S.O and his prospects of becoming a doctor half way through his $10,000 medical degree, let alone being completely isolated and branded as a pervert or creep or deviant in front of all of his friends. At a young age this kind of material is extremely devastating.

Society's current strategy in combating this is to report on everyone (or most) equally. In the UK they are named and shamed. The psychological ramifications are instrumental and monumental. 

And in relation to how I would go about fixing this situation... Ultimately I don't know how to fix the situation, but I'm intellectually rigorous enough to be able to identify that there's a massive problem. I think firstly dropping labels and category names that are so unnecessarily triggering or at least modifying the names of the convictions to be more specific rather than giving the same conviction name to a 16 year old who doesn't understand consent and a 60 year old who premeditatedly r'ed a 20 year old. Also I think launching a massive media campaign in all schools giving extensive education to people who have reached a certain age. And I'm not talking about the birds and the bees, I'm talking about the slip up areas that exist in reality (having sex with drunk girls, learning that consent can be withdrawn halfway through an interaction and that this can be completely nonverbal, I'm talking realistic detail). This would be a decent start. 

Edited Sunday at 02:00 AM by Aaron p