Re: Day 7 & 9 Retreat Vlogs

[Epiphany_Inspired]

When Leo spoke about issues with the creative mind, my first thought was that it sounded just like one of my anti-meditation excuses (even though Leo is a meditation-super-hero and my meditation is pretty pathetic for the most part)...luckily he explained that...and I look forward to the creativity video...

Anyway, what I'm wondering is: Have I been going about meditation all wrong? Is there a totally different way to meditate that is better for creatives? I just got 2 new books on the subject last week, neither seem to mention the creative mind (in headings anyway)...I was already feeling confused before Leo's new video/vlogs...considering my creative mind....regular meditation is actually a form of torture for me...whereas on the occasion that I have a binaural-beat induced energetic visualization it's absolutely incredible...powerful and universally unifying...these are not like visualizations for goals...it's as though I am energetically able to tap into my higher-self and become/absorb, and even send out energy...(lol...i'm just realizing that it may sound totally crazy if you haven't experienced this...lol...)...but I can actually see this in my minds eye....this is obviously not as common for me as fending off monkey mind...There are obviously many things that I don't know, or understand....any thoughts are appreciated, thanks!

p.s. yes, my child needs less ipad...they all do...

[Epiphany_Inspired]

Google has tons of links to ways that meditation can invoke and improve creativity...it's supposed to be great for this, re-wiring your brain into a more creative mind...but I see NO links on *how to supress creativity to calm your mind*.... For example, I can't even focus on  an imagined orange, without it animating, zooming into pores...eventually it would start rolling down things... turn into a dodge ball game with elves, or an edible orange airship, etc...this is creative, but likely just as monkey-mind-distracting as not concentrating on an orange at all....Is it possible to be too distractedly creative  to ever meditate successfully? If it is possible, how do you block creativity to meditate and concentrate?

[Leo Gura]

You just need to buckle down and stick to one technique rigorously for a while.

You can choose any one of the following:

• Following the breath very mindfully, noticing it go in and out of your nose
• Mindfulness using labeling, and select a specific domain to label like body sensations or external sounds
• Concentration practice using metronome sound
• Mantra meditation: select a single mantra like: bah-ring, bah-ring, bah-ring... and do it very rigorously

Do one of those rigorously every day for a month, and then see how you're doing.

This requires 100s of hours of practice to start to re-shape your mind patterns. Getting started is the hardest part. Doing a retreat where you do nothing but this for an entire week is the best way.

[d0ornokey]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You just need to buckle down and stick to one technique rigorously for a while.

You can choose any one of the following:

• Following the breath very mindfully, noticing it go in and out of your nose
• Mindfulness using labeling, and select a specific domain to label like body sensations or external sounds
• Concentration practice using metronome sound
• Mantra meditation: select a single mantra like: bah-ring, bah-ring, bah-ring... and do it very rigorously

Do one of those rigorously every day for a month, and then see how you're doing.

This requires 100s of hours of practice to start to re-shape your mind patterns. Getting started is the hardest part. Doing a retreat where you do nothing but this for an entire week is the best way.

I see you haven't included the do nothing technique? I have been doing this for 2 months now 

[Leo Gura]

@d0ornokey The do nothing technique is not good for building concentration and this problem with over-creativity.

[Epiphany_Inspired]

Thanks so much for you responses everybody! @Leo Gura Are you saying time alone "cures" over-creativity in meditation? For example, with a metronome, my mind can't help but hear songs form between/ using the beats (like hearing songs in my windshield wipers, raindrops, cat's thumping tail, etc). Silly question, but can this damage/ supress my creativity long-term? Sorry Leo, I actually have an irrational fear of meditation, I realized that it stemmed from meditation trauma when I was 12. My mom had meditation CD's, I though it must be cool...for some reason thought it was something to listen to in the bath, fell asleep, and almost drowned...I'm always thinking, ridiculously & without warrant, that meditation may be harming me...lol...

[Leo Gura]

@Epiphany_Inspired Blah, blah, blah... Monkey mind, monkey mind, monkey mind...

Sit down and discipline yourself. That needy ego has made you weak and soft and fearful. Stop feeding it. Now is where the mind needs to realize the limits of thinking, and just start taking action. You're not going to think your way out of this.

When you're this weak, your creativity is lame.

[Epiphany_Inspired]

@Leo Gura Thanks,  I don't disagree....I can take it...though that was a bit wasabi...lol....but fair enough, we must annoy the shit out of you especially after a retreat like that!

it's hard for me to perceive that the cool part of my mind, that can magically hear a diverse travelling song in a metronome tick-tock is also my weak, fearful monkey mind...trying to shift that perception...thanks ....action is another issue altogether...

I only seem to have discipline for things I enjoy (but it can be an insane amount of dedication if I love it), sometimes they are mind-numbing repetitive things and the enjoyment of the result is enough...my only more extended meditations were *enjoyable (energetic/ visual adventures)...but I can't have only those...so, I'll either have to find a way to perceive the torture type meditation as enjoyable, or perhaps I'll have to trust in the enjoyment I *would feel as the result of more discipline...(in order to access & build my discipline power)...alternately, I could attempt to learn discipline with no enjoyment from it, ever,  but that would be the trickiest.... thanks for your tough love (though I prefer the tender sort when possible), and for your guidance  

[Epiphany_Inspired]

If anyone else has this issue, I think I understand more now:

Creativity, even when it's distracting, is never actually the monkey mind directly...but because it's divine and powerful, the monkey mind can hijack creativity for it's nefarious distraction purposes....

Also, it was only the last line that Leo wrote that "burned my nostrils" lol...I was not offended, but it kind of rubbed me the wrong way....I contemplated why:

Personally, I don't feel that anyone's creativity is ever "lame"....or that creativity is dependant on strength (beautiful work can come from vulnerability or weakness too). Creativity is tapping into source consciousness/power/ the universe / a higher calling/ divinity...etc.... Reduction in monkey mind may assist focus, and concentration...it may eventually completely free the flow of creativity...but discipline doesn't make creativity less lame/ better (discipline is totally beneficial for other reasons though: mastery, etc) ...distraction may hinder creativity....but creativity is Omni-present/ Omni-resilient/ and Omni-infinite....and that is likely a universal truth....

If you too have a super-creative mind, maybe respect the distraction potential, but consider remembering that this is also a sacred gift...despite the Omni-presence of creativity, some of us naturally tap into and connect with that divinity in more powerful, wonderful, and  Devine ways on a level we are more conscious of...enjoy this blessing...even if it makes things like meditation more of a struggle...it's likely egotistical to believe your creativity is superior (we've all met that guy...lol) but respecting the ultimate divinity in all creativity, including yours, is likely worthwhile...