Musk fascist salute

[Inliytened1]

2 minutes ago, Whitney Edwards said:

It won't be that way. 

Democracy's evolution over time will give rise to something more intelligent and complex like meritocracy. 

But for that democracy has to survive this oligarchy. Or it could be that such oligarchy will fuel the middle classes to clash against the elite establishment and this could be a revolutionary extension to something much more complex and highly evolved in the future. We need highly intelligent non corrupt highly conscious minds to come together for that, someone that the public can place their trust into, which is sadly an outcome of chance. 

Well, to your point, either way, we evolve.  Rather than taking sides all of us should look to that evolution.   I like it.  

[Inliytened1]

12 minutes ago, Joshe said:

I believe it’s possible for a truly benevolent and integrous person to rise to the top, but they would need great communication skills and strategy. They’d need to be well-funded and inspire people with vision. I think it’s possible, just not likely. 

The independents always lose in this country.

[Davino]

5 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

That's what I mean.  A guy like him has to have complete control to really be a threat politically.  

How much control does a mosquito have to murder you?

Very little

But one small mosquito annoying you at night and you can't sleep...

[Inliytened1]

32 minutes ago, Davino said:

How much control does a mosquito have to murder you?

Very little

But one small mosquito annoying you at night and you can't sleep...

Until he can fix the bird flu im not going to worry about him.  I've better things to do.   A guy ninth in Diablo isn't worth it.  He would have to have beaten God of War and could wield a good game of Chess before I took him seriously. 

[BlueOak]

There is part of the human psyche that still needs addressing in children in many households being reflected a lot. I've been seeing different examples in what people have told me they've been interacting with recently, both in their young children, and in adults who didn't have that part of themselves parented. It's in a lot of people. 

That is the part that does things because it isn't given attention, acts out, and has a desperate need to be noticed.

Here is the practical stupidity.

They could have done all they've done. Changed the hand signal to something else. Not identifying themselves with Nazi's, white nationalists etc using a different word, whatever, and a large number of people would still kiss the ground they walk on. What you get instead is this 'oh we are not really fascists or nazi's' despite the fact they embody most fascist principles. This bending of reality that people engage in is why I carry so much hate. The other half of people bend it the other way, to try and fit their own definitions.

Its just putting your fingers up at people for the sake of it to get a reaction to stay in people's focus.

Politics are a ridiculous reality TV show. Don't give it too much focus. Oh did he didn't... he did.... let's make 500 videos on it speaking about the man. Waste of the human species time.

Edited yesterday at 10:54 AM by BlueOak

[BlueOak]

If we all want mature politics, we've got to pick average men and women, working average lives and focus on them. Raise the average up. Not all this focus on billionaires, playboys, and extremists of any kind on the political spectrum. Its not healthy for the collective in their own framing of life; it's disconnected from everyday people and not practical.

[Davino]

@Inliytened1 Elon Musk has more money than entire countries. I certainly am looking closely what Elon Musk is doing with the US government.

[manuel bon]

9 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

If he actually got into politics I'd be worried about this psycho.  But outside of that whether he jerks off to hairy pussys or not is of little concern.    

He's already in politics man...

[Basman]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

This is actually a mistake in leftist thinking.

That's funny because I always feel like I'm arguing with soyboy liberals. I guess hard conservatism tends to be too obvious. I find a lot of lefty views here overly idealistic and removed from reality.

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Musk is not driven by money as leftists want to believe. He doesn't need any more money. The average Marxist is more driven by money than Musk. What drives Musk is power and the desire to reshape the world to his ideas of how it should be. He believes his ideas of how the world should be are the best, and that this justifies any means. He needs power and money to reshape the world to his vision. That is the point. The real currency here is not money, it's influence.

In my mind as a plebian, if I had lots of money I would just relax and enjoy life. But I guess I'm not accounting for the kind of mind that it would take to accumulate that kind of wealth or if you where brought up into it.

[Terell Kirby]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

We have a corporatocracy.

[mmKay]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Not in our system because a truly good man would just be eaten alive by the corrupt pigs who run Washington and the corporate business world.

America cannot have a benevolent monarch because it is a system where the top 1% of corrupt rich and famous elites rule together for their own enrichment at the expense of everyone else. We have a corporatocracy. No one man can fix it. He would just be demonized and booted from power by the top 1%. And the bottom 50% would hate him too because they do not have the capacity to understand goodness.

This reminds me of a recent situation in Spanish politics.  Juan Lobato, a guy from the left recorded a corrupt conversation with someone from the opposing party and gave the recording to a notary. Instead of being praised for exposing corruption, his own party forced him to step down.

This made absolutely no sense at the beginning but then it clicked. They couldn’t trust him anymore for their own under-the-table deals. Of course, the media didn’t paint it like that, but it is obvious to me.

Lobato was criticized for notarizing a corruption recording without consulting his party, which they painted as betrayal. The media focused on his lack of loyalty and the disruption he caused rather than the corruption he exposed. It really shows how the system punishes transparency to protect power.

[Breakingthewall]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Not in our system because a truly good man would just be eaten alive by the corrupt pigs who run Washington and the corporate business world.

America cannot have a benevolent monarch because it is a system where the top 1% of corrupt rich and famous elites rule together for their own enrichment at the expense of everyone else. We have a corporatocracy. No one man can fix it. He would just be demonized and booted from power by the top 1%. And the bottom 50% would hate him too because they do not have the capacity to understand goodness.

Maybe that messiah is already in the power: trumpo I the savior of America, the benefactor of the oppressed. But only the 50% can see it

Edited yesterday at 01:16 PM by Breakingthewall

[Ash55]

9 hours ago, Ero said:

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

 

So would you agree that it is possible for systematic change to be achieved by a benevolent/ enlightened monarch, akin to Socrates’ “philosopher-king”?

having a democratic system in a society where everyone is well educated and spirituality is encouraged + all the self deception introspection aspect,  is more sustainable

The ideal of Socrates, works best only on paper you need flexibility and dedication of authority in the system to make it sustainable other wise the upper class get easily corrupted and they considerate power in a way  that shift the system to totalitarianism and it becomes a very bloody struggle to change the rulers

Democratic system are self correcting on the long term, and when the system is self correcting it fixes and sustain it self

[zazen]

@BlueOak Well said.

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

America cannot have a benevolent monarch because it is a system where the top 1% of corrupt rich and famous elites rule together for their own enrichment at the expense of everyone else. We have a corporatocracy. No one man can fix it. He would just be demonized and booted from power by the top 1%.

We have a corporatocracy cosplaying as a democracy. This is where liberal values are weaponised and practiced in a lopsided way to benefit power. This is why the saying goes: in the US capital controls the state, in China the state controls capital - though it more so directs it and checks it's excesses. Something our liberal values hinder us from doing. We'll scream authoritarian when Jack Ma is being checked in China, yet cry about oligarchic and corporate vampirism in our own countries. Our own values can't defend themselves, which is why elements of conservatism need to be integrated into a liberal world view - the conservative elements of discipline, survival, doing what is needed even it makes one look aggressive or heavy handed.

If freedom of autonomy is fetishised as some apex value, then we'll never experience the benefits that the freedom of harmony will bring. We have a lopsided rebellious teenager approach to freedom, rather than a mature one. We can't get that we give up lower freedoms for higher ones. Every limit or constraint on freedom is seen as authoritarian. Sophisticated minds can understand the limits of absolute freedom in their critique of libertarianism but can't extend this thinking to other domains.

When it comes to the relationship between people and corporations in domains of importance - healthcare, education, housing, and food - corporations are given the liberal freedom to act as they please, while the people are denied the liberal freedom to resist, adjudicate, or hold them accountable for profiteering and exploitation.

Liberal values exist, but they serve the predator over the prey. It’s a one way street: corporations enjoy unrestrained economic liberty, while the public is given more trivial yet still valid freedoms - superficial liberties that do not threaten the structure of power. The people are granted freedom in indulgence, not in fulfilment of meeting their most basic needs. 

We can protest as loudly as we want, but never to meaningfully challenge power. Even these freedoms have limits if we step outside the approved boundaries or get too loud ie Snowden and Assange. China for example limits protest, but that doesn't mean you can't complain. They have a national help line 12345 anyone can call in fact - to complain, not to protest. The point being - the higher freedom of stability is prioritized over a individual or group protesting which can lead to constant political polarization. 

This drains the nations energy rather than directing it towards solving its problems. In the West we may be given the freedom to protest loud, in China they are attempting to give people the freedom to not even need to protest in the first place - by addressing their fundamental needs. This is the distinction between autonomous freedom vs harmonious freedom.

The irony here is that if democracy truly functioned as intended, if we could enact our own will through the vote - then there shouldn't be so much need to protest and so much frustration within society. The system claims to represent the people’s interests but repeatedly doesn't because it serves elite interests.

In Western democracies we are given the illusion of choice and to voice opinion, but in the domains that truly matter, corporations feast while their customers starve.

Edited yesterday at 02:02 PM by zazen

[Leo Gura]

Remember what corporations are. They are factions of citizens. These factions are designed to serve their own interest at the expense of the larger collective. So what we have is a mosaic of small factions all trying to pull the blanket to their side of the bed while everyone else sleeps naked in the cold. And unless you are a large corporation you don't have enough pull to keep yourself warm. So you are forced to join one of the factions to keep yourself warm or launch your own. So it's a race to the bottom.

Edited yesterday at 03:47 PM by Leo Gura

[Inliytened1]

You still have the ability in this country to make as much money as you want to make - and vote for the person you want.  Or even run if you want to.  It's  open to you if you want it.  I'd say its a still a pretty good place to live.   Yeah..you're still gonna be investing in corporations..but you don't have to be loyal to them.

Edited yesterday at 02:21 PM by Inliytened1

[Terell Kirby]

22 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

unless you are a large corporation you don't have enough pull to keep yourself warm. So you are forced to join one of the factions to keep yourself warm.

Makes sense-as we see today the ungodly amount of corporate lobby in government. The more tax breaks and deregulations these companies get-the larger they get, thus putting themselves in position to enslave the masses.

Common folk have little defense against this, other than properly understanding how these things work to purify the system through the voting process-which they suck at doing. It’s sad

Edited yesterday at 02:23 PM by Terell Kirby

[Inliytened1]

2 hours ago, Davino said:

@Inliytened1 Elon Musk has more money than entire countries. I certainly am looking closely what Elon Musk is doing with the US government.

I don't know the interviews with Joe Rogan just killed it for me.  Him getting stoned with Rogan...besides- you're dreaming him up.

[zazen]

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Musk's #1 problem is that he is incapable of sharing power with anyone. He wants full control over the relationship. But that kind of style cannot work in a liberal democracy where people are your equals, not your vassals.

This is Americas problem too, or more broadly the Wests. As above so below - Musk is the microcosm in the macrocosm of Western civilization.

Can’t be at the table of multipolarity, just want to be at the head of it with all the arrogance that unipolarity brings - and is characteristic of the West.

US hubris is doing a god job at isolating itself amongst its allies it seems:

Edited yesterday at 02:40 PM by zazen

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, zazen said:

This is Americas problem too, or more broadly the Wests.

Well, yeah, all the problems boil down to selfishness and self-absorption.

Multipolar world sounds good in theory but in practice it leads to anarchy, with corrupt actors like Putin thinking he is on par with the West.

The West was right that communism was a failed worldview not on par with the West. And the same will happen again with Putin's kleptocracy. It will not outcompete the West. China is a more complicated matter.

Edited yesterday at 03:53 PM by Leo Gura