Concerning resonance

[trenton]

Lately I have been watching videos by women who talk about why men don't like dating and the double standards women commonly hold. I find it concerning that I click on these videos quickly and my mind absorbs it quickly and it resonates strongly.

There is in fact something I have to gain from believing that women are not worth dating. It means I don't have to face my fears and trauma around relationships and sexuality. I have a tendency to get skeptical when it sounds like someone is telling me exactly what I want to hear even if there seems to be a kernel of truth to it.

I know the potential harm in believing negative things about groups of people like women. I don't want to be the kind of person making negative generalizations about groups. This kind of content is likely going to be used to create further barriers to intimacy which I already have a lot of. It does resonate with me though and my mind quickly believes it as if I could easily see these things happening to me if I try dating.

Here is one of the videos I watched, but there were other similar ones like it and from multiple channels. All of them are women talking about why men don't want to date women. What does this resonance mean about me? Maybe I should try a couple of actual dates to see what happens, but I wasn't planning on doing that until next year.

 

[Buck Edwards]

Don't feed into click baity internet stuff. 

There are tons of married men and human race continues as usual. That's all you need to know. Some people just fail at dating because of their own perceptions and reasons, nothing to do with either men or women. Nobody stopped dating men. Nobody stopped dating women. These are biased, low perspective cherry picking click bait fear mongering videos. Meant for clicks, views and pointless discussions. 

 

Edited Sunday at 03:14 AM by Buck Edwards

[Emerald]

These types of influencers make their money and get popular by pandering to men and telling them something affirming and validating... even if they're affirming negative things.

For example, Blackpill panders to men who worry they're going to die alone by telling them "Yes, you've been right all along. You will die alone."

And in this case, it gives this validation from a woman.

So, it gives a false para-social kind of sense of bonding with the woman in the video because she understands you and empathizes with you 'while those other women won't'.

It's also empowering because it's "Why men are deciding to remain single."

It gives the sense of agency and power in dating because it's "I've decided dating women isn't worth it because women are ___." instead of "I feel really uncomfortable with dating because of my own internal reasons."

It gives the illusion of power and someone to blame. And it's a victim narrative.

And like you said, it also gives you rationalizations for why dating is a bad idea and isn't worth it so that you can maintain the status quo.

Ultimately, all these kinds of channels (not just ones with female hosts) are looking to keep you in an insecurity cycles so that you keep clicking on the videos and keep buying their products and services.

These people are just in the business of exploiting common male insecurities. And they have done market research to tell you what you want to hear in your own words.

It's just like there are so many businesses exploiting women's insecurities by telling them they're not beautiful enough and selling them a fix.

Edited Sunday at 03:47 AM by Emerald

[Leo Gura]

Men are not deciding to stay single. They just don't know how to get women and are lost in online spaces.

[gambler]

You might be resonating with it because there’s truth to the idea that some men are grappling with modern gender dynamics. For example, some may feel expected to conform and cater to a woman, being fearful that if they do something that crosses the presumed to exist female-favored boundary, that she will punish them as controlling. Since anything could be spun as controlling, a person may be more inclined to hold their tongue. This creates a problem and a gender imbalance in the relationship. And if you are held to this assumed dynamic, it becomes obvious why this is a problem the more time passes in the relationship. So if there really are these tensions that underlie modern relationships, especially as it pertains to favoring females, then this might be why you resonate with those types of videos. They may be correctly highlighting a cultural bias. One that also includes shying away from seriously calling out what women do that are wrong. You may even feel this to be true in comparison to what the culture correctly calls out in terms of the things that men do that are wrong. 

Edited Sunday at 04:51 PM by gambler

[Clarence]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Men are not deciding to stay single. They just don't know how to get women and are lost in online spaces.

Don't you decide to stay single? 

[Schizophonia]

The Judeo-Christian influence (I am in relative truth here of course) has pushed into the collective unconscious and in particular into men the archetype of the "marty".
There is therefore in fine a pleasure, a feeling of power in embodying "the one who gives but does not receive" or a persona of the kind, but this one is not enough imagination and requires mobilizing a lot of aggressiveness and sexual energy in general to be maintained.

The stress of going to talk to a girl in the street is not a fear of being ridiculed or attacked, a girl cannot hurt you like that, it is in fact the fear of betraying this archetype.

In nature men do not hesitate to be racist, misogynistic, kill animals to eat them, to be mercilessly pragmatic in general, and even have more sociopathic behaviour like rape (if one is psychopath); An undomesticated man would not hesitate for a single second to intensely flirt with women here and there to satisfy his sexual desires.

Shyness, routine, superstition, respect for authority above oneself; All these are modern anomalies.

Edited Sunday at 02:27 PM by Schizophonia

[trenton]

I made sure to block these channels now. I don't know how YouTube knew I couldn't resist clicking on those videos. The main reason I avoid dating is because of deep insecurity around sexual attraction. I might make a separate thread discussing this issue. I notice I am experiencing a lot of lust on a day to day basis.

@gambler I think you describe why this resonates with me well. Gender and dating dynamics have changed significantly due to various factors including social media. This stuff around dynamics that favor women resonates a lot, but I believe this to be a slippery slope if I go too far down that path. I don't want to develop resentment. This is why I made the thread about my concerns. Is there a way to objectively describe dating and gender dynamics which gives the full picture rather than being skewed toward one gender?

[gambler]

11 minutes ago, trenton said:

 Is there a way to objectively describe dating and gender dynamics which gives the full picture rather than being skewed toward one gender?

Hearing out counter perspectives, especially the female perspective.

In the end, you really have to find a female that shares your values and was raised properly. This way, whatever issues that people are facing that might be a symptom of the current culture, is hopefully something that isn't going to affect you.

[Leo Gura]

8 hours ago, Clarence said:

Don't you decide to stay single? 

1) I am a philosopher freak.

2) I am still interested in girls.

Edited Sunday at 10:19 PM by Leo Gura

[Basman]

20 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

1) I am a philosopher freak.

2) I am still interested in girls.

This reminds me of Kierkegaard, who famously broke off his engagement with his then fiance for unclear reasons but people speculate that he couldn't marry his fiance without compromising his philosophical work and therefor choose philosophy. I've also heard that he could only afford to support himself with his fathers inheritance and he would have to get a "real job" if he went and got married, which would undermine his philosophy work even more. So it was a "killing your darlings" situation.

[trenton]

8 hours ago, gambler said:

Hearing out counter perspectives, especially the female perspective.

In the end, you really have to find a female that shares your values and was raised properly. This way, whatever issues that people are facing that might be a symptom of the current culture, is hopefully something that isn't going to affect you.

@gambler I largely agree with what you said. It's possible that my dating experience will be different from what these influencers are depicting. Once I clarify my values and hold myself to them, I will use them to help pick potential partners. I have a good idea of what they are already.

One thing I'm not sure about is the criteria that I have to find a woman who was raised properly. If I applied that standard to myself, then women shouldn't date me even though it wasn't my fault that mother was a drug addict who my father statutorialy raped before fleeing the state to avoid paying child support. Is there a fairer standard that I could use or should I insist on this one even though I myself fail to meet that standard? Do people just have permanent emotionally problems because terrible childhoods like these? I originally thought the person you built yourself into despite your trauma was also fair and that is a standard I can pass. It potentially means that I might end up with a woman with unresolved trauma leading to conflicts that aren't my fault until the relationship falls apart. That sounds like who i would end up with given fair standards that I can pass.

[gambler]

2 minutes ago, trenton said:

@gambler I largely agree with what you said. It's possible that my dating experience will be different from what these influencers are depicting. Once I clarify my values and hold myself to them, I will use them to help pick potential partners. I have a good idea of what they are already.

One thing I'm not sure about is the criteria that I have to find a woman who was raised properly. If I applied that standard to myself, then women shouldn't date me even though it wasn't my fault that mother was a drug addict who my father statutorialy raped before fleeing the state to avoid paying child support. Is there a fairer standard that I could use or should I insist on this one even though I myself fail to meet that standard? Do people just have permanent emotionally problems because terrible childhoods like these? I originally thought the person you built yourself into despite your trauma was also fair and that is a standard I can pass. It potentially means that I might end up with a woman with unresolved trauma leading to conflicts that aren't my fault until the relationship falls apart. That sounds like who i would end up with given fair standards that I can pass.

Well you can’t fix or save someone, only they can do that. I think Leo mentioned getting in these relationships is a trap in one of his videos so at the very least find someone who is healed. 

[trenton]

1 hour ago, gambler said:

Well you can’t fix or save someone, only they can do that. I think Leo mentioned getting in these relationships is a trap in one of his videos so at the very least find someone who is healed. 

That would be a fair standard. Someone who was raised properly or who is healed. In my case I consider myself mostly healed but not completely. I'm not sure what else needs to be healed in myself other than my phobia of dating, relationships, and the opposite sex. At the same time I can easily see this situation turning into a distraction that will take a lot of time and energy. I will continue working on my project for now as I planned this year.

[gambler]

12 minutes ago, trenton said:

I will continue working on my project for now as I planned this year.

Godspeed 👍 

[Clarence]

@Leo Gura I currently stay single because relationships are very time consuming and I first need to discover who I am and what I want more deeply. I find it much harder to change and work on myself while in a relationship. I get distracted, tend to please the person to make things work, and I don't fall in love easily, so it is frustrating to waste time and energy for someone I end up breaking up with. I could feel okay in a long term relationship, I think, but it rarely comes easily or quickly.

So I admit I'd have some interest in building a serious relationship with someone, but not enough at this time to invest a lot of time in dating. My priority is to develop myself.

I might be some kind of a freak as well, though. I've always been quite different than the people around me, and I also am a philosopher at heart. As a matter of fact, I studied philosophy at university before I knew about Actualized.org.

Overall, do you think women stay single for better reasons than men?

Edited yesterday at 08:03 AM by Clarence

[Leo Gura]

There is a big difference between being single by choice vs not.

Women also take time off from relationships. That is healthy. You can get sick of relationship.

Edited yesterday at 08:12 AM by Leo Gura

[trenton]

Well it happened again. This time I was recommended similar videos from a new channel.

This one talked about how it isn't fair for women to expect men to pay for everything even though women are often in positions to make more money than their partners. This was called dating down. I was actually thinking the same thing prior to clicking on that one too.

YouTube is relentless in making me hate women. I now blocked that channel too.

[Sugarcoat]

6 minutes ago, trenton said:

YouTube is relentless in making me hate women.

You can only hate women if you feel you ~need~ something from them

[trenton]

8 hours ago, Sugarcoat said:

You can only hate women if you feel you ~need~ something from them

So far I don't feel any anger or hatred toward women in the slightest. I'm just acting out of an abundance of caution when I am exposed to ideas that paint women in general in a negative light. I don't want my lust to somehow fester in such a way that I become like an incel or something of that nature. Maybe I'm being overly cautious and this is part of the ocd around relationships and sex.