Leo, how on earth are you so good at Chess?

[Carl-Richard]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I don't know what is normal.

Keep in mind I don't have an official rating. All I can tell you is I can beat a 1600-rated bot more than 50% of the time if I focus. And I am improving.

I have to really focus to win. If I slack off I make bad blunders. I don't play rapid games as I would be really bad at that. My games usually last 1-2hrs.

Some years ago when I got a little into Chess (I only used to play a few games from time to time with my dad before), I beat a bot rated Candidate Master (~2200 elo) on my phone when I spent a lot of time thinking and focused really hard, albeit with one re-move at the very end (so it wasn't completely fair). The game probably lasted a few hours. At that point, it becomes more about patience and meticulousness than strategy. You literally calculate almost every possible move a few moves ahead. That's also how I beat my dad for the first time: by spending a lot of time calculating and being patient (the game was of course untimed 😄).

Edited Friday at 09:56 PM by Carl-Richard

[Leo Gura]

10 minutes ago, integral said:

Hikaru is heavily calculation based thinking process while Magnus is more of intuitive based.

Does not make sense.

Hikaru is better at blitz than classical. His blitz games clearly don't give him time to do much formal calculation. Hikaru is very intuitive.

And Magnus must do very deep calculating to win his classic games.

Edited Friday at 09:52 PM by Leo Gura

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

So you're just playing long games against bots. Playing a 10 minute games against humans is a whole different ball game, it's very competitive on chess.com. These A.I. bots that try to imitate various levels of human ELO ussually do a pretty bad job at it, because they do it by making random blunders at random times, some of them too ridicilous for a higher rated player

[Leo Gura]

1 minute ago, NewKidOnTheBlock said:

ussually do a pretty bad job at it

Yes, I know. It's unfortunate. I wish bots were smarter at sucking.

[Leo Gura]

19 minutes ago, integral said:

I stopped improving was was because I could not put the time and energy to focus on the boring stuff. Which was endgames and openings. I found openings to be a complete waste of my time to memorize

You just gotta drop classical and play Fischer Random. Solves all those problems.

Endgames are fun. I like endgames because there's less pieces to calculate and there's interesting opportunities for upsets.

Classical chess just needs to be retired at this point. How many times can you keep beating the same dead horse?

Or at least switch to Duck Chess.

Edited Friday at 10:01 PM by Leo Gura

[NoSelfSelf]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Does not make sense.

Hikaru is better at blitz than classical. His blitz games clearly don't give him time to do much formal calculation. Hikaru is very intuitive.

And Magnus must do very deep calculating to win his classic games.

 

 

 

 

[integral]

27 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Does not make sense.

Hikaru is better at blitz than classical. His blitz games clearly don't give him time to do much formal calculation. Hikaru is very intuitive.

And Magnus must do very deep calculating to win his classic games.

They are both exceptionally good at calculation and intuition. But Magnus can beat anyone at any time frame. And that's because his dominant ability is intuition, while Hikaru has the limitation of being dominant at calculation. They are both highly intuitive and highly skilled at calculation.

The reason Hikaru is "bad" at long games is because he lacks the intuition that Magnus has. Hikaru is doing a lot more calculation than Magnus does on the board, and that's why he can't keep up. Deep intuition > calculation.

Blitz is a completely different animal. It's mostly intuition and quick five-move calculations. Most of the time Hikaru is calculating in bullet games, and it's shocking. I cannot calculate that fast, while Magnus is not doing as much heavy calculation in his blitz games.

Of course they're both using intuition and calculation.

21 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You just gotta drop classical and play Fischer Random. Solves all those problems.

Definitely Fisher random was my solution back in the day but because the player pool was so small and it wasn't as competitive and no one else was basically doing it I didn't have the motivation. Also when there's more pieces to patterns are a little easier to see and more fun.

Quote

Endgames are fun. I like endgames because there's less pieces to calculate.

OMG LEOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO 😅

The fewer pieces on the board, the further into the future you have to calculate. When there are a lot of pieces, both you and your opponent have limitations in terms of the distance you can accurately calculate.

The problem with endgames is the tactics and maneuvering that appear are very meticulous, and at the highest level, it boils down to pattern recognition and memorization.

https://chesstempo.com/chess-endgames/

This website will help you do tactics puzzles in endgames. And as you improve you'll quickly realize the monotony of it. Is just not as fun as regular tactics puzzles. But this training has to be done if you want to improve.

Edited Friday at 10:20 PM by integral

[mmKay]

I'm kinda sad that all that genetic freak memory and visualization horsepower is wasted on chess. But who am I to tell them what to do with their lives? 🤷‍♂️

Edited Friday at 10:16 PM by mmKay

[Dodo]

53 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

My focus is not great. My mind is not good at doing long calculations. But I can be fully immersed in a game of chess for 2hrs.

Magnus is a genetic freak. His memory is insanely exceptional. No normal human has that kind of memory.

Basically all the chess GMs have insane genetic memory because you could not be in the top 100 without it.

Chess is a good example of how much genetics matter. You will never be a super-GM through hard work alone. You need worldclass memory and visualization ability. Not all brains are wired for that. The reason Magnus is the GOAT is because he is a genetic freak whose freakishness is perfectly suited for chess. That's why no one can reach his level no matter how hard or long they study. The only one who will best him is an even bigger freak.

But Leo, its not only genetics, you have to start learning it as a child to really be great at it. If Magnus never played as a child and picked it up in his 30s, he would never be able to be any good, probably not even a titled player. 

[Leo Gura]

Every time I watch Hikaru stream he's winging everything.

To say he's calculating is absurd.

[Leo Gura]

8 minutes ago, Dodo said:

But Leo, its not only genetics

Everyone in the world who's worldclass at anything is that way only due to perfect genetic fit AND insane work.

It's always both.

If you only have one or the other you will not be worldclass.

Edited Friday at 10:27 PM by Leo Gura

[Dodo]

10 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Every time I watch Hikaru stream he's winging everything.

To say he's calculating is absurd.

 This is the only moment in Hikaru's life when he didn't calculate  

[integral]

18 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Every time I watch Hikaru stream he's winging everything.

To say he's calculating is absurd.

Yeah I agree when you're playing one minute games or you're scrambling under time pressure, then it's all intuition.

I think we're miscommunicating, I'm talking about something a little more subtle when it comes to intuition versus calculation.

Intuition just happens naturally as you dwell on the position ideas flow into the mind, calculation is a deliberate multi-step process. And Hikaru is going to deliberately do a multi-step process most of the time. While Magnus is dwelling more and not thinking too much in advance he allows the ideas to flow into his mind.

Gotham chess is also biased towards calculation.

I'm speaking from being able to relate, like I am heavily intuition based, and I don't think at all. And every move I make is basically 2200+ level. I'm not calculating at all or foreseeing even one move into the future. I have an idea of what the opponent might do but I didn't do any deliberate calculation, it's only when there's a tactic involved that I stop and pause and think. While Hikaru will always calculate in every position if he has time.

Edited Friday at 10:39 PM by integral

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, integral said:

While Hikaru will always calculate in every position if he has time.

False. I watch him not do that frequently.

[Incursio]

@Leo GuraHow would you say that the degree of mastery you've achieved in chess translates into other areas of your life? Doesn't every area of life translate into every other area of life?

How would you define strategy?

[Dodo]

These guys are so good, they can do calculations very fast, I mean they can play without looking at the board, and fast! So I bet even if they calculate, it doesn't have to be transparent to the viewer every time. 

 BTW Magnus has said Gukesh or Prag is much better at calculating than him, that's all I know. But still Magnus is better, probably it's the experience. 

[Leo Gura]

11 minutes ago, Incursio said:

@Leo GuraHow would you say that the degree of mastery you've achieved in chess

I have not achieved anything in chess.

I just played a few games for fun.

Edited Friday at 10:54 PM by Leo Gura

[Incursio]

@Leo Gura You've achieved new neural connections through the amount of time you've spent playing.

[Leo Gura]

You guys take chess way to seriously. I put more thought into jerking off than chess.

[The Crocodile]

4 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You guys take chess way to seriously. I put more thought into jerking off than chess.

I think playing chess against a bot is like using a vibrator or dildo instead of a man.

It might be bigger or faster, but it doesn't have the same realness.

Edited Friday at 11:07 PM by The Crocodile