Ralston clarifies his deepening of consciousness

[Breakingthewall]

10 hours ago, Water by the River said:

That is a nice Koan!

Anyway I know the answer: the one who hears the sounds is reality, the universe, God. Through life God becomes concious of itself, awakens from it's sleep. Consciousness is the awakening of reality, sleeping reality is as real as awakened reality, but unconscious of itself. Consciousness is the light that illuminates reality, sound is perception, perception is consciousness, the process of awakening goes deeper into itself infinitely, and that sound is part of it. We are the reality awakening, then we could totally awake to it, open our conciousness to the total depth of what it is, that's enlightenment. 

[UnbornTao]

@Breakingthewall You are missing the point of koans. They're not meant to be answered but rather to precipitate breakthroughs. 

You seem to be filled to the brim with "knowing" and might as well leave some space for contemplation.

Edited Friday at 10:23 AM by UnbornTao

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, UnbornTao said:

knowing"--might as well leave some space for contemplation.

I didn't answer a koan, I know that it's a big work to read all the thread and all of us have bit adhd nowadays, but the answer was to the question of bassui: who's listening the sound? 

Btw this is a forum to talk, not to contemplate. Everything that is written is an idea, contemplating is in different moment

Edited Friday at 10:28 AM by Breakingthewall

[RightHand]

Ah yes, another Ralston topic 

[UnbornTao]

13 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I didn't answer a koan, I know that it's a big work to read all the thread and all of us have bit adhd nowadays, but the answer was to the question of bassui: who's listening the sound? 

Btw this is a forum to talk, not to contemplate. Everything that is written is an idea, contemplating is in different moment

Any answer would be worthless.

You can definitely contemplate and dialogue, that is encouraged.

Edited Friday at 11:34 PM by UnbornTao

[Breakingthewall]

57 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

Any answer would be worthless.

Contemplate and dialogue. 

What is worthless is answering people who aim to appear wise. Good luck with your game son, I hope it fills you with self-esteem.

Anyway, it would be nice if you didn't bother those of us who try to talk seriously. I'm sure there are other forums for children where you'll fit in better.

[UnbornTao]

4 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

What is worthless is answering people who aim to appear wise. Good luck with your game son, I hope it fills you with self-esteem.

Anyway, it would be nice if you didn't bother those of us who try to talk seriously. I'm sure there are other forums for children where you'll fit in better.

You misunderstand. What I'm saying is that the koan is a questioning, an opening, and the tendency of mind to provide an array of ready-made answers seals off that possibility. Make of that what you will. 

[Breakingthewall]

Just now, UnbornTao said:

You misunderstand. What I'm saying is that the koan is a questioning, an opening, and the tendency of mind to provide an array of ready-made answers seals off that possibility. Make of that what you will. 

Thats not a koan, it is a question that a guy named Bassui asked himself compulsively since he was 7 years old. He was an interesting guy, a Japanese Zen monk from the 14th century, quite rebellious and independent, focused on meditation. His approach was to penetrate into himself to understand what he is. His question is not a koan, it is a direct question with an answer that requires a total opening of the mind. First you must reach the non-self, then the absolute emptiness and finally the total opening. My answer is because I know those phases, my rude way of answering you is because of your suggestion to contemplate more and reason less, since it seems disrespectful to me, since I didn't asked the advice and I meditate several hours each day and I contemplate uninterruptedly, if was impolite I'm sorry 

[gettoefl]

22 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Thats not a koan, it is a question that a guy named Bassui asked himself compulsively since he was 7 years old. He was an interesting guy, a Japanese Zen monk from the 14th century, quite rebellious and independent, focused on meditation. His approach was to penetrate into himself to understand what he is. His question is not a koan, it is a direct question with an answer that requires a total opening of the mind. First you must reach the non-self, then the absolute emptiness and finally the total opening. My answer is because I know those phases, my rude way of answering you is because of your suggestion to contemplate more and reason less, since it seems disrespectful to me, since I didn't asked the advice and I meditate several hours each day and I contemplate uninterruptedly, if was impolite I'm sorry 

Words profit much.

They got us stuck.

Yet without them, we don't get unstuck.

Blissful ignorance would be the only life.

Everyone knew god then everyone forgot god.

Someone has to speak else life is in vain.

Thoughts shape reality and words share reality.

Keep sharing the wealth with us.

[Breakingthewall]

23 hours ago, Water by the River said:

work, at rest, never stop trying to realize who it is that hears. Even though your questioning penetrates the unconscious, you won’t find the one who hears, and all your efforts will come to naught. Yet sounds can be heard, so question yourself to an even profounder level. At last every vestige of self-awareness will disappear and you will feel like a cloudless sky. Within yourself you will find no “I,” nor will you discover anyone who hears. This Mind is like the void, yet it hasn’t a single spot that can be called empty. Do not mistake this state for Self-realization [half-baked No-Self], but continue to ask yourself even more intensely, “Now who is it that hears?” If you bore and bore into this question, oblivious to anything else, even this feeling of voidness will vanish and you won’t be aware of anything—total darkness will prevail. [Don’t stop here, but] keep asking with all your strength, “What is it that hears?” Only when you have completely exhausted the questioning [killed/transcended the of the remaining subtle No-Self-Identity, resulting in True No Self, which is not a "No-Self" anymore but eternal infinite impersonal Infinite Consciousness/Reality] will the question burst; now you will feel like someone who has come back from the dead. This is true realization. You will see the Buddhas of all the universes face-to-face and the Dharma Ancestors past and present

Btw, that guy, bassui, was a real genius, we should read a bit about him, his life and his teachings, that seems simple but are very deep

1 hour ago, gettoefl said:

Words profit much.

They got us stuck.

Yet without them, we don't get unstuck.

Blissful ignorance would be the only life.

Everyone knew god then everyone forgot god.

Someone has to speak else life is in vain.

Thoughts shape reality and words share reality.

Keep sharing the wealth with us.

Words are absolutely necessary to free the mind, are very powerful. 

 

Edited Friday at 06:30 PM by Breakingthewall

[Water by the River]

39 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Btw, that guy, bassui, was a real genius, we should read a bit about him, his life and his teachings, that seems simple but are very deep

Yes.

Letters of Bassui, in Kapleau, Three Pillars of Zen:

4. To a Dying Man
Your Mind-essence is not subject to birth or death. It is neither being nor nothingness, neither emptiness nor form-and-color. Nor is it something that feels pain or joy. However much you try to know [with your rational mind] that which is now sick, you cannot. Yet if you think of nothing, wish for nothing, want to understand nothing, cling to nothing, and only ask yourself, “What is the true substance of the Mind and of this one who is now suffering?” ending your days like clouds fading in the sky, you will eventually be freed from your painful bondage to endless change.

8. First Letter to the Zen Priest Iguchi

An ancient Zen master [Rinzai] said: “You should not cling to the idea that you are Pure-essence.” And again: “Your physical body, composed of the four basic elements, can’t hear or understand this preaching. The empty-space can’t understand this preaching. Then what is it that hears and understands?” Meditate fully and directly on these words. Take hold of this koan as though wielding the jewelsword of the Vajra king. Cut down whatever appears in the mind. When the thoughts of mundane matters arise, cut them off. When notions of Buddhism arise, likewise lop them off. In short, destroy all ideas, whether of realization, of Buddhas, or of devils, and all day long pursue the question “What is it that hears this preaching?” When you have eradicated every conception until only emptiness remains, and then cut through even the emptiness, your mind will burst open and that which hears will manifest itself. Persevere, persevere—never quit halfway—until you reach the point where you feel as though you have risen from the dead. Only then will you be able to wholly resolve the momentous question, “What is it that hears this preaching?”

PS: The answer to every Koan is a state of being. Or rather, Being. Infinite Being. The answer can never be demonstated in a forum by text only. But they can be given or stated by text only.

Who is Selling Water by the River? 

 

PS: I personally like more the (compared to Zen) much more technical way of Mahamudra for actual practice, especially Pointing out the Great Way style, which I consider more efficient for most. But the letters of Bassui are pure poetry for me. They express the essence, and they can touch deeply. Especially if there is an intuition of that which Bassui is aiming at. It seems "he" speaking to us across a distance of over half a millenia. Yet, his true essence is right here, right now. Always.

Edited Friday at 07:10 PM by Water by the River

[Breakingthewall]

3 hours ago, Water by the River said:

 

. 

3 hours ago, Water by the River said:

Being. Infinite Being. The answer can never be demonstated in a forum by text only. But they can be given or stated by text only.

Any koan at the end is an hindrance too. Who is who listen the sound? Implies a lot of mental construction. In a empty mind that koan can't exist, an empty mind is beyond "who", "listen" and "sound". This subject, action and objet are 3 hindrances, then they can help you to twist the mind in a direction, but is some moment you have to forget any koan. Why bassui, or Ramana maharshi, ask always: what I am? Who listen etc? Is that not in the surface? Are mental structure, toxic if you really want to open yourself. 

Don't you think so? But you never say what you think, you keep it like a secret 😅. 

Edited Friday at 10:44 PM by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

14 hours ago, UnbornTao said:

@Breakingthewall You are missing the point of koans. They're not meant to be answered but rather to precipitate breakthroughs. 

You seem to be filled to the brim with "knowing" and might as well leave some space for contemplation.

I get upset too fast, sorry, I get very focused in that stuff then I answered you in an stupid way. Nobody is perfect 😅

[UnbornTao]

@Breakingthewall It's fine, not a problem.