Minerals in Ukraine

[WritingHands]

equality is NOT a thing

because DNA is a thing

[BlueOak]

Just now, WritingHands said:

nah

id rather day tbh (not in a war tho)

Me accepting the dictator in me, or the authoritarian, took a hell of a lot of work, and when we cannot do that internally, we create an external condition for it to be reconciled. In this case, authoritarianism vs democracy. The only way peace exists is for both sides to take on enough of the other for parity to be found, otherwise, all we get is:

THEY ARE BAD. WE ARE GOOD.
And the rejection of that part of ourselves. Which is conflict, which eventually bubbles up into a larger war.

The victim mindset is well documented and yes fear and unsafety can cause it, I sat it in for about a decade of my own life.

 

[WritingHands]

1 minute ago, BlueOak said:

Me accepting the dictator in me, or the authoritarian, took a hell of a lot of work, and when we cannot do that internally, we create an external condition for it to be reconciled. In this case, authoritarianism vs democracy. The only way peace exists is for both sides to take on enough of the other for parity to be found, otherwise, all we get is:

THEY ARE BAD. WE ARE GOOD.
And the rejection of that part of ourselves. Which is conflict, which eventually bubbles up into a larger war.

The victim mindset is well documented and yes fear and unsafety can cause it, I sat it in for about a decade of my own life.

 

i used to be quite the opposite of that stuff

tldr

 

also im not siding with anyone. what i wrote is position neutral

Edited December 3 by WritingHands

[WritingHands]

uh, just recently encountered this on the forum

was it just on my end or Leo needs to prep up the site?

 

Edited December 3 by WritingHands

[WritingHands]

1 hour ago, BlueOak said:

THEY ARE BAD. WE ARE GOOD.
 

i fucking hate this type of goodbad shit

its all gray.

 

1 hour ago, BlueOak said:

Me accepting the dictator in me, or the authoritarian,

THEY ARE BAD. WE ARE GOOD.
And the rejection of that part of ourselves. Which is conflict, which eventually bubbles up into a larger war.

The victim mindset is well documented and yes fear and unsafety can cause it, I sat it in for about a decade of my own life.

 

tell this shit to my mom jfl she needs it 

[WritingHands]

jfl 

thread escalated from minerals to fucking moral talks n shit 

[Something Funny]

8 hours ago, BlueOak said:

Which will last until Russia invades again. For their 9th war into former USSR territories.

They and the posters here will say: It's the wests fault, and list a few reasons they feel this way to justify the next war. I will say I must be a mind reader to have predicted this 5 years ago huh. Like I don't have 8 previous examples to look at, Russia repeatedly telling me it, and every previous condition for this war not only being still there but exaggerated on both sides.

1. You don't know what will actually happen

2. Even if Russia invades again, it's still better than non stop war.

Time and stalling is on the Ukrainian side. Putin is not immortal.

[BlueOak]

1 hour ago, Something Funny said:

1. You don't know what will actually happen

2. Even if Russia invades again, it's still better than non stop war.

Time and stalling is on the Ukrainian side. Putin is not immortal.

Its blindly obvious what will happen. Its not predicting the future it's me telling you this is what Russia is doing and has been doing 8 times in a row, and then everyone telling me why it's doing it and then me saying yes, none of that has changed, so they'll just do it again.

True Putin's KGB fossils are not immortal, but there are a dozen of them or so left, I hear. After that, we'll get fewer people caring about a dead empire called the USSR.

Non-stop war until Russia cannot effectively fight it controls what happens. It blunts Russia, their stockpiles are almost gone, BRICS has delayed this happening but they cannot prevent it entirely. See Syria, which Russia has had to pull out of. An element of certainty is exactly what every country bordering Putin's Empire wants. Without that certainty, countries suffer economically, politically and socially. Keeping the war and Russian control as far away from them as possible benefits every single eastern European country. The region has repeatedly fought wars with Russia and repeatedly had Russia or its previous incarnations meddle in their internal politics.

Now to Ukraine. Keeping Russia in the east is on the Ukranian's side also. If Russia gets to rearm, regroup and go again, it'll be twice as bad. They'll have fresh troops, new funds, new equipment, and supply lines, that's a terrible idea. Wars can be very long bloody affairs some last decades. If Putin really wants to fight forever until he has no economy or country left, that's up to him. Ukraine will be heavily invested in by the EU but nobody is going to help out the remote communities dotted over the giant landscape of Russia that Putin has drained of men and their futures.

[Something Funny]

@BlueOak okay, so if Russia keeps fighting this war, their arms will run out, and they will have no resources or country left. And if Ukraine continues fighting, they will be heavily invested by the EU, and hence have indefinite resources to keep fighting. 

Amazing logic, especially considering how:

- Ukraine is the one who lacking resources and proper support at the moment, and is losing territories because they don't have enough men and weapons.
- Russia manufactures more weapons per year than all of EU combined.
- Russia can send missiles all over Ukraine damaging its power stations, factories, roads, railroads, etc., while Ukraine can only attack a few hundred km into Russia. 

But I guess if they just keep fighting forever the situation will somehow magically turn around /s

And if the war gets placed on hold, Russia will have new troops, new equipment, new supply lines etc. Which won't apply to Ukraine for some reason. I guess they would just sit and do nothing. They wouldn't regroup, or rearm, or rebuild their infrastructure, or strengthen their borders, or make new deals with the west, and EU wouldn't use that chance to up its weapon's manufacturing so that it could actually be on par with Russia.

That also makes perfect sense...

 

[Something Funny]

@BlueOak also, I just love it when people nonchalantly play with others lives, while sitting in safety and comfort themselves. If you are so sure that continuing the war is so good then why don't you put your actions where your mouth is and go join Ukraine on the front lines? Stay there for a year and then tell me how you feel about staying there for another decade.

[BlueOak]

20 minutes ago, Something Funny said:

@BlueOak also, I just love it when people nonchalantly play with others lives, while sitting in safety and comfort themselves. If you are so sure that continuing the war is so good then why don't you put your actions where your mouth is and go join Ukraine on the front lines? Stay there for a year and then tell me how you feel about staying there for another decade.

Its precisely because I do not want a wider european war that I advocate for keeping the war as far away from Europe as possible. 

I actually almost did join in at the start, my earlier posts here were thinking on the idea, till I was told directly that untrained foreigners are not needed, because despite your fantasy of:

 

26 minutes ago, Something Funny said:

@BlueOak okay, so if Russia keeps fighting this war, their arms will run out, and they will have no resources or country left. And if Ukraine continues fighting, they will be heavily invested by the EU, and hence have indefinite resources to keep fighting. 

Amazing logic, especially considering how:

- Ukraine is the one who lacking resources and proper support at the moment, and is losing territories because they don't have enough men and weapons.
- Russia manufactures more weapons per year than all of EU combined.
- Russia can send missiles all over Ukraine damaging its power stations, factories, roads, railroads, etc., while Ukraine can only attack a few hundred km into Russia. 

But I guess if they just keep fighting forever the situation will somehow magically turn around /s

And if the war gets placed on hold, Russia will have new troops, new equipment, new supply lines etc. Which won't apply to Ukraine for some reason. I guess they would just sit and do nothing. They wouldn't regroup, or rearm, or rebuild their infrastructure, or strengthen their borders, or make new deals with the west, and EU wouldn't use that chance to up its weapon's manufacturing so that it could actually be on par with Russia.

That also makes perfect sense...

 

Ukraine does not need untrained manpower, they lack the gear to outfit hordes of throwaway soldiers like Russia does. Instead they use better gear, better training and better tactics to bleed the Russians.

The situation does not need to 'turn around' or magically do anything. Once again: Its to contain the war in the east of Ukraine, that has been the strategy for about 2 years now, and that is exactly what is happening. Russia keeps running headfirst into it.

Russia is down to tanks from the 60's and earlier, it cannot replace anything advanced, and its stockpiles were its main threat to Ukraine and the west collectively in any conventional fight. That and its population, which it is burning through, a population that was already in decline. Its economy is not doing well at all, so that decline keeps speeding up.

You do understand that the Russian economy compared to the EU collectively is only 1/10th of it. Not including the UK, America, or other NATO allies like Japan, South Korea, Turkey etc. Your reasoning that this is somehow a competitive point is nonsensical. Sure Russia retools its factories impressively, but if you are thinking that they would come out on top if the EU or NATO collectively actually started a war economy, that is pure fantasy.

Ukraine shoots down almost all Russian missiles. The cheap mass drones from Iran are more effective. 

You argue against yourself at the end. You say Russia can outproduce everyone, yet somehow Ukraine and the EU will have the same amount of production in any downtime if the war gets put on hold. You can't have it both ways.

An army is limited by how far their logistics stretch, it struggles to build this up in war time because people keep targeting them, in peace time it can build supply deports, rail connections, roads, ammunition stockpiles etc. This then allows it to push much further. This isn't even talking about how much harder it is to invade an entrenched position than one that has just been taken.

Edited December 3 by BlueOak

[Something Funny]

2 minutes ago, BlueOak said:

Its precisely because I do not want a wider european war that I advocate for keeping the war as far away from Europe as possible. 

So you are just a selfish coward, got it. Then stop pretending that you are arguing from some kind of strategic standpoint and just said that it benefits you more that Ukraine keep suffering as long as you ass is safe.

3 minutes ago, BlueOak said:

The situation does not need to 'turn around' or magically do anything. Once again: Its to contain the war in the east of Ukraine, that has been the strategy for about 2 years now, and that is exactly what is happening. Russia keeps running headfirst into it.

Ukraine is losing its positions and people. You can speculate as much as you want about how Russia is running out of tanks, or how they are burning through their population, but it's Ukraine that has been losing pretty consistently as of late. All the rest is just you talking out of your ass, with no proof to back up your words.

 

[BlueOak]

43 minutes ago, Something Funny said:

So you are just a selfish coward, got it. Then stop pretending that you are arguing from some kind of strategic standpoint and just said that it benefits you more that Ukraine keep suffering as long as you ass is safe.

Ukraine is losing its positions and people. You can speculate as much as you want about how Russia is running out of tanks, or how they are burning through their population, but it's Ukraine that has been losing pretty consistently as of late. All the rest is just you talking out of your ass, with no proof to back up your words.

 

I don't want Europe in a war no. That's some absurd definition of a coward you've got there. War is nothing to be proud of or want. If it can be contained until Russia cannot fight anymore then that is the best of a bad bunch of choices.

I've endless proof as i've been debating and talking about this for years, but I won't waste another word on someone like yourself. All you've got is venom for someone with another perspective why the hell do you engage in conversation? Ridiculous.

[Something Funny]

@BlueOak love how you twist my words to suit your convenience. I am the one arguing against the war here. My defintion of a selfish coward is - gambling other people's lives for your own personal gain and safety.

5 hours ago, BlueOak said:

I've endless proof as i've been debating and talking about this for years, but I won't waste another word on someone like yourself

Oh I am sorry, I didn't know that have a phd worth of of arguing with people on online forums. Of course you must have the clearest perspective of us all then.

5 hours ago, BlueOak said:

All you've got is venom for someone with another perspective why the hell do you engage in conversation? Ridiculous.

you are the one who tagged my week old comment and proposed to intentionally have other people keep dying because your strategic genius told you that it is the best option. I have a short temper when it comes to pathetic, petty worldviews like that.

But you are right, we don't have to keep talking. We just have to wait and have time prove you wrong.

[Bobby_2021]

The Russia that rises from the ashes after the war is a strong but resentful military juggernaut with defense spending that dwarfs that of NATO.

Of course this Russia would be a forced to be reckoned with. They will command the best army in the world de facto backed by China which is another manufacturing giant. 

What's NATO's plan to counter this with so many internal fissures and issues with batshit morons like Trump? 

To make matters worse China has been observing how west would respond to such an invasion, and they would be making use of Russian experience in the war too?

 

[BlueOak]

@Something Funny

You are incapable of realising all people want the same thing: safety. There is no twist of the words, it is two perspectives looking at the same problem with different solutions. 

You are incapable of this because all you can do is demean someone who disagrees with you; thus,  we have conflict on the macro and micro.

Its the old they are bad I am good nonesense you are just repeating it again. Here i'll reflect:

You are a coward for wanting to give an aggressive tyrant more land, and trying to sacrifice all these lives for nothing. Your perspective must be proved 'right' to make your ego feel good, and those who disagree must be proven to be the 'bad guy' so someone else can come along and tell you how great you are.

[Something Funny]

1 hour ago, BlueOak said:

You are incapable of realising all people want the same thing: safety. There is no twist of the words, it is two perspectives looking at the same problem with different solutions. 

You are incapable of realising my point, which is that while all people want safety, some people are audacious enough to exploit others for their own safety, like you.

1 hour ago, BlueOak said:

You are a coward for wanting to give an aggressive tyrant more land, and trying to sacrifice all these lives for nothing.

I am not sacrificing any lives. I am advocating for the war to stop, thus saving as many lives as possible. Ever heard of a sunken costs fallacy?

It's not my fault that you value a chunk of land belonging to one country over another more than a human life.

1 hour ago, BlueOak said:

Your perspective must be proved 'right' to make your ego feel good, and those who disagree must be proven to be the 'bad guy' so someone else can come along and tell you how great you are.

Not sure how this rambling about good, and bad, and ego connects with what I am saying? Are you incapable of thinking on your own instead of just parroting the same spiritual keywords whether they fit or not?

You are not a bad guy because you disagree with me, I simply think that people who use the lives of others in this kind of cold blooded politics game are pathetic, and you happen to be one of those people. Nowhere did I say that I want to be great or anything like that, I simply find people like you repulsive and get emotional about it. You make me want to throw up. It's that simple.

[Bobby_2021]

@Something Funny It's accepted in western circles to sell off weapons to Ukraine because Americans are not dying. Apparently they are making use the weapons that would have otherwise had to be maintained and Stored which is expensive compared to shipping them off to Ukraine for debt.

It's one giant scam of epic proportions.

[BlueOak]

@Something Funny
I have no power over anything happening in Ukraine, nor do you. I don't get to make a call. If I did we'd already have troops in Ukraine. You are projecting massively onto an opinion you don't like something that doesn't exist.

If I die in Ukraine it'll make no difference whatsoever, the world will still be in the same place. Would I go if we got into a war and we were called up, yes. Do I now qualify for your hero card? Or is it conceivable that a world war to stop Russia is worse than a war fought in the east of a country?

Giving up land to Putin is just going to encourage him to do more, as he has done again and again. Because nothing has changed about the world. Another foreigner who can't shoot a gun dying there will make no difference whatsoever.

All war is psychopathic, most of the world is that way. I value consciousness more than anything. This the best of a bad choice. 
 

Edited December 4 by BlueOak

[Oeaohoo]

On 30/11/2024 at 3:21 AM, Karmadhi said:

Israel does not care about truth nor human rights yet USA treats it like its son.

Does not seem like a convincing argument to me.

“Sovereign is he who decides the exception”…

Edited December 4 by Oeaohoo