Letting go of spirituality

[trenton]

I noticed something significant during my walks as I thought about my ego reactions. Firstly, I noticed how I compared myself to other seemingly more conscious or intelligent people. I noticed how my mind was wrestling with something until I labeled this movement in my mind and body as envy. I started evaluating why I had this reaction.

As I let go of current thoughts and patterns I noticed older memories and novel thoughts would take their place. I wanted to follow this rabbit hole and see where it took me. What eventually came up was my conception of God.

I have been questioning this lately because although I had a few breakthroughs in consciousness, most of my understanding of God was intellectual and based on things I've read and theorized about. I noticed how my mind seemed to be strongly and happily attached to this matrix of beliefs.

I decided to continue letting go. As I did that, a lot of intense feelings started coming up. I noticed how I used spirituality and this matrix of beliefs as a coping mechanism for my deepest existential fears and pains. This is about my fundamental struggle with purpose. I lost a sense of direction and purpose when there were complications with my career path. I tried to find a new purpose through spirituality, personal development, and actualized. My struggle with purpose goes back to childhood as I tried different grand narratives to find purpose. Truth is a common ideal I hold.

I continued letting go. Suddenly, I felt intense and overwhelming fear, anxiety, depression, and suffering. I noticed how I had been using spiritual ego and my beliefs about God to cope with suicidal thoughts by giving me a sense of purpose. This became my survival strategy, but sometimes I would still have strong feelings of depression and suicidal thoughts.

I wanted to let go of this identity that I have been using to mask my wounds. I wanted to face my problems, but I wanted to be cautious. I have done deep reflection like this before and it caused me lasting pain.

I remembered how I had used spirituality as a method of self harm and punishment due to depression corrupting various teachings. This is what led me to questioning my beliefs about God and spirituality. I knew parts of it were hurting me, but the parts that were helping me were masking deeper pain. I felt that maybe I wasn't mature enough for spirituality and I should let it go and come back to it in a couple years.

Part of spirituality that hurt me was my belief that suffering would ultimately transform me by facing it. Sometimes this led to methods of emotional and psychological self harm. I tried to rationalize my suffering with spirituality and I have been doing that since I was a child following severe trauma. This is part of what drives me to post a lot about suffering, my fears, and so on.

I wanted to build myself into someone who could better withstand suffering. This twisted into constant self punishment in terms of how my mind and emotions function. This was a result of a spiritual dream I had back in high school in which I saw Jesus. It describes my feelings pretty well, but was influenced by Christian beliefs and potentially social expectations of men to endure suffering. I don't see how society did that to me because it seemed like I did it to myself. I thought my suffering ultimately served a higher purpose, kind of like a martyr.

Anyway, at the end of all of this reflection I feel less attached to spirituality and the identity I created to cope with hardship. Maybe all the stuff I thought about God still stands, but I don't need it to mask suffering as if I must be spiritual to be good enough. I tried to be careful not to devolve into continued depression like I did in previous reflections.

On the surface I feel okay, but I don't know if the fundamental existential problem has been solved. I tried to find purpose in suffering to rationalize it and make it seem acceptable. I am cautiously trying to address these deep wounds without harming myself further.

Most of the time I have these kinds of experiences when I just go for walks and Mindfully observe my thoughts, emotions, movements, reactions and so forth looking for self knowledge. At the end of the day I just sleep on it and see how my mind changes the next day. This mindfulness is part of me trying to transform myself to ultimately beat depression.

any thoughts on this reflection and situation? I think my struggle with purpose is much deeper than the life purpose course could provide. Purpose is how I try to cope with suffering.

[James123]

2 hours ago, trenton said:

decided to continue letting go. As I did that, a lot of intense feelings started coming up. I noticed how I used spirituality and this matrix of beliefs as a coping mechanism for my deepest existential fears and pains.

Amazing brother. Many folks here just read and learn about spirituality. But, you can not know the path, you have to walk it. This is one of the example of walking the path. 

2 hours ago, trenton said:

. I have done deep reflection like this before and it caused me lasting pain.

The one who is cautious and feel pain have to let go. The identity must be surrender. 

2 hours ago, trenton said:

I wanted to build myself into someone who could better withstand suffering.

I is the suffering. You have to let go the I. 

2 hours ago, trenton said:

Most of the time I have these kinds of experiences when I just go for walks and Mindfully observe my thoughts, emotions, movements, reactions and so forth looking for self knowledge. At the end of the day I just sleep on it and see how my mind changes the next day. This mindfulness is part of me trying to transform myself to ultimately beat depression

İ was in the same shoes with you. İ let go the suffering identity with long term sitting (at least 3 hours per day) and did a psychedelic retreat in darkness and silence for 6-7 months. Then mind suddenly become quite. 

2 hours ago, trenton said:

any thoughts on this reflection and situation? I think my struggle with purpose is much deeper than the life purpose course could provide. Purpose is how I try to cope with suffering.

Pm me brother. İ will help you. 

[Ishanga]

5 hours ago, James123 said:

Amazing brother. Many folks here just read and learn about spirituality. But, you can not know the path, you have to walk it. This is one of the example of walking the path. 

The one who is cautious and feel pain have to let go. The identity must be surrender. 

I is the suffering. You have to let go the I. 

İ was in the same shoes with you. İ let go the suffering identity with long term sitting (at least 3 hours per day) and did a psychedelic retreat in darkness and silence for 6-7 months. Then mind suddenly become quite. 

Pm me brother. İ will help you. 

Your contradicting Yourself again, first You say one cannot know the path, that one has to walk it alone, then You offer help, which is basically You offering a path.

The path is not about the consequence, its to set up the consequence to happen naturally, like planting flowers, nothing You are doing to produce the flower has anything directly to do with a flower, but from the work (path) the flower appears. 

Paths just offer to a person a faster route, the old saying of using another experience to become wise is true, of course each person has a unique experience and sort of path, but using others experience is wise, with Spirituality this is very true, without Guru's there would be that much less Transformation in the world, they help immensely!!!! 

[James123]

19 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

Your contradicting Yourself again, first You say one cannot know the path, that one has to walk it alone, then You offer help, which is basically You offering a path.

Yo, are you ok? He has to walk, i can only show the path. 

Edited Wednesday at 10:50 AM by James123

[Javfly33]

10 hours ago, trenton said:

 

any thoughts on this reflection and situation? I think my struggle with purpose is much deeper than the life purpose course could provide. Purpose is how I try to cope with suffering.

I don´t see anything bad happening. You are just going through what is needed to awaken, as any of us here.

Suffering or pain is one the most fundamental ingredients, is the way you know that something is wrong, in some way you are not conducing life right, in some way you have no clarity, in some way you really don´t know what you are. 

♥️ Keep walking, you must not stop until you get to the destination. 

[Princess Arabia]

11 hours ago, trenton said:

Mindfully observe my thoughts, emotions, movements, reactions and so forth looking for self knowledge.

I know this is a teaching that people say to do and it sounds good and effective. What you're doing is actually strengthening the thoughts. Putting awareness on them, expanding them, giving them life and momentum. In the beginning this is fine but there comes a time when thoughts have to be let go of and not be consciously, mindfully observed. Notice the one that is observing the one doing the observing. Meaning, there is something there that notices you being mindful of thoughts. Notice that. Focus on that more. We shun self-inquiry practices but then we are still confused about reality and our true nature. We call it woo woo and that we are being practical and need to get to a certain point first. It is the only thing needed. When you recognize you are not the doer nor the changeful body/mind, lots of unnecessary problems fall away. You gain a sense of peace and serenity within. Problems still arise but they don't have the same pull and power they used to have. 

Notice the thoughts, but not mindfully. See them as a function. The mind thinks, the body reacts. You are neither. Take this for whatever it's worth; and I know you know deep down what's going on, but it's the mind's activity that has a hold on you. You are lost in it and every human's problems stems from this. Not normal everyday challenges, but spiritually speaking and all the existential crisis's. This is true spirituality and really the only thing that matters. 

[Ishanga]

12 hours ago, James123 said:

Yo, are you ok? He has to walk, i can only show the path. 

Your starting to post hypocritical things, so I'm calling You out on it that is all, we have too much of this stuff going on here and other places..

People are allowed to say what they want, but they should expect push back at times, that's only fair..

[James123]

24 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

Your starting to post hypocritical things, so I'm calling You out on it that is all, we have too much of this stuff going on here and other places..

People are allowed to say what they want, but they should expect push back at times, that's only fair..

You are lost brother. 

Peace!

[Razard86]

On 11/26/2024 at 9:31 PM, trenton said:

I noticed something significant during my walks as I thought about my ego reactions. Firstly, I noticed how I compared myself to other seemingly more conscious or intelligent people. I noticed how my mind was wrestling with something until I labeled this movement in my mind and body as envy. I started evaluating why I had this reaction.

As I let go of current thoughts and patterns I noticed older memories and novel thoughts would take their place. I wanted to follow this rabbit hole and see where it took me. What eventually came up was my conception of God.

I have been questioning this lately because although I had a few breakthroughs in consciousness, most of my understanding of God was intellectual and based on things I've read and theorized about. I noticed how my mind seemed to be strongly and happily attached to this matrix of beliefs.

I decided to continue letting go. As I did that, a lot of intense feelings started coming up. I noticed how I used spirituality and this matrix of beliefs as a coping mechanism for my deepest existential fears and pains. This is about my fundamental struggle with purpose. I lost a sense of direction and purpose when there were complications with my career path. I tried to find a new purpose through spirituality, personal development, and actualized. My struggle with purpose goes back to childhood as I tried different grand narratives to find purpose. Truth is a common ideal I hold.

I continued letting go. Suddenly, I felt intense and overwhelming fear, anxiety, depression, and suffering. I noticed how I had been using spiritual ego and my beliefs about God to cope with suicidal thoughts by giving me a sense of purpose. This became my survival strategy, but sometimes I would still have strong feelings of depression and suicidal thoughts.

I wanted to let go of this identity that I have been using to mask my wounds. I wanted to face my problems, but I wanted to be cautious. I have done deep reflection like this before and it caused me lasting pain.

I remembered how I had used spirituality as a method of self harm and punishment due to depression corrupting various teachings. This is what led me to questioning my beliefs about God and spirituality. I knew parts of it were hurting me, but the parts that were helping me were masking deeper pain. I felt that maybe I wasn't mature enough for spirituality and I should let it go and come back to it in a couple years.

Part of spirituality that hurt me was my belief that suffering would ultimately transform me by facing it. Sometimes this led to methods of emotional and psychological self harm. I tried to rationalize my suffering with spirituality and I have been doing that since I was a child following severe trauma. This is part of what drives me to post a lot about suffering, my fears, and so on.

I wanted to build myself into someone who could better withstand suffering. This twisted into constant self punishment in terms of how my mind and emotions function. This was a result of a spiritual dream I had back in high school in which I saw Jesus. It describes my feelings pretty well, but was influenced by Christian beliefs and potentially social expectations of men to endure suffering. I don't see how society did that to me because it seemed like I did it to myself. I thought my suffering ultimately served a higher purpose, kind of like a martyr.

Anyway, at the end of all of this reflection I feel less attached to spirituality and the identity I created to cope with hardship. Maybe all the stuff I thought about God still stands, but I don't need it to mask suffering as if I must be spiritual to be good enough. I tried to be careful not to devolve into continued depression like I did in previous reflections.

On the surface I feel okay, but I don't know if the fundamental existential problem has been solved. I tried to find purpose in suffering to rationalize it and make it seem acceptable. I am cautiously trying to address these deep wounds without harming myself further.

Most of the time I have these kinds of experiences when I just go for walks and Mindfully observe my thoughts, emotions, movements, reactions and so forth looking for self knowledge. At the end of the day I just sleep on it and see how my mind changes the next day. This mindfulness is part of me trying to transform myself to ultimately beat depression.

any thoughts on this reflection and situation? I think my struggle with purpose is much deeper than the life purpose course could provide. Purpose is how I try to cope with suffering.

1. I recommend taking a break from Spirituality. The first thing I would do is find out what issues you have with yourself. Do you have body image issues? Issues with the way your body smells or moves? Do you have issues with the clothes you wear? Do you have issues with your career or social status? Do you have unhealed relationship issues with the people in your life?

2. Next thing I would do is make a list of all of my talents and then ask myself what is the best way I can use them to create something? This is how you find purpose through your natural gifts. 

3. Lastly I would make a list of all the things I love about myself, and pat myself on the back. Then make a list of your favorite hobbies and go do them and if you have any friends, go hang out with them. 

The key to dealing with Depression is discovering how amazing you are. Take stock in all the things you have accomplished even things you think are little.

[trenton]

@Razard86 I've come to this forum to complain about my problems many times in the past. I am trying to make a conscious effort to not rant and rave about my family, my career, my mental health, and so forth. I have a plan in place for dealing with these things, but it might take a couple of months. It is hard to brute force my way out of these problems.

One issue that concerns me is an apparent neurological disorder that is causing tingling in body and muscle spasms. It is unclear what caused this along with my hyper awareness that makes it hard to sleep. The doctor thinks it might be caused by trauma, but I don't know which trauma. This happens along with thoughts of killing myself even though I don't actually want to kill myself.

I know how amazing I am. I used my wisdom, intelligence, and research to help transform people's lives. I once helped a woman who was a victim of predatory loaning that had her 60,000 dollars in debt. I made her cry tears of joy. I also helped a three year old girl who was abandoned by her parents. I have done all kinds of awesome things aside from helping people, not to mention all my successes in my chess career. I trained children well enough to win tournaments and even defeated a national master in a real tournament. Although I suffer from depression, I managed to use all of my research and self reflection to develop deep wisdom and self knowledge that I use to help others. I helped my brother stop his suicidal thoughts and I have helped people better process trauma by combining psychology and spirituality. Sometimes I do better than actual therapists. Some therapists were using tough love on clients and I was more helpful to them because of how insightful I have become through my own experience with depression.

I'm really good at helping others with mental problems, but I don't understand why these suicidal thoughts keep happening to me even though I don't want to die. There is hope for me and I tried using spirituality to find that hope before, but it didn't pan out the way I hoped.

[Razard86]

3 hours ago, trenton said:

@Razard86 I've come to this forum to complain about my problems many times in the past. I am trying to make a conscious effort to not rant and rave about my family, my career, my mental health, and so forth. I have a plan in place for dealing with these things, but it might take a couple of months. It is hard to brute force my way out of these problems.

One issue that concerns me is an apparent neurological disorder that is causing tingling in body and muscle spasms. It is unclear what caused this along with my hyper awareness that makes it hard to sleep. The doctor thinks it might be caused by trauma, but I don't know which trauma. This happens along with thoughts of killing myself even though I don't actually want to kill myself.

I know how amazing I am. I used my wisdom, intelligence, and research to help transform people's lives. I once helped a woman who was a victim of predatory loaning that had her 60,000 dollars in debt. I made her cry tears of joy. I also helped a three year old girl who was abandoned by her parents. I have done all kinds of awesome things aside from helping people, not to mention all my successes in my chess career. I trained children well enough to win tournaments and even defeated a national master in a real tournament. Although I suffer from depression, I managed to use all of my research and self reflection to develop deep wisdom and self knowledge that I use to help others. I helped my brother stop his suicidal thoughts and I have helped people better process trauma by combining psychology and spirituality. Sometimes I do better than actual therapists. Some therapists were using tough love on clients and I was more helpful to them because of how insightful I have become through my own experience with depression.

I'm really good at helping others with mental problems, but I don't understand why these suicidal thoughts keep happening to me even though I don't want to die. There is hope for me and I tried using spirituality to find that hope before, but it didn't pan out the way I hoped.

On 11/26/2024 at 9:31 PM, trenton said:

I noticed something significant during my walks as I thought about my ego reactions. Firstly, I noticed how I compared myself to other seemingly more conscious or intelligent people. I noticed how my mind was wrestling with something until I labeled this movement in my mind and body as envy. I started evaluating why I had this reaction.

As I let go of current thoughts and patterns I noticed older memories and novel thoughts would take their place. I wanted to follow this rabbit hole and see where it took me. What eventually came up was my conception of God.

I have been questioning this lately because although I had a few breakthroughs in consciousness, most of my understanding of God was intellectual and based on things I've read and theorized about. I noticed how my mind seemed to be strongly and happily attached to this matrix of beliefs.

I decided to continue letting go. As I did that, a lot of intense feelings started coming up. I noticed how I used spirituality and this matrix of beliefs as a coping mechanism for my deepest existential fears and pains. This is about my fundamental struggle with purpose. I lost a sense of direction and purpose when there were complications with my career path. I tried to find a new purpose through spirituality, personal development, and actualized. My struggle with purpose goes back to childhood as I tried different grand narratives to find purpose. Truth is a common ideal I hold.

I continued letting go. Suddenly, I felt intense and overwhelming fear, anxiety, depression, and suffering. I noticed how I had been using spiritual ego and my beliefs about God to cope with suicidal thoughts by giving me a sense of purpose. This became my survival strategy, but sometimes I would still have strong feelings of depression and suicidal thoughts.

I wanted to let go of this identity that I have been using to mask my wounds. I wanted to face my problems, but I wanted to be cautious. I have done deep reflection like this before and it caused me lasting pain.

I remembered how I had used spirituality as a method of self harm and punishment due to depression corrupting various teachings. This is what led me to questioning my beliefs about God and spirituality. I knew parts of it were hurting me, but the parts that were helping me were masking deeper pain. I felt that maybe I wasn't mature enough for spirituality and I should let it go and come back to it in a couple years.

Part of spirituality that hurt me was my belief that suffering would ultimately transform me by facing it. Sometimes this led to methods of emotional and psychological self harm. I tried to rationalize my suffering with spirituality and I have been doing that since I was a child following severe trauma. This is part of what drives me to post a lot about suffering, my fears, and so on.

I wanted to build myself into someone who could better withstand suffering. This twisted into constant self punishment in terms of how my mind and emotions function. This was a result of a spiritual dream I had back in high school in which I saw Jesus. It describes my feelings pretty well, but was influenced by Christian beliefs and potentially social expectations of men to endure suffering. I don't see how society did that to me because it seemed like I did it to myself. I thought my suffering ultimately served a higher purpose, kind of like a martyr.

Anyway, at the end of all of this reflection I feel less attached to spirituality and the identity I created to cope with hardship. Maybe all the stuff I thought about God still stands, but I don't need it to mask suffering as if I must be spiritual to be good enough. I tried to be careful not to devolve into continued depression like I did in previous reflections.

On the surface I feel okay, but I don't know if the fundamental existential problem has been solved. I tried to find purpose in suffering to rationalize it and make it seem acceptable. I am cautiously trying to address these deep wounds without harming myself further.

Most of the time I have these kinds of experiences when I just go for walks and Mindfully observe my thoughts, emotions, movements, reactions and so forth looking for self knowledge. At the end of the day I just sleep on it and see how my mind changes the next day. This mindfulness is part of me trying to transform myself to ultimately beat depression.

any thoughts on this reflection and situation? I think my struggle with purpose is much deeper than the life purpose course could provide. Purpose is how I try to cope with suffering.

I agree that it sounds like you have a neurological disorder. If you are not suicidal but are getting those thoughts it probably is that. When you say thoughts you mean voices in your head right? Or is it imagery, or both?

I recently was doing some Spiritual Work and entered a State of Consciousness where my mind started creating personalities within me that talked to me and tormented me. I had to take some medication to get it to stop. You could be suffering from psychosis. What did the Doctors say?

[trenton]

@Razard86 I have an inner dialogue about these sorts of things. Occasionally they are accompanied by imagery of knives or bridges. The only time I heard voices was during sleep paralysis. Other than that I'm not having hallucinations like voices in my head.

I have a doctor's appointment on the seventh. I never was told I might have psychosis.