Power is important if you want to raise collective consciousness

[ChrisZoZo]

1 hour ago, James123 said:

Buddha left the kingdom, Jesus died on cross, Muhammed died within a tent. Which power? Money? They are all poor as f... Mohammed spent his wife's entire money for religion. Not gaining for just giving. Jesus let them sacrifice himself on the cross for truth. Buddha left his kingdom and went to forest

Well guess we are both wrong and right because I didn’t specify. When someone is so effective at uplifting people they affect power. They from just being an example change the world. Look how powerful the they became granted Jesus wasn’t in the body when was at full power. And the Buddha didn’t see most until way after his passing.

It show there extent of how effective it was to be that enlightened. It matters as you won’t awaken the world when you are asleep and if you can get in to power while a wake you are laughing. 
 

Also Jesus didn’t die in the cross for truth. He died to show death isn’t real.

[Ishanga]

1 hour ago, Da77en said:

Sadhguru is pretty legit but he still has some work to do if he wants to have more presence in the west. I agree that it's important to be evolved before you take action in the world it's just that the religious and materialist type people are doing it for a long time and they have pretty distorted understandings of life and thus we are dealing with these unhealthy societal structures. Spirituality has been repressed and is just starting to see light in the modern age because of improvements in information exchange, technology, etc.

I think he is starting to really focus on the West, he's setting up another Ashram in Seatle or LA besides the one in Tennesse, and is building a Yogic City on the grounds of the Tennessee ashram, which I have been too..

He's Indian for sure, but he's brought up in Western Philosophy and Culture, he doesn't do that Indian Roll of the Head you see Indians do allot, so he's pretty Western in my book, rides motorcycles, flies helicopters, luvs speed, and such...I think he has a very big influence in the West already, he's bigger than Tony Robbins who's been at it for maybe just as long as Sadhguru has, so that says allot!

[PurpleTree]

In this world, you gotta make the money first. Then when you get the money, you get the power. Then when you get the power, then you get the spirituality. 

PurpleFace

[Joshe]

On 11/11/2024 at 9:19 PM, integral said:

We Should be able to play this game better than them. But we’re not.. 

And this is because something is missing in the practice.

We need to rethink the practice and really create a world class spiritual teaching that is applicable to this era.

We should be playing this game better than Elon and better than Trump, but we’re not.

It's a breath of fresh air to see this attitude. 

What greater good is there than to care more about the peace and enlightenment of the whole? There is none. It's the ultimate life purpose.

I care more that the world find peace than I find it. I'd give my life in service to that cause.

This "it's all an illusion" talk can be transcended. Why do you think we're here? What will you do when you reach that high peak? Come back and chop wood carry water? Ah yes... you will finally be at peace at last. You will have fulfilled your curiosity and you will know how to remain calm. YOU will be nice and cozy chopping your wood. 

Peaceful people sit in ignorant bliss while the world withers. For the strong, the state of reality serves as fuel. 

The problem is it takes much development to care more about reality than oneself. Weakness pervades. Most so-called spiritual people care more about their own comfort than anything else and they'll use any story they can to preserve their cushiony homeostasis. 

The work begins by solving the problems of recruitment/mobilization, securing capital, and coordination. It can be done but there would need to be a leader to hold it all together. Where's @Leo Gura?

 

 

Edited November 13 by Joshe

[Breakingthewall]

13 hours ago, Da77en said:

The great thing about spirituality is it's not someone's invention or ideology. If you start deconstructing any distorted, fear based ideas of life you become spiritual because that's life's natural state. The religions of this world and various other misunderstands society has accumulated for thousands of years are what need to be confronted and let go of if we want a healthy society and planet.

Agree. In the very near past, 99.9% of humans had a tribal mentality, which is totally limiting, and towards real spirituality something impossible and religion something necessary. The majority is still tribal and egoic, but the number of free minds, or those with the possibility of freeing themselves, grows exponentially. I would say that in a few years being truly enlightened will not be so rare.

13 hours ago, James123 said:

Buddha left the kingdom, Jesus died on cross, Muhammed died within a tent. Which power? Money? They are all poor as f... Mohammed spent his wife's entire money for religion. Not gaining for just giving. Jesus let them sacrifice himself on the cross for truth. Buddha left his kingdom and went to forest. 

You have a lot of preconceived ideas of how things should be, how an enlightened guy should be. Should he have a beard?

[James123]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

You have a lot of preconceived ideas of how things should be, how an enlightened guy should be. Should he have a beard?

Not at all. It is just what is. Please give me an example, rich and enlightened person. 

Just don't tell me Osho or Shadguru, because none of the things personally belong to them. 

Edited November 13 by James123

[James123]

12 hours ago, ChrisZoZo said:

Well guess we are both wrong and right because I didn’t specify. When someone is so effective at uplifting people they affect power. They from just being an example change the world. Look how powerful the they became granted Jesus wasn’t in the body when was at full power. And the Buddha didn’t see most until way after his passing.

Christian in this form will be upset about this. Buddha left his kingdom when he was very young. 

12 hours ago, ChrisZoZo said:

It show there extent of how effective it was to be that enlightened. It matters as you won’t awaken the world when you are asleep and if you can get in to power while a wake you are laughing. 

Imo, It doesn't matter. Because no body and nobody is here. 

 

12 hours ago, ChrisZoZo said:

Also Jesus didn’t die in the cross for truth. He died to show death isn’t real.

Christian in the form will be upset I think. So what happen to Jesus? 

[Breakingthewall]

14 minutes ago, James123 said:

Not at all. It is just what is. Please give me an example, rich and enlightened person. 

Ramaiah was rich, sadhguru has more millions than he can count. He was a successful business man before being a guru. Are they enlightened? Supposedly yes

Edited November 13 by Breakingthewall

[Jannes]

@integral You touch the heart of some central problems! 

So you propose that you want to get in a position of power and when you are there, you want to use your power for good. But how can you be sure that the process of getting power won't corrupt your soul? Or - how to defeat the devil without becoming one yourself?

[James123]

5 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Ramaiah was rich, sadhguru has more millions than he can count.

Shadguru says that none of the money belongs to him. Moreover, he has a decent of life style. 

 

8 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Ramaiah was rich,

Who is this?

 

 

Look at what Shadguru says here. 

[Breakingthewall]

4 minutes ago, James123 said:

Shadguru says that none of the money belongs to him. Moreover, he has a decent of life style

He has a daughter right? I'd like to know is his daughter works cleaning houses or what

5 minutes ago, James123 said:

Who is this?

An Indian rich guru who worked in bank and came from a rich family 

[James123]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

e has a daughter right? I'd like to know is his daughter works cleaning houses or what

I have no idea. 

[Ajay0]

On 11/12/2024 at 7:35 AM, integral said:

Why do we considering ourselves more conscious than others when the fools have the most power, the most wealth and the most influence?

It takes selfish greedy despicable behaviour to reach the levels billionaires have reached, but this evil is necessary for spiritual work.

You’re going to sit here and be all peaceful, inactive, and spiritual while the fools take over the world? 

We are all divided and not pulling together our resources and growing and becoming strong.

You need power you need influence you need money for world class spirituality.

Which one of you is running a multi billion dollar AI company?

We need the ambition to run a multi billion dollar high consciousness organization. Regardless of how unlikely and easily corruptible it is. It is still all necessary. We need everyone pushing for this and the end result will be progress.

This is actually an ancient concept known as the Rajarshi.

The Rajarshi means one who has attained both spiritual prosperity as in enlightenment and material prosperity as in wealth and riches.

The Rajarshi is considered superior to the mere monk because the monk is dependent on the Rajarshi for his food, shelter and other necessities. By aiding the monk in his material needs, the Rajarshi gets the spiritual merit for it.

The slogan of the enlightened sage Prem Nirmal is to become 'an enlightened billionaire.'

Janaka is mentioned in the Vedas and Bhagavad Gita as an ancient enlightened king who attained enlightenment , and is often considered as a symbolic example of the Rajarshi.

Solomon is similarly an example of a wise and wealthy philosopher-king in the Abrahamic tradition.

Janaka and Solomon are good examples to follow in terms of people who have attained both spiritual and material prosperity.

[creativepursuit]

On 12/11/2024 at 7:35 AM, integral said:

You need power you need influence you need money for world class spirituality.

If not pursued consciously, they are in direct conflict with each other

[creativepursuit]

On 12/11/2024 at 8:03 AM, Da77en said:

it's about updating your approach to whatever times you live in.

Truth is time-agnostic. If it's not, it must not be the truth.

[creativepursuit]

On 13/11/2024 at 8:37 AM, Joshe said:

We Should be able to play this game better than them

I talk to people in the matrix, and some fear that if everyone pursued spirituality, what would happen to the system? Please know that historically, the teachings have been kept secret in many cultures so that society can function and the economy can flourish (the Indian caste system, for example). 

[James123]

@integral

Even Osho admits that money is BS. 

[Da77en]

11 hours ago, creativepursuit said:

Truth is time-agnostic. If it's not, it must not be the truth.

Time is an illusion yes but change is not. Referring to sages that lived 100s or 1000s of years ago as a justification to not use approaches that are relevant to current situations is a very limited approach from my perspective.

The illusion of time is created by constantly looking at reality through different perspectives, all of those perspectives exist now.

You can refer to something from the context of the so called past or projected future as long as you know that the idea of the so called past and future is just referring to different perspectives that all exist now. If someone starts to believe that something actually exists in the “past/future” that’s where the misperception is happening.

Lastly, this is besides the point and I'm not talking about you or anyone in particular. Many of these self proclaimed non-dualists, whether the students or teachers of non-duality who specifically target the non-duality aspects of consciousness. These kinds of people often have very one dimensional understandings of consciousness and make things very intellectual. One way you can understand whether someone truly understands what they are talking about is whether they are able to talk about consciousness in a multi-dimensional multi-faceted approach or whether they just refer to the same one dimensional talking points and cant actually explain them very deeply. One dimensionality is a sign that someone is making spirituality into too much of an intellectual pursuit. 

Edited November 14 by Da77en

[PurpleTree]

On 2024-11-14 at 4:38 PM, Da77en said:

One dimensionality is a sign that someone is making spirituality into too much of an intellectual pursuit. 

Could also be the other way around. One who wants to talk about "consciousness“ in multifaceted ways is making spirituality into too much of an intellectual pursuit.

[Ishanga]

On 11/13/2024 at 6:59 AM, Breakingthewall said:

He has a daughter right? I'd like to know is his daughter works cleaning houses or what

An Indian rich guru who worked in bank and came from a rich family 

Sadhguru's Daughter is an Indian Dancer (Radhe Jaggi is a Bharatanatyam artiste (It is a classical dance form recognized by the Sangeet Natak Akademi, and expresses South Indian religious themes and spiritual ideas of Hinduism and Jainism.) based out of Chennai, India.) 

When Covid hit, Isha almost went bust, there were no programs going on and it was hard on the Foundation to raise funds to support the organization, there are some 4,000 full time volunteers at the Ashram in India that have to eat and such, plus the maintainence of the place, and the ashram in the USA and what is happening there, plus they do medical support for a ton of villages in South India and other programs that require money to support that effort, never mind the Spiritual programs and such...

Edited November 16 by Ishanga