Human Mint

Perfect sleep as soon as you can.

Started by Human Mint,

54 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, trenton said:

@integral if you are right about this, then that changes literally everything I have been doing for the past seven years. My doctors have been telling me my sleeping problems were caused by hypervigilance due to PTSD and trauma. I have been seeking treatment for PTSD, OCD, autism, depression, and anxiety. If my diagnosis was a misinterpretation of my reactions to chemicals, then what the fuck have I been doing for the past seven years reading all these books on emotions and psychology only to still hate myself automatically? I have been going to treatment centers and group therapy to get on all kinds of pills only for my problems to return as soon as I get weaned off the pills.

Maybe the reason therapy was ineffective was because it didn't address the problem. I even started to wonder if me seeking help was a mistake because it felt like spinning my wheels in the mud. Thank you for opening my eyes to this new possibility.

I’ve been in the exact same situation, I even have a sophisticated autism diagnosis by multiple professional. I’ve been diagnosed that it was all in my head 100 different ways. And in the end, it just wasn’t. I spent all my time learning everything about psychology, spirituality enlightenment, trying to enlighten myself into sleeping…

I went from sleeping an hour a day to sleeping as long as I want. So I feel your pain.

Doctors and psychiatrist just don’t know anything about this, it is very difficult to think outside the box. And for something like a smell to cause sleep deprivation is way beyond the box.

To add to this, I wanna give you some other techniques that you probably have not heard of and they’re simple so these will probably help you even if you’re getting stimulated by chemicals and food sensitivity.

1) go to settings on your phone and set white point to the lowest amount for bedtime, you can set this automation, so it automatically does it at night.

2) go on YouTube and listen to stories with your phone off just with audio, this will significantly help you distract yourself and will always lead to “dozing off feeling”. Because it prevents the rambling voice in your head long enough for you to relax.

3) eat a huge meal as your last meal of the day: this is always critical, normally you’re not supposed to do this because it makes your sleep quality worse, but in this situation eating a large meal will change your hormones and cause sedation. In extreme scenarios, I would eat a bunch of bread when I was desperate enough, and that would knock me out. This works because it changes your hormones and that’s the whole problem, your hormones are stimulated by something. NEVER go to bed hungry, this is the worst thing you can do with this condition.

4) the best deep breathing is yawning. You can forcefully induce a yawn if you know the trick.. and the reason this is useless because no matter what’s going on if you can forcefully do this it changes your hormones. If you could back to back stimulate a yawn it will significantly help you relax. But this isn’t a guaranteed thing. It’s just a good technique to master. You want to hit a solid 10 yawns in a row.

I have more, the issue is there’s so many traps people will tell you to meditate and do all these things and it does not work at all when you’re being stimulated outside of your control. Meditation is basically impossible. It’s like meditating while someone is stabbing your leg. You’re meditating while being stimulated by chemicals that cause mental noise.

Edited by integral

How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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Posted (edited)

9 hours ago, integral said:

For example, the book recommended in this topic does not help people who have a pre-existing sleep condition. It’s good to maximize health but if you already have a problem, then you have to resolve and figure out what the problem is

Have you read it? It actually helps you generate a big picture understanding of sleep. The overthinking aspect is when you do not have a big picture understanding in my opinion. Maybe the summary I wrote doesn't even capture the spirit of the book and the point I am trying to make, but nevertheless you don't need to fully discard it.

I reckon I have a bias towards reading. But please be open to it.

8 hours ago, trenton said:

My doctors have been telling me my sleeping problems were caused by hypervigilance due to PTSD and trauma.

This is actually a big issue since you're never going to be open to the actual factors that might be disturbing your sleep. Like, hyprevigilance causes bad sleep, ok great. But what if it is the other way around, meaning bad sleep causes hypervigilance?

There is a correlation between chronic sleep deprivation and mental health problem like psychosis. We are talking about months and years of bad sleep, even though a single all-nighter is bad enough. Hopefully you don't need the book to understand is just bad.

But the book is perfect if you want a better nuanced understanding. Read it at your own pace.

In fact, I would argue that just having a list of factors disrupting your sleep withouth a background context won't actually help you.

If you sleep bad then the other day you're going to have a bad humour and be excesively reactive to negative stuff. This is something you can see for yourself.

Edited by Human Mint

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Posted

10 hours ago, trenton said:

I would like to see a list of everything I need to get rid of.

Having a controlled temperature of about 18°C is a huge component.

Not drinking estimulants like caffeine is a huge component. If you do so make sure you do them 10hs before bedtime.

Anything that is sedative is not sleep-promoting. Alcohol is sedative for example, but it won't actually induce sleep.

Light exposure before bed is also a huge blocking factor of sleep. When the sun goes down, melatonin levels rises which signals your brain is time for sleep.

But when the sun goes down and you turn on your lights and use your cellphone then you're impeding melatonin release.

A keyword you need to know is sleep pressure. As you go along your day, sleep preassure accumulates just as you spend energy in the activities of the day, because it is the result of adenosine accumulation. And during sleep the adenosine accumulation is worn off, reseting the system.

There are key concepts within the book (and on the internet too for that matter) that you need to integrate to properly assesing the problem of bad sleep. I advice you to give it an eye while also listening to advices from other sources or people.

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6 hours ago, integral said:

I have more, the issue is there’s so many traps people will tell you to meditate and do all these things and it does not work at all when you’re being stimulated outside of your control. Meditation is basically impossible. It’s like meditating while someone is stabbing your leg. You’re meditating while being stimulated by chemicals that cause mental noise.

I agree. Meditation is out of the ecuation here. It is not the big elephant in the room.

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22 hours ago, M A J I said:

Step 1: Go to the mountains far away from civilization and artificial noises.

Step 2: Pitch a tent, ditch your phone, fast from food or eat light, no later than 4pm.

Step 3: Hike all day and read a little if desired, or meditate, sun-gaze.

Enjoy the perfect nights sleep.

This is good but you can't do that everyday. Not sustainable unless you're a nomad or a shepherd in the mountains.

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52 minutes ago, Human Mint said:

This is good but you can't do that everyday. Not sustainable unless you're a nomad or a shepherd in the mountains.

You can work to mimic that as close as possible. Pitch a tent in your backyard, turn of all the electronics 2 - 4 hours before bedtime, stay off the screens and blue-light or install blue-blocking screens / layers and films, shungite paint is also a good option for EMF shielding, exercise in the sun daily, eat clean organic whole foods, lay off the junks, listen to natural healing frequencies or create music yourself with instruments or voice. There is many things we can do to mimic nature in an unnatural environment, it won't be as powerful and regenerative but its better than nothing.

As above so below, as within so without.

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Posted (edited)

@Human Mint I learned the stuff in that book the first year I developed a sleeping disorder. That was 15 years ago , Its all very common knowledge. Good sleep hygiene. And this approach precisely is what everyone tries to teach you when you have a sleeping disorder and what precisely does not work. It doesn’t matter what temperature his room is it doesn’t matter what he ate(unless he has a sensitivity to it). It doesn’t matter when he ate. It doesn’t matter if he’s wearing a sleep mask, none of these good sleep hygiene tips help people with severe sleeping disorders.

This stuff is for normal people to maximize the quality of their life and I 100% agree with that.

and unfortunately, it’s for normal people to think they know what a sleeping disorder is and how to fix it with cookie cutter answers. And so you get psychologist and doctors that have no idea what they’re talking about… they waste years of your life, pump you up with drugs and think this is somehow solving something. And I’m sure you know based on reading the book that these drugs only make your sleep quality worse. Then why are they being used? Because there’s a sleeping disorder. And the goal is not to maximize the quality of sleep.

Trenton should learn the stuff in that book, as a foundation, but this is not a foundation for sleeping disorders. It’s like reading a book on how to maximize muscle gain when you have a broken back from a car accident. Trenton basically broke his back is in chronic pain, but you guys are recommending that he does high intensity squats every day to recover. Lol

The stuff I wrote goes beyond what the establishment is teaching people and specifically designed for people with a 5+ year sleeping disorders that no one can solve.

but I 100% agree that Trenton should experiment with all of these things to see if they’re going to help him or not. Don’t take my word for anything, verify everything.

Edited by integral

How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, Human Mint said:

Having a controlled temperature of about 18°C is a huge component.

Not drinking estimulants like caffeine is a huge component. If you do so make sure you do them 10hs before bedtime.

Anything that is sedative is not sleep-promoting. Alcohol is sedative for example, but it won't actually induce sleep.

Light exposure before bed is also a huge blocking factor of sleep. When the sun goes down, melatonin levels rises which signals your brain is time for sleep.

But when the sun goes down and you turn on your lights and use your cellphone then you're impeding melatonin release.

A keyword you need to know is sleep pressure. As you go along your day, sleep preassure accumulates just as you spend energy in the activities of the day, because it is the result of adenosine accumulation. And during sleep the adenosine accumulation is worn off, reseting the system.

There are key concepts within the book (and on the internet too for that matter) that you need to integrate to properly assesing the problem of bad sleep. I advice you to give it an eye while also listening to advices from other sources or people.

He has a sleeping disorder… his problem is not that he has bad sleep hygiene habits. Yes, he 100% has bad sleep hygiene habits and should learn to avoid that but they’re not the cause of a sleeping disorder.

You can sleep no matter what you do during the day no matter your circumstances maybe it will slightly make it hard for you to sleep. In the end of the day, you do not have a sleeping disorder. Normal people can sleep no matter how they sabotage themselves. Because they don’t have sleeping disorders.

In Trenton’s case, he literally cannot fall asleep. It doesn’t matter what he does during the day. It doesn’t matter what he eats it literally nothing matters. He could be exhausted out of his mind with the highest state of adenacene production, and it will not matter when his head touches the pillow his brain will be hyperactive and he won’t be able to sleep.

Because like I said something is stimulating him. His hormones are all messed up. Because he is in such high sleep deprivation he is of course stressed about sleep and has a bad relationship with sleep, and all that has to be solved specifically and only by sleeping more. Nothing else can change the mindset. 

I’m going to create a website to help people with sleeping disorders in the future for now I have other things I have to do.

Edited by integral

How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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20 minutes ago, integral said:

Its all very common knowledge. Good sleep hygiene.

Don't be so sure about that, is very common for us nerdys and people within the self-help domain. But 80% of population don't care about it.

On the other hand, you might know about that stuff but do exactly the opposite of the recommendation, i.e. going out and drinking alcohol and talking about good sleep.

@trenton Try to reach out to a sleep specialist

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Posted (edited)

The sleep specialists have already failed him. That’s the whole point of the conversation of having with him.

I sacrifice 12 years of my life to learn everything about this topic, I have surpassed all sleep specialists. And I’m not saying that with arrogance I’m saying that because I’ve spoken to dozens of sleep specialist in my area and they all produced the same cookie cutter answers and truly have no understanding of sleeping disorders because they’re repeating what they were told in school and that knowledge is very limited. They do not have experience.

The same has to go for all Internet resources about sleeping disorders. They’re all very limited and do not solve anyone’s real world problems.

I have never seen someone with a major sleeping disorder actually solve it, unless they have something very simple that can easily be fixed like sleep apnoea. 

Edited by integral

How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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Posted (edited)

19 minutes ago, Human Mint said:

Don't be so sure about that, is very common for us nerdys and people within the self-help domain. But 80% of population don't care about it.

On the other hand, you might know about that stuff but do exactly the opposite of the recommendation, i.e. going out and drinking alcohol and talking about good sleep.

@trenton Try to reach out to a sleep specialist

I meant it’s knowledge that existed for a very long time and it’s been packaged together into a book. If you do research is the first stuff you learn about the topic.

When I mean, common knowledge, I mean it’s part of the status quo part of what everyone has agreed is true part of established social norms. Part of scientific consensus, and unfortunately, none of that helps people with sleeping disorders.

What helps people with sleeping disorders has not become popular yet and is not widespread information and it is very hard to find.

Edited by integral

How is this post just me acting out my ego in the usual ways? Is this post just me venting and justifying my selfishness? Are the things you are posting in alignment with principles of higher consciousness and higher stages of ego development? Are you acting in a mature or immature way? Are you being selfish or selfless in your communication? Are you acting like a monkey or like a God-like being?

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Posted

22 hours ago, caspex said:

I decided to see yesterday how much I needed to sleep actually. I decided I'll let myself sleep as long as I want. To my surprise, I fell asleep at 7:30 PM, when I woke up it was 2:50AM and I felt energized, but I felt like I could sleep again, so just after 2 minutes, I closed my eyes again and it was 7:30AM.

I slept for a good 12 hours. After which, at 10AM, I took another nap for 2 hours. I think my body really needs the sleep right now due to the stress. I had dreams for the first time in the last few months and a bunch of them were nightmares. I was in fact loudly mumbling the screams from my dream, my father had to comfort me.

What I have learnt is that sleep is very important. Neglect it and it's not just the physical aspect of your being that'll suffer. I am feeling sleepy right now too, I am heading off.

I can relate. Last week my semester ended & the next 3days I was sleeping 11hrs plus 2hrs nap in the afternoon. I didn’t even notice how sleep deprived I was.

Last night I was swimming & being chased by a scary shark the whole time. Vivid swinging back of the pendulum.

Sailing on the ceiling 

 

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Posted (edited)

I drink a cup of coffe a day, in the mornings, but I think even that is having an effect on my sleep and mood. So I am thinking in quitting.

For the next several days I'll watch one video a day of people that documented the process of quitting caffeine. It will be the only way I can keep my mind to stick with that intention daily and not just occasionally. 

When I feel ready I'll go to challenge myself for a week or so without caffeine and see how it goes. I hate the dependency.

  1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLPXdSXitJg&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=1
  2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpDlv8t2_7k&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=2
  3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68rr3WGRAD8&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=4
  4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ghkBCq1GeU&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=5
  5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CfqjYJp9mLw&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=6
  6. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6tDDJAqqRs
  7. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKjAws_old4&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=7
  8. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kXq8na6Q9w&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=14
  9. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrQjg_hNEYA&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=8
  10. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsELsjjoUMI&list=PLD2igJqDnAbZulcNgFqjKViuuQi5lCESD&index=12

I am on day 2. You can do the same thing if you want to quit or reduce your intake, just watch one of those videos a day to motivate you. 

 

Edited by Human Mint

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