You Are Already Awake - This Is Why

[Princess Arabia]

Awareness is Awakeness. Can't get anymore awake than to be aware. All that you're all trying to accomplish is being observed by what is already awake. Which is you and who you truly are. How can who you truly are become more than who you truly are. Yes, there are different degrees of awareness and being awake, but awareness is never not aware and never not awake. The one who is trying to become awake is nothing but a thought and an idea and a concept.

[Sugarcoat]

I read your post. Isn’t it like saying you cannot become a policeman if you’re already not a policeman. Doesn’t make sense. You have the inherent capacity within you to learn to become a policeman as you said, but that’s not the same as already being one. You maybe have the inherent capacity to awaken but it doesn’t mean you’re already awake. I’m just pointing out your logic here. 

Edited November 2 by Sugarcoat

[Hojo]

You can replace this argument with death logically. You cant die you are already dead its something that's programmed into everything Its not something you do you are already equipped to do it and are already dead.

That's being awake. You are dead and alone making shit up in imagination.

Edited November 2 by Hojo

[Princess Arabia]

Just now, Sugarcoat said:

I read your post. Isn’t it like saying you cannot become a policeman if you’re already not a policeman. Doesn’t make sense. You have the inherent capacity within you to learn to become a policeman as you said, but that’s not the same as already being one. You maybe have the inherent capacity to awaken but it doesn’t mean you’re already awake

A policeman is acting out a role. It's an occupation one chooses. It's not an inherent thing. We choose our occupation. We don't choose what we inherently are. A tree cannot become a house because it is inherently a tree. A policeman can become a sailor or a judge. 

[Salvijus]

1 hour ago, Princess Arabia said:

How can who you truly are become more than who you truly are. 

By dropping the false identity that we believe ourselves to be we become more authentic and more true to who we truly are. So you see, there is a process of growth from being identified with what we are not to being more and more truthful. And how truthful one is depends on how self aware they are. And how self aware one is can have many degrees. 

Edited November 2 by Salvijus

[Sugarcoat]

3 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

A policeman is acting out a role. It's an occupation one chooses. It's not an inherent thing. We choose our occupation. We don't choose what we inherently are. A tree cannot become a house because it is inherently a tree. A policeman can become a sailor or a judge. 

We might inherently be non dual in the absolute sense but we perceive ourselves as limited humans so in that sense we aren’t awakened inherently . As we grow up our self concept forms and is the veil

Edited November 2 by Sugarcoat

[Breakingthewall]

What is surprising in that matter is that nobody explain properly what enlightenment is and how to achieve it. They talk in koans and pretend be mysterious and talk a lot about the sacred and holy to feel special. Enlightenment is just a mechanical process, something natural, not religious or anything, it's just the reality. 

[Princess Arabia]

6 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

You maybe have the inherent capacity to awaken but it doesn’t mean you’re already awake

A seed is whatever it is already trying to become. Meaning within that seed, the whole tree is already there. You cannot jump if the jump isn't already inside of you. You are jumping because you have two legs, motion receptors (or whatever you call it), the brain's capabilities and whatever else is required for the configuration for that jump to take place. One is not jumping out of thin air. It's a process that takes place for that jump to take form and all that's required for those processes is already inside of you.

[Princess Arabia]

3 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

What is surprising in that matter is that nobody explain properly what enlightenment is and how to achieve it. They talk in koans and pretend be mysterious and talk a lot about the sacred and holy to feel special. Enlightenment is just a mechanical process, something natural, not religious or anything, it's just the reality. 

Like I said in my post, AND I WILL REPEAT, my post is not about what these things actually are, it is to show you how it is already inherent within you.

[Salvijus]

@Princess Arabia I'm not disagreeing that we are already who we are. I'm disagreeing that we are already self-realized of who we are. Realization of who we are requires deepening of awareness to greater and greater depths. And that's a process. 

[Princess Arabia]

6 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

We might inherently be non dual in the absolute sense but we perceive ourselves as limited humans so in that sense we aren’t awakened inherently . As we grow up our self concept forms and is the veil

All of this doesn't matter. Your perception of yourself is irrelevant to what you actually are in the inherent sense. That only determines how you respond to stimuli and the way you see yourself and the world.

[Sugarcoat]

2 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

A seed is whatever it is already trying to become. Meaning within that seed, the whole tree is already there. You cannot jump if the jump isn't already inside of you. You are jumping because you have two legs, motion receptors (or whatever you call it), the brain's capabilities and whatever else is required for the configuration for that jump to take place. One is not jumping out of thin air. It's a process that takes place for that jump to take form and all that's required for those processes is already inside of you.

The seed is still only the seed, not the tree yet. You have the capacity to jump inside you, but you haven’t jumped yet. You have the capacity to awaken but you haven’t awakened yet, I would say. 

[Breakingthewall]

4 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

We might inherently be non dual in the absolute sense but we perceive ourselves as limited humans so in that sense we aren’t awakened inherently . As we grow up our self concept forms and is the veil

Exactly, and not just because we learn the self concept, its genetical, a chimpanzee has self concept too and perceive itself as limited, or a kid. It's because really they are limited, they are the body, but same time they are the reality where the body happen, but they can't do a step back, you need intention to do it. It usually happens when the limited reality is an alienating shit

[Sugarcoat]

Just now, Princess Arabia said:

All of this doesn't matter. Your perception of yourself is irrelevant to what you actually are in the inherent sense. That only determines how you respond to stimuli and the way you see yourself and the world.

Ofc what you actually are is what you actually are. So in actuality this reality might be non dual. But still there’s a difference between perceiving yourself as limited vs when that limited perception is not there. Aka awakened

[Sugarcoat]

1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

Exactly, and not just because we learn the self concept, its genetical, a chimpanzee has self concept too and perceive itself as limited, or a kid. It's because really they are limited, they are the body, but same time they are the reality where the body happen, but they can't do a step back, you need intention to do it. It usually happens when the limited reality is an alienating shit

Agreed.

[Princess Arabia]

4 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

@Princess Arabia I'm not disagreeing that we are already who we are. I'm disagreeing that we are already self-realized of who we are. Realization of who we are requires deepening of awareness to greater and greater depths. And that's a process. 

Ok. I understand that. I distinctly stressed in my post that it wasn't about the actual words itself and what they represent but how it's impossible to become something that you're not already. That's the whole essence of the post. What you're saying here is on point and I do agree.

Edited November 2 by Princess Arabia

[Princess Arabia]

4 minutes ago, Sugarcoat said:

Ofc what you actually are is what you actually are. So in actuality this reality might be non dual. But still there’s a difference between perceiving yourself as limited vs when that limited perception is not there. Aka awakened

Just to note, I never mentioned anything about non-duality. You keep using that word. This is not about non-duality in my book, even if it actually applies, I'm not trying to come from a place of non-duality, please understand that. It's still intertwined and so is everything else, but I don't want to make that the essence of the post. Neither did I mention the word limited. 

[Breakingthewall]

11 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

Like I said in my post, AND I WILL REPEAT, my post is not about what these things actually are, it is to show you how it is already inherent within you.

Yes, I think everyone agree that, but anyway we talk about aspects of awakening

[Sugarcoat]

1 minute ago, Princess Arabia said:

Just to note, I never mentioned anything about non-duality. You keep using that word. This is not about non-duality in my book, even if it actually applies, I'm not trying to come from a place of non-duality, please understand that. It's still intertwined and so is everything else, but I don't want to make that the essence of the post. Neither did I mention the word limited. 

I thought non duality was related with awakening. And limited related to the non awakened state. But okay I see

[Salvijus]

1 hour ago, Princess Arabia said:

they represent but how it's impossible to become something that you're not already.

True. But it's possible to be completely unaware of our infinite nature and instead be identified with a limited body-mind identity. The shift of perception from a limited identity towards unlimited identity is what is referred as Awakening. We are not already awakened until this shift of perception happens and it happens only by increase of awareness. 

I know I'm repeating myself here but it feels appropriate to say it one more time. 

Edited November 2 by Salvijus