No Self and God

[Javfly33]

1 hour ago, Princess Arabia said:

That's only in appearance. I'm not on the street talking about apple trees and birds and the bar across the street where I'll be saying things in a relativistic manner. I'm on a spiritual forum where the topic is about no-self and God. It's appropriate to suggests the oneness of it all in this context. 

Leo, in this same thread, mentioned how reality is imaginary. Why didn't you say to him then why are you concerned with imaginary politics. You guys only have your rebuttals with the ordinary person. When the gurus say it, it's accepted. Shows the human bias, and how you express your own sovereignty and authorities. You say who says what to you and you listen to who you chose. The signs are everywhere if you know how to spot them.

I usually do not agree with Leo most of the times. However in that case I agree, (reality being imaginary). But i dont see why reality being imaginary has to do with my point @Princess Arabia

 

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

You are the substance, not the conciousness or perception. 

Nice one...and the amazing thing is that the substance is Empty and is Nothing.

In other words, if you could have an experience where perception and thoughts dissappear, would you say a Reality exists? Time wouldnt exist either since without Thoughts you can not experience time. 

 

So what we are is Non- Existence or the absence of a reality. And what we call Reality is actually a limitation of ourselves (the substance).

In my experience:

The Substance = Empty = Death = Unlimitation 

Reality = Life = Limitation.

 

So the ego/limited structure is Scared of Death because the ego is limited and death entails the end of limitation. 

[Princess Arabia]

Just now, Javfly33 said:

I usually do not agree with Leo most of the times. However in that case I agree, (reality being imaginary). But i dont see why reality being imaginary has to do with my point @Princess Arabia

Because that's speaking metaphysically and in the Absolute sense or referring to the true nature of reality. When I do it and refer to things as one or similar, you say we are in the relative and duality and so on and so forth. That's my point. Especially in relation to the threads title. 

[Princess Arabia]

16 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

In other words, if you could have an experience where perception and thoughts dissappear, would you say a Reality exists? Time wouldnt exist either since without Thoughts you can not experience time. 

These types of statements come up when you think you're a human experiencing reality or are separate. This is why I try to keep my true identity running in the background so I don't get too confused as in this statement. You are the thought, you are the perception. Do you think the world will just stop and time and space disappear just because you stopped thinking. Time already doesn't exist. Thought is the time, thought is the space. Thought is you. You are a thought. Talking about ideas.....you are an idea in the mind of consciousness and I'm not referring to the body. When you go to sleep thoughts and time disappear and so do you. 

Edited October 30, 2024 by Princess Arabia

[Breakingthewall]

22 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

In other words, if you could have an experience where perception and thoughts dissappear, would you say a Reality exists? Time wouldnt exist either since without Thoughts you can not experience time. 

Absolute reality is not an experience, is the substance of which experiences are made. you cannot have an experience without perception because experience is perception. Absolute reality is being, the total potential that exists given the absence of limits, it cannot be nothing because it would be limited to nothing, it is everything, which is absolute. It is total potential, that is why it unfolds in infinite facets. Then perception appears, if perception couldn't appear reality would be limited, but as you see perception is, then perception is always the case, like everything else. If something appears once means that appears always, and everything appears because there are not limits. 

You could say that no perception has to be too, but no perception is excluded by perception, same than non existence is excluded by existence, that's why they are absolute, because it's opposite don't exist 

[The Chosen One]

@PurpleTree Yes I have seen many of them

[The Chosen One]

@Leo Gura Thanks for the reply

[gettoefl]

2 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

I usually do not agree with Leo most of the times. However in that case I agree, (reality being imaginary). But i dont see why reality being imaginary has to do with my point @Princess Arabia

 

Nice one...and the amazing thing is that the substance is Empty and is Nothing.

In other words, if you could have an experience where perception and thoughts dissappear, would you say a Reality exists? Time wouldnt exist either since without Thoughts you can not experience time. 

 

So what we are is Non- Existence or the absence of a reality. And what we call Reality is actually a limitation of ourselves (the substance).

In my experience:

The Substance = Empty = Death = Unlimitation 

Reality = Life = Limitation.

 

So the ego/limited structure is Scared of Death because the ego is limited and death entails the end of limitation. 

Note that you are referring to relative reality here

Absolute reality meanwhile is your true self and the source, silence, stillness, substance of reality

Edited October 30, 2024 by gettoefl

[Davino]

6 hours ago, Princess Arabia said:

That's your opinion. If you want to manipulate the truth into how you think it should be expressed, heard or delivered, go right ahead. Truth is truth and it doesn't care about our human interpretations of it and how it wants to express itself and how it's delivered. If it's the truth, then it's the truth. It has no opposites and doesn't need to be babysat and pampered with expressions of endearment. 

It's not my opinion

It's called pedagogy

Have you ever had a teacher in school or university who knew their subject perfectly but couldn’t convey their knowledge effectively?

Yeah, don't become that

You already went so so far as to realize profound Truths

If you talk about Truth, then it is also your responsability to properly communicate it

You could simply take responsibility for conveying the truth, but higher wisdom lies in also being accountable for how that truth is received and interpreted on the other end.

[Davino]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Absolute reality is not an experience, is the substance of which all experiences are made.

I had a beautiful satori when reading that

It caught me off guard, like a Zen master striking me with a stick.

[Princess Arabia]

45 minutes ago, Davino said:

It's not my opinion

It's called pedagogy

Have you ever had a teacher in school or university who knew their subject perfectly but couldn’t convey their knowledge effectively?

Yeah, don't become that

You already went so so far as to realize profound Truths

If you talk about Truth, then it is also your responsability to properly communicate it

You could simply take responsibility for conveying the truth, but higher wisdom lies in also being accountable for how that truth is received and interpreted on the other end.

Ok, thanks. Noted.

[Breakingthewall]

35 minutes ago, Davino said:

I had a beautiful satori when reading that

It caught me off guard, like a Zen master striking me with a stick.

🤣 Maybe was the spirit of waterclosetheriver, he's zen and also German, I'm sure he walks around with a stick

Anyway glad to know 

[Hojo]

Try to think like you are dreaming. When you dream you don't say I am doing this or I am going to do this, you just do. This reality is the exact same thing as a dream but you got attached to it through fear or something you were just dreaming and then got scared and locked yourself into a nightmare. When you go fully awake there is no I so you just wander around life like its a dream and it will be the exact same as a dream because it is. No one else exists you can go full dream mode in this dream and you will be so in the moment you will move your arms around and see the spirit follow the arms. You will be so out of the future and past that you will move your arms and you wont know which way they are going to move cause you aren't planning anything God is doing it and you give up all control. You didnt go to sleep and dream and then now you are awake you just had a dream the dream stopped and then you had another dream and you think you are in reality.

You will start to see in 10k and 10000 fps. I am already seeing glimpses of 10k and 10000 fps in my real life. It happens for like a fraction of a second.

Edited October 30, 2024 by Hojo

[Yimpa]

4 hours ago, Davino said:

It caught me off guard, like a Zen master striking me with a stick.

I prefer stabbing myself with a needle 

[Water by the River]

On 30.10.2024 at 3:22 AM, The Chosen One said:

So my big question is what is the difference between nirvana or "No Self" versus deep sleep because to me they seem like the same exact thing. I don't experience any "I AM" at all in deep sleep.

 

On 30.10.2024 at 3:22 AM, The Chosen One said:

Also If this human self that I identify with is just an illusion and my ego, desires, and basises are all just an illusion, who is the one trying to wake up if it's not even real? It's not anything that I would identify with because that would be my ego so what is it and how would any awaking be possible at all if there really is No Self?

Your questions are Koans. Only Full Enlightenment will answer them.

That will become clear once you wake up. Some pointers:

You are not the "I AM". That perceiver-illusion ("I am") is an illusion arising within the Real You, Infinite Reality itself, before which the states (of waking, dreaming or deep sleep, as human, or as animal with no "I Am", or ET, and ETs  n+1) "roll" before.

That "I am", or the perceiver, or awareness of awareness, is the last illusion before "the" Totality realizes itself. Real You HAS to be constant. Who would witness Real You popping into existence if it was not constant? Right, Real You, Infinite Reality/Consciousness. And same with the (imagined) dis-appearance of you, or "death".

Anything changing is just a modulation of your own Infinite Being, but not YOU. And in Deep Sleep, no I am, no (self-) consciousness (only the potential for sentience if something arises again) is arising. So "I am" is not Real You. Just the first illusion.

 

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=prior+to+consciousness

Really understanding/realizing that is (final) Enlightenment, and a deep deep Identity shift or loss of illusion. Can't get more infinite than infinite. Only be aware of different n+1 arisings.

So what is that Reality that sees, hears and understands? Who or what is reading and understanding these lines right now?

Good news: YOU are always here, never not here, already eternal and immortal. Bad news: Its not "I am". Since YOU are (also) looking through the eyes of an ant, and that ant doesn't have self-consciousness (or any feeling/arising of "I am") , that I am is already too much self-consciousness, and not just awareness (which can also be mere perception perceiving itself, or potentially unaware of nothing arises, but with the potential for sentience). But there is also no Awareness besides perceptions perceiving itself. Making "Awareness" a noun is already a mistake.

And what is trying to wake up, only to realize while doing so that it was always awake/aware/right here right now? What is seeing these lines right now? What is "the" Infinite Totality/Being, perceiving itself, cosplaying to be separate and lost and trying to realize something? What is that Being which has to check every false identity, including the "one" who tries to wake, only then to see it has always been itself, believing its own illusion-arisings, including "I am"?

What is "I am" if there is only INFINITE YOU, and nothing else could ever be? A pointer pointing to an arising (apparently separate) illusion within yourself... But before Infinite Being realizes itself, it has to be fast enough to spot all these illusions arising real-time within itself. Aka as meditation mastery to not get hypnotized by the illusion-arisings.

And much more precise than all this pointing above: What was your face before your parents were born. There is a totally clear answer for that, and its right here. Once that "answer" is always accessible or obvious, life becomes playful. 

 

Koan: Who is (not) Selling Water by the River?

 

PS: How to get "there" in the waking state:

Some quotes:

"Cluster of Sensations taking ownership or thinking being in control of other sensations"

"Awareness of awareness is just more sensations no different from objects of awareness"

"Actually the final path is all about dissolving any sense of “awareness” apart from object or phenomenons"

"SNEAKING UP CLUSTERS OF FEELING OF BEING IN CONTROL-You sneak up on any cluster of sensation that feels like it's in control, of another cluster of sensation, then you sneak up on THAT which is doing the sneaking"

"You keep going meta until the circuit closes on itself and there's no more duality between the subject and object"

"No cluster of sensation “takes credit”, “owns”, “grasp”, “perceives”, “interferes” with any other sensation because any sense of entanglement is still a form of clinging"

"Eliminate the “arrow of attention”, or “Awareness/Consciousness” as a stand alone substrate/Truth because even “Aware of awareness” still presupposes a very subtle sense of self who is trying to pay attention"

"Actually the final path is all about dissolving any sense of “awareness” apart from object or phenomenons" QUICKNESS ATTENTION TO CLOSE LOOP CLUSTERS. Stay ahead of THAT sensation and ad infinite until you close the loop_ for that you got to be QUICK with attention

"Awareness of awareness is just more sensations no different from objects of awareness"

That is how it works in practice on the final stages towards Enlightenment

 

Some quotes:

"my last the last epiphany that I had was there's no one here to be enlightened and then that last speck  of solidity was gone"

" there's no one here do be enlightened the ego never expressed anything it's all just cause and effect of the universe there was no never anybody here since the beginning"

"No more delay, after getting faster and faster, NO MORE DELAY BETWEEN MEDITATOR AND OBJECT, JUST ONE SENSE DOOR OF SENSATIONS PERCEIVING THEMSELVES"

"then you do that faster and faster and more efficiently efficiently until there's gonna be a point where everything just syncs up  into one it's"

 

Edited October 31, 2024 by Water by the River

[Javfly33]

16 hours ago, Princess Arabia said:

These types of statements come up when you think you're a human experiencing reality or are separate. This is why I try to keep my true identity running in the background so I don't get too confused as in this statement. You are the thought, you are the perception. Do you think the world will just stop and time and space disappear just because you stopped thinking. 

When moment of dying comes remember my words. 

Thought create fear and time. There is nothing else. 

 

If at moment of death you are conscious of this and you are able to not generate fear you Will stay in Yourself and attain mukti/Nirvana/nothingness permanently.

If you are not able then you Will reincarnate and Will have to suffer another cycle like most suckers 🤣😅

 

So heres a Gift of me for you 👑Take advantage of it that Im Still embodied and sharing exclusive wisdom. This Will not be forever. I have a departure date so take the train before its gone. 

Because The point of a Guru like me is that you dont have to do any of the soul grueling sadhana he has done. He does It for you. The Only thing you have to do is to tie Yourself to him like there is no other thing worthwhile getting tied to. 

When moment is aproppiate I will cut the cord for you. You dont have to worry about that.

Edited October 31, 2024 by Javfly33

[PurpleTree]

21 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

If you are not able then you Will reincarnate and Will have to suffer another cycle like most suckers 🤣😅

Oh wow how do you know? Your guru told you?

[PurpleTree]

2 hours ago, PurpleTree said:

Oh wow how do you know? Your guru told you?

Sorry if it sounds condescending. 

[Javfly33]

2 hours ago, PurpleTree said:

Oh wow how do you know? Your guru told you?

I dont need a Guru to tell me.

Most of you guys already are convinced and Ok with the fact that after this one another "dream" Will come.

Altough It Will be the same dream. Just with a different body/slightly different karmic structure. 

Edited October 31, 2024 by Javfly33

[PurpleTree]

5 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

I dont need a Guru to tell me.

Most of you guys already are convinced and Ok with the fact that after this one another "dream" Will come.

Altough It Will be the same dream. Just with a different body/slightly different karmic structure. 

How do you know that? 
 

All that "knowledge" seems to be fermented horse dung.

[Javfly33]

24 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

How do you know that? 

24 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

 

Babies being born happen all the time. And they Keep being born in Planet earth (aka, "this dream", not other one).

Edited October 31, 2024 by Javfly33