Imperialism killed over 1.000.000.000 people and US is the Imperial Core.

[Some dude on the net]

@Heaven You also love Ad Hominem. You know nothing about world politics and history. I've never said anything about Russia. Russia is worse than US. Green loves to judge. 

[Ishanga]

38 minutes ago, Heaven said:

Lol🤣 China and Russia are more democratic than the US. If you were there you couldn’t even post something on the open internet.

People here are focused on complaining and shaming instead of improving themselves.

 

I remember a few years ago meeting someone at the airport, he asked what I do, I said I teach Kung Fu, he said he goes to China once a year for mths at a time, luv'd it there, the culture that is, he found the ppl helped one another, young generation helped older generations and medical treatment was high quality and cheap, he hated coming back to Canada and seeing ppl spend money on cars and trucks but live in a dump, and that the whole ideology here sucked..

Now I'm not saying China is great, the government and their political system maybe messed up, and from what I have researched their in for some big trouble in the near future, famines and total societal collapse, but the ppl seem okay, less egoic for sure...Americans are nationalistic, think they are the best in the world at everything, not humble generally, and their system (as I wrote earlier) is failing miserably, Canada is in hot pursuit and on the same path, we are just more Sorry about it, lol...

[zazen]

https://x.com/rnaudbertrand/status/1843548618361582057?s=46&t=DuLUbFRQFGpB8oo7PwRglQ
 

Check the above link to learn about China’s “democracy”. Some of it:

In effect what "whole process" means is that China's democracy isn't about the spectacle of election campaigns and the (often hollow) promises of competing parties, but about fostering a culture of continuous dialogue, consultation, and collaborative problem-solving between the government and the people.

It also means that China's view of democracy is outcome-oriented as opposed to procedural. The idea being that what really matters are the practical results of governance (as per the article: "delivering sustained, stable, and sound national development") as opposed to viewing mere electoral processes as the basis of democratic legitimacy.

Now, what does "people's democracy" mean? Aren't all democracies "people's democracies"?

"People's democracy" is a historical communist term to contrast with what was termed "bourgeois democracy", where the state in capitalist countries was seen as offering only formal political rights while maintaining economic inequality and the dominance of the capitalist class.

Whilst the meaning has evolved somewhat since then, it still retains this idea of prioritizes the welfare and will of the masses over the interests of elites or special interest groups. As the Quishi article states, China's policies must "truly reflect the people's concerns, embody their aspirations, promote their wellbeing, and meet their desire for a better life."

This idea also has roots in traditional Chinese culture, which has always emphasized collective harmony and social cohesion over individualism. In contrast to Margaret Thatcher's famous assertion that "there's no such thing as society" - now widely held in the West - the Chinese worldview sees society not as a mere aggregation of individuals, but as an organic entity with its own existence and importance. This perspective is reflected in the article's emphasis on "fostering social harmony" as a key goal of their democratic system.

Lastly, in a "people's democracy", there's also idea that the people are not just voters, but the driving force behind national development. This perspective is clearly reflected in the article, which emphasizes that "the people are the true driving force behind history." It goes on to state that Chinese modernization "must firmly rely on the people, respect their creativity, and harness their collective wisdom and strength."

This view stands in contrast to liberal democracies where citizens' primary political role is often reduced to choosing between competing parties. In the Chinese system, the CPC's role is also that of an organization that mobilizes and channels the people's energy and is able to effectively harness their collective power for national development.

Last point, which I'm sure many of you will be asking themselves is: "yes that's all good and well, but is it really a democracy if people can't choose their rulers?"

The Chinese view on this would be that it more democratic to have rulers selected based on objective meritocratic criteria, based on how well particular officials have served the people and on exam results, than on opinions shaped by candidates' skills at campaigning or at appealing to narrow interest groups.

Also, as the article emphasizes in China's system accountability is built into ongoing processes and institutions (and not just through elections): "leading Party and state bodies and their personnel are required to exercise their powers in strict accordance with statutory mandates and procedures and wholeheartedly serve the people." Which is hard to argue when you look at the sheer number of officials who get disciplined or even sent to jail every year, even some at the very top. No other country on earth has its officials face such level of scrutiny and accountability. And as we've seen before there's direct public oversight here too as the people are encouraged to report officials if they're corrupt or engage in misconduct.

Lastly, as stated before, the Chinese system provides numerous channels for people to influence policy and governance beyond just choosing leaders. So the concept of "official" is somewhat different from Western notions. In China's whole-process people's democracy, officials are seen more as executors of the people's needs and will, rather than disconnected decision-makers. Their legitimacy stems not from being elected, but from how effectively they implement policies that reflect and serve the people's interests. The idea is to have a system where political legitimacy is continuously earned through tangible achievements rather than periodically granted through ballots.

So there you go, admittedly a very different view of democracy from what we're used to in the West. You're obviously free to think whatever you want about it but I like the "Ideological Turing Test" idea, where you shouldn't be allowed to criticize something if you aren't able to explain it in ways indistinguishable from that of someone who defends the position. As such this gives you a brief overview of how China sees its democracy, from their viewpoint, far from all-too-easy caricatures of it.

And personally that's what fascinates me most about China: how it sees the world in dramatically different ways from the West. Ways that challenge us to question so many things we take for granted, like in this instance the nature of representation or our approach to political legitimacy.

We often pride ourselves in the West on our openness to "diversity" but typically what we mean by that is a mere ersatz of diversity, people who remain well within the Overton window. What we have here with China is TRUE diversity, not just in appearances only, but in core concept of philosophy and societal structures. And instead of fearing it or smearing it as we so often do, we should instead engage with it, try to understand it as it offers an immensely necessary mirror through which we can reflect on ourselves.

Edited Sunday at 08:25 PM by zazen

[Heaven]

1 hour ago, Some dude on the net said:

@Heaven You also love Ad Hominem. You know nothing about world politics and history. I've never said anything about Russia. Russia is worse than US. Green loves to judge. 

Never heard of him. I don’t consider myself just Green. You don’t need to understand politics to know that the US is one of the best places in the world to live. Maybe their foreign policy isn’t perfect but so as 99% of countries 

[Heaven]

44 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

I remember a few years ago meeting someone at the airport, he asked what I do, I said I teach Kung Fu, he said he goes to China once a year for mths at a time, luv'd it there, the culture that is, he found the ppl helped one another, young generation helped older generations and medical treatment was high quality and cheap, he hated coming back to Canada and seeing ppl spend money on cars and trucks but live in a dump, and that the whole ideology here sucked..

Now I'm not saying China is great, the government and their political system maybe messed up, and from what I have researched their in for some big trouble in the near future, famines and total societal collapse, but the ppl seem okay, less egoic for sure...Americans are nationalistic, think they are the best in the world at everything, not humble generally, and their system (as I wrote earlier) is failing miserably, Canada is in hot pursuit and on the same path, we are just more Sorry about it, lol...

Honestly I never could relate with Chinese people from China but maybe it’s because the language barrier. Also very different culture. 
 

[Some dude on the net]

@Heaven =))))))) bro your stink of blue and orange. Ad Hominem is not a person lmao. Some people speak because they have something to say, others because they want to say something. 

Edited Sunday at 09:18 PM by Some dude on the net

[PurpleTree]

12 hours ago, Ishanga said:.

Now I'm not saying China is great, the government and their political system maybe messed up, and from what I have researched their in for some big trouble in the near future, famines and total societal collapse, but the ppl seem okay, less egoic for sure...Americans are nationalistic

Less egoic?

And not so nationalistic?

You guys say the silliest stuff sorry.

[Some dude on the net]

@PurpleTree What people don't understand about Democracy it's that it's not just what's happening in your county. Its what's happening around the world. The Chinese have there own genocide going on in Xinjiang. Although it's no way near the 5 nukes that feel on Gaza. America since 1990 killed over 6 million people world Wide. The majority were civilians. Just in Iraq between 90'-96' they staved to dead 1.600.000 Iraqis. 586.000 were kids! This is the reason Bin Laden did the 9/11, out of pure desperation. Terrorism is just a form of despair against a bigger bully. So America did the equivalent of 300 9/11 în Iraq before the 9/11 happened. And then another 900!!! China didn't do this. Even Russia with the war in Ukraine is not near close. And now the US is doing it again. They want to finish what they started after 9/11. US is by a land slide the biggest terrorist country in the last 35 years. 

[Ishanga]

3 hours ago, PurpleTree said:

Less egoic?

And not so nationalistic?

You guys say the silliest stuff sorry.

Compared to Us here in the west anyways, all of Us have ego, and there's plenty of examples of Huge Ego's from every culture, just relating what the person told me, its was more about helping the family and making sure they were all doing well, rather than buying big trucks and trying to look good to others, which seems to be the theme in the west, but of course ppl here too care about their families, different cultures, different sort of ego's...

[Ishanga]

15 hours ago, Heaven said:

Never heard of him. I don’t consider myself just Green. You don’t need to understand politics to know that the US is one of the best places in the world to live. Maybe their foreign policy isn’t perfect but so as 99% of countries 

I was watching some guy, can't remember his name but he's well known from the 70's to 90's, an economist guy, and he was promoting how capitalism has taken more ppl out of poverty than any other economic system, so anything can be logically justified, but in the end it still doesn't work well for the masses, the rich get richer the poor get poorer!!

[zazen]

2 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

Compared to Us here in the west anyways, all of Us have ego, and there's plenty of examples of Huge Ego's from every culture, just relating what the person told me, its was more about helping the family and making sure they were all doing well, rather than buying big trucks and trying to look good to others, which seems to be the theme in the west, but of course ppl here too care about their families, different cultures, different sort of ego's...

The West is oriented around autonomy (individualistic) whilst the East is oriented around harmony (collectivistic).

@PurpleTree A lot of Chinese who have recently come out of poverty and moved up the economic scale haven’t as yet become accustomed to certain practices and mannerisms. In fact China has programs that teach to help a lot of the country folk with this - at least their investing in their people. Would America invest in programmes to teach Americans public twerking or naked pride parading is bad manners lol

Some prank clips of people taking the whole plate isn’t relevant to your point. 

[PurpleTree]

12 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

Compared to Us here in the west anyways, all of Us have ego, and there's plenty of examples of Huge Ego's from every culture, just relating what the person told me, its was more about helping the family and making sure they were all doing well, rather than buying big trucks and trying to look good to others, which seems to be the theme in the west, but of course ppl here too care about their families, different cultures, different sort of ego's...

Nobody in western Europe acts like that at buffets. We don’t have such nationalistic propaganda movies in western Europe for example. Your basing your whole ideas about that stufg from a guy you met at the Airport. That’s ridiculous. Hello lovely ignore button.

[Alex4]

Before imperialism, there was tribalism, endless wars between tribes. Imperialism by brute force brought peace to many places where there had only been wars. It was an innovation at the time. Certainly, it has no place in today's world, but we need to look at things with perspective and not be carried away by emotions.

[Some dude on the net]

@Ishanga https://youtu.be/XFShD7xGIe0?si=xx-Pa5qjYTdBRfw9 This is why bro. Nixon is the biggest criminal in history. He rewrote history. In 1971 they dropped the gold standard to tie the dollar directly to oil so that they can print money non stop. Nixon literally forced the whole world to trade oil just in dollars. This is why they killed 6.000.000 people after Hussain and why they are doing now genocide. Because dollars = oil. Oil is the most used good in society. This is my America is the number 1 economy. Because they tied the dollar directly to the value of oil. This is also the reason why China will be the first country to have net 0 carbon emissions. Half of the world green energy is installed in China. This is my they have the bullet train sistem. Because they know the faster they can drop oil and be full green US is done. This is why China is above US. China is adapting, US is just doing more of the same. https://youtu.be/MX_PeNzz-Lw?si=Ptav27xRfptnWxAW

Edited Monday at 03:34 PM by Some dude on the net

[Some dude on the net]

@Ishanga @zazen I'm going to say these two videos are a must-watch for anyone on this thread. In the first one, he talks about how people wanted government but couldn't foresee the traps of it. He bases his arguments on the works of philosophers of the time, which a lot of people here dismiss as work not even worth watching, because they deceive themselves with psychedelics and solipsism. The real world exists, it's not a projection of your mind. This is why, in my point of view, psychedelics are a trap (and a tool, of course). It's really nice because you can clearly see the stages in Spiral Dynamics. He doesn't know about Spiral Dynamics, and this is what I want to do in my country start my own series on Spiral Dynamics to teach people about it.

The second video is really heartbreaking. The 1,000,000,000 death toll starts from around the 1400s-1500s until today, again because of my ADHD, I have a "spidey sense" for sensing energy and people, even over text. Leo places anyone who criticizes imperialism in the green stage, which is a mistake, imperialism literally killed the most people in history. I guess he has a bias about it. I've sensed his nationalism over the thread on UFO. "Why would UFO come to Germany". The subtext of this line implies "America is the shit, Germany sucks, UFO will never come to Germany". UFO are as real as Santa Claus. They are real in America because they been used as propaganda to scare people for the last 80 years coming close to area 51 which in fact was close to project Manhattan. UFO's are just a subset of the culture of America."I belive in UFO's but I'm Turquoise". Anyone who claim is turquoise but belives in UFO is fooling himself. This is why you need to be careful with psychedelics, too much of anything is bad. And I'm trying to not to break the rule. "Never outshine the master". This is exactly why everyone from outside thinks actualized.org is a cult. Cause nobody has the balls to stand to Leo's frame. Because impenetrable frame comes at yellow. Leo content, book list and life purpose courses are responsible for 90% of my development, I love him more than my dad he's awesome. For real man I love you, you saved my ass(after 8 years I've found my problems we're not psychological they were physical).But we needs healthy disagreement in order to grow. I'm not smart, I'm not above anybody. I'm not jack shit. I'm actually almost homeless with 2 chronic illnesses, but the pain I've been though made me realize a lot of things. I feel like I can die anytime and I'll be alright. I'm searching to understand the world around me better, it feels more urgent to me than to trascending the self.

 

You have subtitles, it's really top tier info. 

 

 

Edited Monday at 10:42 PM by Some dude on the net

[What Am I]

@Some dude on the net we went over the solipsism thing in that other thread. I keep telling you, you're erroneously tying the concept of consciousness ultimately being singular to psychedelics. I can appreciate you not liking drug use, but you're making a huge error in minimizing your own understanding of the experiential philosophies at play here.

Also, if you've never personally entered a genuine mystical state of consciousness, I'd bet anything you're misunderstanding what's meant by "solipsism" in esoterica. It's not the mundane definition that I assume you're using. I'm talking about a transrational direct experience, where understanding is immediate and fully intuitive. That may sound odd to the unitiated, but it really does exist as a literal human potential.

By the way, I acknowledge some of your criticisms of those on the forum. There's a reason Leo removed his video diving deep on solipsism. If the reality of it isn't directly tasted, conversations can spin into useless pontification.

 

[Some dude on the net]

@zazen

"The poor country's don't need charity, the poor country's need Justice."  US is doing now what they din in Nicaragua. The United States of Israel (Biden literally said that Israel it's more important "for the security of America" than Nato, Israel is a US state in the Middle East.) They are trying to overthrow the weak government of Lebanon, Palestine :(, Syria and Iraq. You can find a lot of info about the +50 couple's the CIA did since it's creation in 1947 in the book "The CIA Manual of Trickery and Deception" To understand who US is behind the scenes look no further that the into of the book. "With its establishment in July 1947, the CIA received two primary missions-prevent surprise foreign attacks against the United States and counter the advance of Soviet communism into Europe and third-world nations. 

The Soviet Union's successful testing of a nuclear weapon in 1949 caught the United States by surprise and created two nuclear powers competing in an internationala atmosphere of fear and uncertainty. President Eisenhower received a startling top secret report in 1954 from a commission headed by retired general James H. Doolittle that concluded,"If the US is to survive, long-standing American concepts of "fair play must be reconsidered. We must learn to subvert, sabotage, and destrov our enemies by cleverer,more sophisticated, and more effective methods than those used against us. (like exploding pagers). It may become necessary that the American people become acquainted with, understand, and support this fundamentally repugnant philosophy."

The report affirmed a threat to the Western democracies from Soviet-sponsored aggression and called for an American offensive and defensive intelligence posture unlike anything previously authorized in peacetime. As a result, the CIA's covert-action role expanded from Europe into the Middle East, Africa, Latin America, and the Far East."

This is US behind the scenes 80 years later. The CIA is just a terrorist organization that can break any law anyware without any consequences. FBI is only good secret service in America. 

[Some dude on the net]

@What Am I Anyone can belive whatever they want bro. I don't tie them just to psychedelics, but from my own experience the more trips the more inclined you are to Solipsism. No judging here. Every perspective is that, another perspective. I like psychedelics,but I do them rare and with caution. Anyone can do whatever he or she wants with there mind and body. 

Edited Monday at 05:41 PM by Some dude on the net

[What Am I]

10 minutes ago, Some dude on the net said:

@What Am I Anyone can belive whatever they want bro. I don't tie them just to psychedelics, but from my own experience the more trips the more inclined you are to Solipsism. No judging here. Every perspective is that, another perspective. I like psychedelics,but I do them rare and with caution. Anyone can do whatever he or she wants with there mind and body. 

You just did it again lol. Now I'm not sure if you're simply trolling me for fun.

But fair enough though, I'll leave it alone.

Edited Monday at 05:50 PM by What Am I

[Some dude on the net]

@What Am I I'm not trolling bro. I've been depersonalized 6 years ago from a car accident. I've seen what that feels like, also I did a lot of shamanic breathing. I know people who are Solipsist who never touched psychedelics. I've said just that people who use psychedelics more are inclined to Solipsism. Much love.