Leo Gura

Playlist For Understanding Israel Deception

1,037 posts in this topic

On 15/12/2024 at 11:02 PM, Raze said:

Still she has a massive fan base of conservatives, any criticism at all of Israel was unheard of on right wing outlets, now this video has 4 million views on YouTube and even more on other platforms. It is an example of a major shift in public opinion caused by unrestrained media. 

Yeah, I think it’s fine to share interesting and valid messages despite the messenger not being up to par. Dan Bilzerian going at it is also signals a major shift.

This situation of a political apparatus being held hostage by a foreign nation has been known but suppressed since a while:

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https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP88T00988R000100090004-9.pdf


This doesn’t mean Israel can be entirely blamed for US foreign policy as US have their own interests also. It’s a symbiotic relationship - with plenty of deception involved - but it seems theres more deception from Israel than the other way round.

Edited by zazen

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@zazen this part is crazy. They knew the fall of Saddam would bring a Shia Iran-aligned Iraq and that it would be part of a new “contagion” that they can leverage to make the Arab nations become friendlier with Israel in the face of this new Shia influence in the region. 
 

It’s crazy because they gaslit the public that the fall of Saddam would bring democracy and freedom, whereas they knew it would bring a religious “radical” and “disruptive” force. It’s also crazy because Netanyahu said fall of Saddam would bring positive change that would reverberate throughout the region whereas they knew it would create more problems, especially in terms of Iran and the Levant. And they wanted to capitalize on that—what they describe as a new contagion. 

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Edited by gambler

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https://archive.ph/O8rGB
 

Quote

We identified five groups of soldiers based on personality traits. 1. A small Callous group was composed of ruthless soldiers, some of whom confessed to violence before the draft. These soldiers committed most of the severe atrocities. The power they received in the army was intoxicating: "It's like a drug ... you feel like you are the law, you make the rules. As if from the moment you leave the place called Israel and enter the Gaza Strip, you are God." They viewed brutality as an expression of strength and masculinity.

"I have no problem with women. One threw a slipper at me, so I gave her a kick here (pointing to the groin), broke all this here. She can't have children today."

"X shot an Arab four times in the back and got away with a self-defense claim. Four bullets in the back from a distance of ten meters ... cold-blooded murder. We did things like that every day."

"An Arab just walked down the street, about 25 years old, didn't throw a stone, nothing. Bang, a bullet in the stomach. Shot him in the stomach, and he was dying on the sidewalk, and we drove away indifferently."

These soldiers were remorseless and did not report moral injury. Some of them were convicted by military courts. They felt bitter and betrayed.

2. A small, ideologically violent group supported the brutality without taking part. They believed in Jewish supremacy and were derogatory toward Arabs. Moral injuries were not reported in this group.

3. A small incorruptible group opposed the influence of the callous and ideological groups on the company's culture. Initially intimidated by brutal commanders, they later took a moral stand and went on to report the atrocities to the division commander. Following discharge, most of them viewed their service as meaningful and strengthening. However, one whistle blower was severely harassed and ostracized, and it was necessary to move him to another unit. He was traumatized, depressed and left the country following discharge.

4. A large group of followers consisted of soldiers with no prior inclination to violence. Their behavior was most influenced by junior officers' modeling and the company's norms. Some followers who committed atrocities reported moral injuries: "I felt like, like, like a Nazi ... it looked exactly like we were actually the Nazis and they were the Jews."

5. The restrained was a large group of inner-directed soldiers who maintained military standards and did not commit atrocities. They responded to Palestinian violence and life-threatening situations in balanced and legally justified ways. They did not report moral injuries.

In each of the companies, an internal culture developed that was largely shaped by junior commanders and charismatic soldiers. Initially, the norms instigated atrocities.

"A new commander came to us. We went out with him on the first patrol at six in the morning. He stops. There's not a soul in the streets, just a little 4-year-old boy playing in the sand in his yard. The commander suddenly starts running, grabs the boy, and breaks his arm at the elbow and his leg here. Stepped on his stomach three times and left. We all stood there with our mouths open. Looking at him in shock ... I asked the commander: "What's your story?" He told me: These kids need to be killed from the day they are born. When a commander does that, it becomes legit."

 

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Im new to this thread. It's at 37 pages. Does anyone have a playlist already made of all these? Can you please link it to me?

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On 10/10/2024 at 10:25 PM, Leo Gura said:

Why was it wrong if Israelis don't agree that kicking out Palestinians was wrong?

The Israeli War of Independence, what the Arabs call the Nakhba, escalated when the Jewish state was invaded by seven Arab armies in the aftermath of the Arab League Secretary General, Abdul Rahman Hassan Azzam, declaring in 1947 that, were a war to take place with the proposed establishment of a Jewish state, it would lead to "a war of extermination and momentous massacre which will be spoken of like the Mongolian massacre and the Crusades."

To ascribe cause and effect to this conflict literally requires going back over 1,000 years to see where many seeds of the conflict have been planted.  The real obstacles to peace are much less Zionist vs. Palestinian but religious fundamentalism and extremism versus everybody else.

The first fatality of the Arab-Jewish conflict dates back to 1920 in the Battle of Tel Hai and was literally a mistake that has continued to escalate for the last 100 years.

From a secular perspective, to understand the current conflict, you have to look at the aftermath of WW1 where Western colonial powers had carved up the remains of the Ottoman Turk Empire and decided to take it for themselves.  Nation states had not organically emerged in the Middle East by that point in time and their imposition post WW2 remains very unnatural and chaotic.  People are quick to criticize Israel yet have completely ignored the atrocities committed by the Assad regime in Syria, which has just recently come to an end.  The book A Peace to End all Peace describes some of the root causes of the current conflict pretty well, but the real roots are still much deeper than that.

I'm not assigning credit or blame here, it is way too complicated to do that, but I am saying that simply digging up today's counter narratives are way too simplistic and superficial to understand what's going on there today.  This is the latest volcanic flare up in a region that has been a powder keg for over 100 years and I'm not a war ethicist to say where the lines should be drawn.  There is no functional international government to sort this out and enforce international law and order.  With the decline of the US as a world power, heading into an era of multipolarity, the need to involve China in a resolution is increasingly necessary.

This is something that I think about a lot, how to adequately resolve this, but I have yet to find anybody with much depth or insight on the conflict.

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On 10/11/2024 at 8:16 AM, Leo Gura said:

Here's a little-cited fact:

1 in 10 Israelis are settlers, living on internationally recognized Palestinian land. And this number grows each year. These settlers include high ranking government officials and judges.

It's just outrageous. Of course Palestinians want to kill them. It's so obvious when you look at the basic facts. No other nation would allow another nation to colonize its land year after year after year for 75 years.

When you finally cut through all the propaganda and bias, the truth is so clear it's disgusting.

The conflict precedes Israeli settlement in the West Bank by over 50 years.  While the settlements are easily a source of friction, they are very very very far from the root cause.  A simple Israeli withdrawal from the West Bank would accomplish very little and may even make matters worse.  Look to the 2005 unilateral disengagement from Gaza to gain more perspective.

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