Leo's Blog Discussion Mega-Thread

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Jayson G said:

what does that mean exactly though?

We can't know exactly. But if Trump wins there will be basically zero checks on him. It is a hostile takeover of government and at that point the only question is how dictatorial will he be in the mood to be.

At this point he could cancel an election and no one would be able to stop him. He can imprison any of his opponents. That is where we are headed. This is no joke. If Trump gets in office all checks are gone. His admin will destroy normal government for decades. It will be like the Iraq war but to the US government.

Edited October 30 by Leo Gura

[Yimpa]

https://www.actualized.org/insights/profound-proverbs-006

 

[Ayham]

I just read the blog post about the Athenians thing and how it relates to Palestine and Israel, and.... it is BASED.

Okay maybe I shouldn't use gen Z terms, but yeah it is high quality, I love when Leo gets into more factual topics (history for example, or any sort of "hard" field), and less abstract stuff, not because I don't like the abstract stuff, but because they are sort of repetitive at this point.

[Nemra]

@Leo Gura, what do you think Putin's relations with or influence on the U.S. government will be if Trump wins, considering that Putin can easily manipulate Trump?

Edited October 30 by Nemra

[Raze]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

As far as systemic changes to government, I would propose a serious focus on anti-corruption measures. Hundreds of small changes that make corruption by either party unsustainable. But of course, this is precisely what will be rejected by everyone.

Any policy proposal that seriously cures corruption must be rejected by a corrupt society. So here we are.

At this point I will be happy if America still has a democracy in 4 years. I doubt it.

Just ban big money in politics through a constitutional amendment , that alone removes 90 percent of the corruption. Most Americans also support it so it is feasible. 

Edited October 30 by Raze

[Scholar]

2 minutes ago, Raze said:

Just ban big money in politics through a constitutional amendment , that alone removes 90 percent of the corruption. Most Americans also support it so it is feasible. 

That won't do anything.

The problem today is that those with influence and money can shape the opinions and values of the population.

 

You don't have to corrupt politicians so that they don't act against climate change. All you have to do is convince the masses that acting against climate change is an excuse to steal away their freedom. In that case, the people will vote for the politicians who will do the bidding of the corporations, because the population has been embued with values in line with the corporations goals.

This has been how corporations have influenced politics for decades now, lobbyism is pretty meaningless in comparison.

[Raze]

2 minutes ago, Scholar said:

That won't do anything.

The problem today is that those with influence and money can shape the opinions and values of the population.

 

You don't have to corrupt politicians so that they don't act against climate change. All you have to do is convince the masses that acting against climate change is an excuse to steal away their freedom. In that case, the people will vote for the politicians who will do the bidding of the corporations, because the population has been embued with values in line with the corporations goals.

This has been how corporations have influenced politics for decades now, lobbyism is pretty meaningless in comparison.

except they are spending more than ever in lobbying and election donations, if it is meaningless they wouldn’t, no one likes burning money 

there are countless examples of issues where the government doesn’t act because of moneyed interests where the political opinions of the majority of Americans is different. The majority of Americans believe climate change is a threat and support efforts to reduce it, for example.

Edited October 30 by Raze

[Scholar]

4 minutes ago, Raze said:

except they are spending more than ever in lobbying and election donations, if it is meaningless they wouldn’t, no one likes burning money 

there are countless examples of issues where the government doesn’t act because of moneyed interests where the political opinions of the majority of Americans is different. The majority of Americans believe climate change is a threat and support efforts to reduce it, for example.

Show me the evidence of lobbying spenditure in relation to policy outcomes and compare that to voters desires.

 

[Raze]

7 minutes ago, Scholar said:

Show me the evidence of lobbying spenditure in relation to policy outcomes and compare that to voters desires.

 

 

[Scholar]

2 minutes ago, Raze said:

 

I want to see actual data in the form of studies, or an article.

[UnbornTao]

On 10/30/2024 at 9:14 AM, Davino said:

While we often discuss how individuals overcome personal illusions, what would this process look like at a societal scale?

Do they overcome them and to what degree? How many go out of their way to achieve that? In the end it is the individual who must to do it for himself. And I have no idea what it would look like collectively, likely similar to what Leo alluded to: everyone kicking and screaming, not wanting to give up their cherished fantasies. We in fact tend to defend and promote them instead.

Edited November 1 by UnbornTao

[Husseinisdoingfine]

Me to Chat GPT:

Take this quote, and translate it into a more modern English so I can understand it: 

 

“For ourselves, we shall not trouble you with specious pretenses — either of how we have a right to our empire because we overthrew the Persians, or are now attacking you because of wrong that you have done us — and make a long speech which would not be believed; and in return we hope that you, instead of thinking to influence us by saying that you did not join the Lakedaemonians, although their colonists, or that you have done us no wrong, will aim at what is feasible, holding in view the real sentiments of us both; since you know as well as we do that right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they can and the weak suffer what they must.”
 

ChatGPT response:

Here’s a modernized version of the quote:

 

“We’re not going to waste your time with fake excuses about how we deserve our empire because we defeated the Persians, or say that we’re attacking you because you wronged us. We won’t make a long speech you wouldn’t believe anyway. In return, we hope you won’t try to sway us by claiming you didn’t side with the Spartans, even though you’re connected to them, or that you’ve done us no harm. Instead, let’s be realistic and face the actual situation. You and we both know that fairness only exists between equals; in reality, the powerful do what they want, and the weak have to accept it.”

 

This retains the core message about power dynamics and the futility of debating moral rights when there’s a clear imbalance of power.

 

[Mada_]

@Leo Gura

Ignore my PM if you see this. 

I want to understand how you demonise chasing money and sex as it will corrupt the mind, but these are human needs and you have already benefited from them. 

 

And also what are the alternatives? 

[Leo Gura]

4 hours ago, Mada_ said:

@Leo Gura

Ignore my PM if you see this. 

I want to understand how you demonise chasing money and sex as it will corrupt the mind, but these are human needs and you have already benefited from them. 

And also what are the alternatives? 

It's not that I demonize them. It's that they lead to corruption.

I have been corrupted by them in the past to some extent. And now I am very aware of that corrupting effect. But I was wise enough to avoid most of the corruption. Most people will fall right into it.

There are many different ways to get money and sex. They are not all equally corrupt. Of course I'm not saying you shouldn't make money or have sex. I'm saying, understand how these things lead to corruption and be careful that you don't lose yourself to them.

Saying that pickup is corrupt doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't date or flirt with women or learn to socialize. My point was that the pickup community as whole is corrupt. In the same way that Wall Street or the mafia as a whole is corrupt. These are corrupt industries.

Not all ways of doing business are corrupt. Not all ways of dating are corrupt.

If you are just starting off, you may not care about corruption because you just want results. But at my advanced stage I care about corruption as an epistemic and spiritual matter. So I point it out as a favor to mankind, for those who care about such things.

At some point, if you care about deeply understanding all these fieldd and social systems, you have to confront the issue of corruption within them. Otherwise you cannot understand them. Corruption is such a huge lens for understanding what's really going on with mankind.

Edited October 31 by Leo Gura

[Leo Gura]

9 hours ago, Ayham said:

I just read the blog post about the Athenians thing and how it relates to Palestine and Israel, and.... it is BASED.

Okay maybe I shouldn't use gen Z terms, but yeah it is high quality, I love when Leo gets into more factual topics (history for example, or any sort of "hard" field), and less abstract stuff, not because I don't like the abstract stuff, but because they are sort of repetitive at this point.

Glad you liked it.

[Jayson G]

@Leo Gura Regarding Theft .. 

I have actually been thinking about theft, since you made some forum comments a few weeks ago. 

I'm starting to think that it's not just the AI companies stealing data. If one even generates an AI image with MidJourney or Dall-e and uses that for some purpose of any kind, that is a form of theft. My thinking is that it took stolen data to create that image. It's like that image was made with that data in a sense. 

Along those lines, it is possible that ordinary human creativity, which is most of the creativity within most of the products and services we see is a form of theft. James Cameron said Titanic was Romeo and Juliet on a boat. Aside from the obvious Titanic copy, he copied ideas from Romeo and Juliet. Now of course this form of theft is not bad in my opinion. I actually think this is a good form of theft. But it is theft. But then the question is, how does one even define theft. If theft is stealing what shouldn't be stolen, then that's a narrow form of theft. If theft is defined as taking an element outside of yourself that is not yours, that can be theft. 

But also interestingly, at one point you mentioned that nothing is yours. Everything is god's. We take credit for a product we built, even if it is completely original, when really it is god doing it. Maybe everything in our life is theft considering we like to say to a lot of things that "This is mine." "This is my mother." "This is my desk." I don't know about that last part lol I might be getting too ahead of myself. 

By the way, are all recurring subscriptions theft? If I decide to offer an app with a 10 dollar per month recurring subscription, but that app provides tremendous value to society, and I need to set that recurring subscription for continuous cash flow for the sustainability of the app's long-term development, I don't think that would be theft, would it? 

[The Renaissance Man]

Is the main symptom of corruption the self-justification of despicable behavior?

And are corrupt industries (like Leo mentioned, pickup, or wall street) identifiable as culture that makes it even easier or even encourage self-justification of despicable behavior?

Is this a decent definition? I'm trying to corner this concept of corruption and how it looks like in practice.

 

Edited October 31 by The Renaissance Man

[The Renaissance Man]

@Jayson G Yes I agree that some examples would really help here, and with corruption as well. It's quite abstract and subject to one's interpretation of the words "theft" and "corruption", which I'm sure have a lot more depth in Leo's mind after reading all those books.

[Nemra]

The documentaries on certain YouTube channels, like "Best Documentary", that we have been watching are stolen, yet we continue to watch them because they are giving us those videos for free and in one place.

Edited October 31 by Nemra

[Jayson G]

4 minutes ago, The Renaissance Man said:

@Jayson G Yes I agree that some examples would really help here, and with corruption as well. It's quite abstract and subject to one's interpretation of the words "theft" and "corruption", which I'm sure have a lot more depth in Leo's mind after reading all those books.

@The Renaissance Man I'm actually referring to his latest blog post lol he gave a ton of examples there. But I felt that those examples are the pretty obvious ones. He referred to more subtle forms of theft, but I think Leo could have expanded on the more subtle forms of theft. 

I have also been very interested in examples for corruption lately as well. Past some days I have really been observing corruption and contemplation in my own life and realized just how important this topic is. 

Edited October 31 by Jayson G