Leo's Blog Discussion Mega-Thread

[aurum]

5 hours ago, Davino said:

I agree but it's hard to say. There's no easy way to measure consciousness and different individuals value diverse states of consciousness so, hard to make a global spirituality index. Although it's certainly an interesting challenge to ponder.

It's a multi-generational project. We just need to improve it over time.

A real simple way to start would be international surveys on non-dual experiences. What percentage of people report having an awakening? This could be done today with enough will to do it.

Edited October 19 by aurum

[What Am I]

1 hour ago, aurum said:

Its a multi-generational project. We just need to improve it over time.

A real simple way to start would be international surveys on non-dual experiences. What percentage of people report having an awakening? This could be done today with enough will to do it.

Pretty cool idea for something worthwhile to track, but a survey seems like it'd be prone to quite a bit of exaggeration on the respondent's part. Someone can easily say "I once felt like I was one with everything." But as you should hopefully know, that's likely very different from the real thing. Also, I wouldn't be surprised to find out over 99% of humans on the planet are entirely unaware of awakening as a potential.

Still though, I'd be interested to know how many have genuinely done it and where they're located. Perhaps using something more objective, like an EEG looking at atypical brainwave signatures identified via meditation masters in various studies. Obviously that wouldn't scale well to a worldwide effort, but it seems far more foolproof than simply asking someone and then taking their word for it.

Edited October 19 by What Am I

[aurum]

1 hour ago, What Am I said:

Pretty cool idea for something worthwhile to track, but a survey seems like it'd be prone to quite a bit of exaggeration on the respondent's part. Someone can easily say "I once felt like I was one with everything." But as you should hopefully know, that's likely very different from the real thing. Also, I wouldn't be surprised to find out over 99% of humans on the planet are entirely unaware of awakening as a potential.

Still though, I'd be interested to know how many have genuinely done it and where they're located. Perhaps using something more objective, like an EEG looking at atypical brainwave signatures identified via meditation masters in various studies. Obviously that wouldn't scale well to a worldwide effort, but it seems far more foolproof than simply asking someone and then taking their word for it.

We are not getting an EEG of everyone's head.

Surveys are a great place in science to start research. They are budget friendly, convenient and easily translate to practical data. Very pragmatic.

The fact that surveys also have a lot of flaws doesn't really matter in this case. The point is not to do perfect science, the point is to get momentum and build the science over time. Let future researchers improve things and do better.

Edited October 20 by aurum

[What Am I]

1 minute ago, aurum said:

We are not getting an EEG of everyone's head.

Surveys are a great place in science to start research. They are budget friendly, convinent and easily translate to practical data. Very pragmatic.

The fact that surveys also have a lot of flaws doesn't really matter in this case. The point is not to do perfect science, the point is to get momentum and build the science over time. Let future researchers improve things and do better.

I generally agree with much of what you're saying, but are you going to address the fact that nobody knows what awakening is? Although coincidentally, I guess the propagation of billions of surveys would itself spread knowledge of the topic.

[aurum]

33 minutes ago, What Am I said:

I generally agree with much of what you're saying, but are you going to address the fact that nobody knows what awakening is?

1) I'd say enough people do to make it worthwhile. You could work the language and phrasing to make it more accessible.

2) If people don't know, that's also data that we want. The point is to get the data about where we are at, not to get a specific result.

3) You wouldn't be propagating billions of surveys. Surveys work by selecting a smaller population and then extrapolating from there. Surveying an entire population is basically never done.

[What Am I]

9 minutes ago, aurum said:

1) I'd say enough people do to make it worthwhile. You could work the language and phrasing to make it more accessible.

2) If people don't know, that's also data that we want. The point is to get the data about where we are at, not to get a specific result.

3) You wouldn't be propagating billions of surveys. Surveys work by selecting a smaller population and then extrapolating from there. Surveying an entire population is basically never done.

Ah gotcha. I disagree with number 1 as being effective, because real awakening is a very specific experiential thing that resists being accurately described by virtue of it transcending language. But you make an excellent point with number 2, and number 3 clearly shows you're more familiar with the process of surveying than I am. I don't know what made me think we'd need to ask each individual on earth. Pretty silly in retrospect.

Anyways, it is a cool idea. Hopefully one day it's a data point we'll be able to collect.

Edited October 20 by What Am I

[Puer Aeternus]

Since I know Leo has mentioned it a few times before including the blog the other day, how can one get unstuck from/avoid being "blackpilled" on reality and humans?  

This is something I've definitely gotten pretty deeply sucked into before and am slowly emerging from now, but pointers would definitely be useful!

 

[Yimpa]

@Puer Aeternus deconstruct yourself

[Bobby_2021]

Started a thread on this blog: https://www.actualized.org/insights/north-vs-south-korea 

The comparison is thrown out of context most of the times. Let me know what you think!

[Thought Art]

5 hours ago, Puer Aeternus said:

Since I know Leo has mentioned it a few times before including the blog the other day, how can one get unstuck from/avoid being "blackpilled" on reality and humans?  

This is something I've definitely gotten pretty deeply sucked into before and am slowly emerging from now, but pointers would definitely be useful!

 

The trick is to feel what emotions come up when you see the harsh darkness of reality. But, take time away from that stuff to heal and integrate and see all the beauty and goodness that is around you as well. It’s important to work on your positive psychology, and really, your own life and sphere of influence without getting bogged down by things outside your experience and control.

[Davino]

@Leo Gura The Oman documentary was super nice to watch. Really enjoying the videos you're sharing lately.

The blog has been changing substantially the way I make sense of the world. I've already said but I wanna say it again, I appreciate your work and it helps me a lot to evolve my mind.

[Nemra]

@Leo Gura, corruption being, as you say, super-truth and in infinite forms, why do we try to get rid of or avoid it?

[Davino]

@Nemra Because it is the nature of the finite to tend to the Infinite

[Leo Gura]

6 hours ago, Nemra said:

@Leo Gura, corruption being, as you say, super-truth and in infinite forms, why do we try to get rid of or avoid it?

Do we?

[Moutushi]

8 hours ago, Nemra said:

@Leo Gura, corruption being, as you say, super-truth and in infinite forms, why do we try to get rid of or avoid it?

The funny thing about corrupt people (which we all are to some overt or subtle degree) getting rid of corruption, is like a rabbit trying to dig itself out of the hole that it's actively digging itself into

[Moutushi]

Just now, Moutushi said:

The funny thing about corrupt people (which we all are to some overt or subtle degree) getting rid of corruption, is like a rabbit trying to dig itself out of the hole that it's actively digging itself into

Of course, I'm still a strong advocate of minimizing corruption as much humanly possible, while still not denying how serious and deep that issue goes

[Nemra]

18 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Do we?

Well, some people try to do it.

To be honest, I'm not sure how many people are actually against corruption, even if they say they are. They're probably against others who try to worsen their survival, or they think so.

[Nemra]

I noticed that there is the desire in people not to be corrupted, which, I think, makes them prone to corruption.

[Davino]

Survival demands corruption 

[Davino]

I loved the Thuggee blog post. It's the typical thing I would be researching. I wonder if an actualized.org dinner would look like the Indiana Jones scene

Regarding your post on Ketchup as vegetable. I find very telling the following story a professor told me

Quote

When Mickey Mouse was about to enter public domain in 1998, Disney successfully lobbied Congress to change copyright law, extending their ownership for another 20 years. The result was the "Mickey Mouse Protection Act" (officially the Copyright Term Extension Act), which increased copyright terms from 75 to 95 years for corporate works.

What makes this a perfect example of subtle corruption:

1. The law was literally nicknamed after the corporation it benefited most
2. Both Democrats and Republicans supported it - with Clinton (Democrat) signing it into law despite it being co-sponsored by Bono (Republican)
3. Disney's strategic lobbying and campaign contributions to lawmakers on both sides ensured its passage
4. The law affected all copyrights but was clearly timed to save Mickey Mouse specifically

Fast forward to 2024: While the original Steamboat Willie Mickey Mouse has finally entered public domain, Disney's influence on copyright law reshaped intellectual property rights in America for decades. This case shows how corporate interests can transcend partisan politics, using money and influence to change laws that affect everyone, all to protect their profits.

The most telling detail? They managed to do this completely legally, through official channels, with bipartisan support - that's what makes it such a perfect example of systemic corporate influence in American politics.