Pro-Palestine Bias?

[Scholar]

Would be interesting to see Leo discuss IP conflict from a moral perspective with Destiny, because I honestly can't see where they would disagree and how the arguments would play out.

But at the same time it would be wasted time to have them discuss politics like that.

[Nivsch]

9 hours ago, zazen said:

So occupation is now called restriction?

Yes, violence from both sides is fuelling a cycle of retaliation that you call the chicken and the egg problem. But it misses the wider point if you zoom out enough to see the occupation of a people by another as the fundamental driver of the violence.

This is more like a wolf sheep problem where the wolf (Israel) is a wolf dressed up in sheep’s clothing to look innocent. Since when did defense mean going towards the aggressor? If someone throws a punch at you, you raise your arms in defense - you don’t move deeper towards the aggressor. Israel just uses this ‘defense’ label to justify taking more control and land.

But if you zoom out even more you see how Israel is forced to be in a constant survival mode due to the environment it found in, when the aggression towards the Palestinians is a fear response. Not a smart one, definitely has to be transcended, but a FEAR driven behaviour!

Edited September 26 by Nivsch

[Revolutionary Think]

On 9/25/2024 at 11:20 AM, Leo Gura said:

Why do you say that when I am happy to explore all points of view on this issue?

I spend a lot of time studying Islamists and terrorism.

You're free to do what you want  Just keep making quality content and don't underestimate the knowledge and wit of the people who are your audience. In fact in the last video I was very happy to hear you admit that underestimating us and not having respect for us is something you regret. It shows that we're all growing. Keep doing what you're doing. 

 

[Scholar]

5 minutes ago, Revolutionary Think said:

You're free to do what you want  Just keep making quality content and don't underestimate the knowledge and wit of the people who are your audience. In fact in the last video I was very happy to hear you admit that underestimating us and not having respect for us is something you regret. It shows that we're all growing. Keep doing what you're doing. 

 

When did he say that?

 

[Revolutionary Think]

@Scholar

At 2:56:56 on this video he says he wishes he could go back and take out all the immaturity and other such things from his work. When I first stumbled upon him because mainstream society, the schooling system, and my family were pissing me off and getting on my nerves I was actually looking for a person who was more like me and noticed these things as well. Then I found him and enjoyed what he had to offer but, every time he'd use insults and profanity I was saying to myself that something wasn't right and it turned me off. 

Fast forward to Today I think in the past if he was challenged or disagreed with before he would double down and start attacking people for being foolish, not enlightened etc. Now though I can see the difference he was open to another point of view and didn't get mad and use insults. All other poeple I've seen with big positions of power and large followings always get defensive, angry, double down etc. for him to admit it's wrong and work on it to me shows true character. Cult leaders and corrupt people in general always attack and double down. People who actually care about others and try to do good take time to self reflect. 

 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Revolutionary Think said:

You're free to do what you want  Just keep making quality content and don't underestimate the knowledge and wit of the people who are your audience. In fact in the last video I was very happy to hear you admit that underestimating us and not having respect for us is something you regret. It shows that we're all growing. Keep doing what you're doing. 

 

Cheers!

[How to be wise]

@Revolutionary Think If someone steals your land, it’s natural to hate them. 

[DocWatts]

I'll own that I have a very strong anti-genocide bias.

While the Israeli government is of course responsible for the horrific situation in its occupied territories, that doesn't mean that there aren't also bad actors in Palestine who are making the situation worse. Barbaric survival conditions born of brutalization tend to empower bad actors like Hamas, of which the Israeli state is also correctly blamed for.

 

Edited September 27 by DocWatts

[HMD]

On 25/09/2024 at 5:27 PM, lina said:

Nobody is denying the existence of Islamisim or Islamic extremism, but trying paint the Palestinian behavior entirely in this light, is not only irrelevant but is also nothing but a fundamental misunderstanding of the entire conflict. 

The early resistance was secular and they were also painted as terrorists.

This point doesn’t get talked about enough. One key player supporting and even driving Israels rampage is the US. We all know that there is a bias against everything Islam in the west, particularly after 911, and the US is still acting from that bias by supporting a nation that’s shaking up the whole Arab world. That’s like these best case scenario for them. 

[numbersinarow]

The problem is, when you bring the context of "Israel is based on genocide and ethnic cleansing and this is denied by it's supporters." but not the context of "Literally the entire Islamic world believes in a holy book which tells them they go to heaven if they kill infidels. Most of the civilians in Gaza support what Hamas did, in between freely choosing to salute Hitler. Leftists will go ahead and overlook this while harping on the most minor of moral failings on Israel's part."

When watching a video by someone like GoodEmpanada, ask yourself "Is he actually covering the response of the adults on the other side, or just talking about the only side that is required to accept the reality on the ground?"

Bonus: If someone claims a military age man who believes in a totalitarian holy book is harmless, that person is either nuts or a grifter.

[numbersinarow]

Just now, numbersinarow said:

Bonus: If someone claims a military age man who believes in a totalitarian holy book is harmless, that person is either nuts or a grifter.

"So you have to be insane to think a muslim adult in the west is harmless?"

That's outside of the context of war.

[Nivsch]

1 hour ago, numbersinarow said:

The problem is, when you bring the context of "Israel is based on genocide and ethnic cleansing and this is denied by it's supporters." but not the context of "Literally the entire Islamic world believes in a holy book which tells them they go to heaven if they kill infidels

+1 ❤

To display Israel's establishment as something only one side did to the other without relating to the entire bi-directional 30 years long triggering process both sides caused to each other, is like to put a jar of jam (new word I learn in english) in the microwave and blame only the jam in the exploding at the end.

Edited October 7 by Nivsch

[Nemra]

A documentary about Hamas by ARTE.

On their website: The Hamas System

On YouTube:

Use a VPN. Choose a European country to watch the video.

Edited October 20 by Nemra

[Raze]

On 10/7/2024 at 9:31 AM, numbersinarow said:

The problem is, when you bring the context of "Israel is based on genocide and ethnic cleansing and this is denied by it's supporters." but not the context of "Literally the entire Islamic world believes in a holy book which tells them they go to heaven if they kill infidels. Most of the civilians in Gaza support what Hamas did, in between freely choosing to salute Hitler. Leftists will go ahead and overlook this while harping on the most minor of moral failings on Israel's part."

When watching a video by someone like GoodEmpanada, ask yourself "Is he actually covering the response of the adults on the other side, or just talking about the only side that is required to accept the reality on the ground?"

Bonus: If someone claims a military age man who believes in a totalitarian holy book is harmless, that person is either nuts or a grifter.

Except Jews lived peacefully all over the Middle East including in Palestine prior to Zionism in Muslim countries for centuries. So the idea all Muslims just want to kill all non Muslims is laughably wrong as they didn’t do it that entire time, including when Muslim countries hosted Jews escaping the crusades and inquisition. Violence in Palestine towards Jews only began because revolutionary Jews started flooding in to colonize Palestine and were already committing violent acts such as Deir Yassin before any Arab army invaded.

The Quran doesn’t say to kill all infidels, in fact it lists Christian and Jews specifically as people of the book and a protected class.

Gazans supporting Oct 7 has nothing to do with Israelis being infidels and everything to do with them keeping 2 million people in a giant prison for decades. Somehow you think it’s reasonable for you to support violent ethnic cleansing of Palestinians who did nothing to you, but are shocked and offended if some Palestinians support violence towards Israel which expelled them from their homes, blockaded them inside Gaza, and launched periodic bombardments so vicious the majority of children have PTSD and lead poisoning and most don’t have access to clean water, all the while still refusing to free them.

The person who supports killing an entire population here is not Palestinians, it is you, who defends the genocide of Palestinians because they are Muslims. You are what you accuse them of being.

Edited October 20 by Raze

[Nemra]

I think one of the problems is that both sides of the people see each other as the intolerant versions of their culture.

At some point Palestine became islamic, but as I found out, it was tolerant towards non-Muslims. Israel isn't treating Palestinians humanely.

Although the Azerbaijani government, which is Islamic, is basically doing the same thing as Israel.

Turkey, being Islamic, did genocides and ethnic cleansing and still denies that they did it.

Both Turkey and Azerbaijan are islamizing the non-Islamic historical sites.

[Scholar]

2 hours ago, Nemra said:

I think one of the problems is that both sides of the people see each other as the intolerant versions of their culture.

At some point Palestine became islamic, but as I found out, it was tolerant towards non-Muslims. Israel isn't treating Palestinians humanely.

Although the Azerbaijani government, which is Islamic, is basically doing the same thing as Israel.

Turkey, being Islamic, did genocides and ethnic cleansing and still denies that they did it.

Both Turkey and Azerbaijan are islamizing the non-Islamic historical sites.

Although to be fair, it is not really save for jews to live anywhere in the middle east but in Israel. Arabs and Palestinians in Israel can live peaceful lifes, you have major TV shows humanizing palestinians and jews in Israel, and both can live along side each other, be coworkers, lovers, friends and so forth, for the most part.

[Nemra]

7 hours ago, Scholar said:

Although to be fair, it is not really save for jews to live anywhere in the middle east but in Israel.

I agree.

8 hours ago, Scholar said:

Arabs and Palestinians in Israel can live peaceful lives, you have major TV shows humanizing palestinians and jews in Israel, and both can live along side each other, be coworkers, lovers, friends and so forth, for the most part.

Well, that's not happening outside Israel.

Have you seen what the settlers and the military have been doing?

[Revolutionary Think]

I'm just going to put this here. 

 

[Nemra]

That Israeli guy is mad.

Also, Piers interrupted when Cenk was making his point.

Edited October 22 by Nemra

[Nivsch]

41 minutes ago, Nemra said:

That Israeli guy is mad.

Also, Piers interrupted when Cenk was making his point.

He isn't Israeli, he is the son of former Head of hamas. His stance is the most experienced, the richest.