Without consciousness there is no physical world?

[AION]

This is what quantum mechanics say and also what Leo Gura mechanics say. But the thing is if it is really true that nothing exist without consciousness how did the earth form into existence from the clouds and hot gasses into a globe? No consciousness was there to observe that shit. 

[Ishanga]

52 minutes ago, AION said:

This is what quantum mechanics say and also what Leo Gura mechanics say. But the thing is if it is really true that nothing exist without consciousness how did the earth form into existence from the clouds and hot gasses into a globe? No consciousness was there to observe that shit. 

There seems to be a couple of meanings for the word "Consciousness", most have it mean an Individuals level of Awareness of Reality and Truth, or their Level of Wakefulness. Another meaning is that Consciousness is the basis of our Existence, what was there before the supposed Big Bang, it means the same as Brahman or Shiva (That which is Not), a Grand Sort of Intelligence, not memory based or calculation based, but something that is foundational, and complex/sophisticated that it exists in the unmanifested and manifested and at every level, Gross level like trees, planets, Us, Subtle level like Atoms, Molecules, Cells and within things even more Subtle like Kundalini and Ojas!

Edited September 22 by Ishanga

[Malekakisioannis]

@AION there is not a physical world even with consciousness. Oh, and there is not such a thing as "without consciousness"...

[Hojo]

There is consciousness with no world. Its like your eyes are taped open and you are looking at pitch black and cant move but you can still think. But you don't know you are thinking because there is no identity so its just like a thing is there existing and you are experiencing whatever it is experiencing. There was consciousness to witness the beginning it just wasn't defined as anything so it wasn't happening to anyone or anything its just happening in consciousness.

Pretend when you close your eyes you arent looking inside your body but closing your eyes is cutting off information on what consciousness can see inside your body. You are outside and by blinking you are turning the lights off outside not inside. When you blink the entire bubble world in front of you (with the people and objects) goes black its not inside your body thats black. When you die you realize you are this space in front of you and you lose all sense of what the body was feeding into you but you are still there.

God is consciousness its always there and you will never die because you have consciousness that means you have God. Just the spaces you exist in will change and bodies you pretend to inhabit will change. Bodies have infinite variety of perception so your perceptions will change as well. You can inhabit a body where the feelings of your legs are over your head and you have 10 of them, your arms feel like machetes and your eyes see 16 circles instead of one big one and you are on a green planet moving around with 0 context of how you got there or what is happening or what to do beside your intuition. This would be exactly like a dream but this is what a human is too only we have ego.

Edited September 22 by Hojo

[El Zapato]

If we lack consciousness then we don't exist but the universe goes happily about its business.  The only thing worse than the individual ego is Anthropomorphism.

[Javfly33]

2 hours ago, AION said:

 how did the earth form into existence from the clouds and hot gasses into a globe? No consciousness was there to observe that shit. 

that shit was also consciousness, dummy,

 

pd. Sorry for the 'dummy' but I wanted to reply from a Leo Gura mechanics way 

Edited September 22 by Javfly33

[Davino]

3 hours ago, AION said:

But the thing is if it is really true that nothing exist without consciousness how did the earth form into existence from the clouds and hot gasses into a globe? No consciousness was there to observe that shit. 

where is the earth when you sleep?

what is the world when you dream?

Aren't you conscious of it all? right? 

The mistake is your cognition that you are becoming conscious of something 

No

You are expanding you consciousness, period

Consciousness, perceptions, awareness, sensations are shapeshifting moment to moment

Taking the form of your current experience, your images and conceptions about the world, the material world, your breathing, the feeling of I, everything is mediated by consciousness alone

Try sitting in a room

Quiet your mind by focusing in your breathing

Do some vipassana or your classic mediation technique

then ask yourself: What is Consciousness?

It's a non verbal pursuit after that

You focus your faculties to the Reality that Consciousness is everywhere, thoughts come Oh I'm conscious of that, my body oh I'm conscious of that, oh I'm conscious of everything, oh the "I" is happening inside consciousness

Oh consciousness is all there is

Oh what is consciousness?

keep abiding in consciousness, feeling consciousness inside out through out all of existence

If you get too distracted is because you have lost awareness of the breath, recenter yourself

Ask: What is Consciousness?

Abide in Consciousness

[Atb210201]

5 hours ago, AION said:

This is what quantum mechanics say and also what Leo Gura mechanics say. But the thing is if it is really true that nothing exist without consciousness how did the earth form into existence from the clouds and hot gasses into a globe? No consciousness was there to observe that shit. 

Consciousness was always there and will always be there, here, everywhere

Edited September 22 by Atb210201

[Davino]

Another sticky point is that you are operating within the materialistic paradigm. You assume you are a human which as an epiphenomena generates consciousness and then you can become conscious of things and maybe animals may or may not have consciousness and so on.

This whole paradigm is limited and mostly wrong.

You are not a human being which is conscious

You are consciousness which is aware of a human being, this screen, lights, sounds, space and so on

In other words, you are not a human being existing

But 

Existence being a human and everything else

With this right understanding Consciousness makes much more sense and so does the mystics outrageous claims

Edited September 22 by Davino

[Someone here]

What's consciousness? What's the world ?What's the earth ? What's anything? 

Keep rotating the wheel . Nobody knows anything. 

You might think that a question have a right answer and that there is a wrong answer. But can't you see that every answer will branch into more questions ? And then when it's gonna end ? Nowhere. Right back where you started.  

Try contemplating something from scratch without any presumptions .and notice that you can't.  If you bring  presumptions to the question then you're wrong because you have to justify them endlessly . And

If you don't Bring presumption to the question and inquire from scratch then you are also wrong because without presumptions you don't know jack shit. 

[Staples]

I don't see any reason why materialism and idealism can't both be true at the same time.

Idealism grasps that in order to perceive anything it can only occur within consciousness.

Materialism suggests things can exist independent of consciousness.

The fault is in assuming consciousness arises from matter, or that matter arises from consciousness. Assuming one must be the defining force of the other. But they could just be simultaneous interlinked phenomenon.

Matter = consciousness. Therefore, a rock is conscious.

Don't know for sure though, just a hunch. 

Edited September 23 by Staples

[Leo Gura]

13 hours ago, AION said:

But the thing is if it is really true that nothing exist without consciousness how did the earth form into existence from the clouds and hot gasses into a globe?

You are dreaming the Earth.

Stop assuming it has existence outside of your mind.

You are taking for granted that stuff exists.

"Physical" doesn't exist. It's a construction of your mind.

Edited September 23 by Leo Gura

[Princess Arabia]

3 hours ago, Someone here said:

. Nobody knows anything.

 

3 hours ago, Someone here said:

you don't know jack shit. 

Coming from someone who claims to know this. IOW, according to you, you don't know if nobody knows anything.

[Keryo Koffa]

5 hours ago, Princess Arabia said:

Coming from someone who claims to know this. IOW, according to you, you don't know if nobody knows anything.

Well the rule doesn't apply to himself of course since he's nothing , only selves can be wrong lol 😁

Edited September 23 by Keryo Koffa

[AION]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You are dreaming the Earth.

Stop assuming it has existence outside of your mind.

You are taking for granted that stuff exists.

"Physical" doesn't exist. It's a construction of your mind.

That is insane but we will never know I guess. Because you have to be out of your mind to see if there is anything outside of it. 
 

[Keryo Koffa]

4 minutes ago, AION said:

That is insane but we will never know I guess.
Because you have to be out of your mind to see if there is anything outside of it. 

You got it! We don't know what we don't know that we don't know about = Leo Exploring Alien Infinity

But everything that is or ever was inside your experience is mind-created, and you get to go beyond that interface

Edited September 23 by Keryo Koffa

[AION]

3 minutes ago, Keryo Koffa said:

You got it! We don't know what we don't know that we don't know about = Leo's Alien Infinity

But everything that is or ever was inside your experience is mind-created, and you get to go beyond that interface

This is what quantum mechanics say too. Without observation there is nothing.  So I don’t get what is so revolutionary about Leo Gura mechanics. His only addition is the solipsism argument on top of quantum mechanics if I understand it correctly. 

Edited September 23 by AION

[Leo Gura]

6 minutes ago, AION said:

but we will never know I guess.

Or you could Awaken and know.

[Keryo Koffa]

12 minutes ago, AION said:

This is what quantum mechanics say too. Without observation there is nothing.  So I don’t get what is so revolutionary about Leo Gura mechanics. His only addition is the solipsism argument on top of quantum mechanics if I understand it correctly. 

Quantum Mechanics is a Theory and Leo Gura is its Proof 😜

Also, has QM ever defined what an Observer is?

[AION]

5 minutes ago, Keryo Koffa said:

Quantum Mechanics is a Theory and Leo Gura is its Proof 😜

Also, has QM ever defined what an Observer is?

Probably they have. 
 

It recognizes that consciousness is an integral part of the fabric of reality as far as I understand it.