Latest Ukraine/Russia Thread

[Husseinisdoingfine]

Some really bad news for Ukraine, it looks certain that Trump is abandoning it. 

 

[Elliott]

1 hour ago, Hatfort said:

Russia can continue with the war, its economy is doing well. Ukraine is the one that can't hold it for much longer, that's why they're losing more land at a faster pace, and it will only get worse. But it's in Russia's interest to end the war at some point too, in the terms they've won on the battlefield, stop their own men from dying too, and give a try to a peace economy. 

If NATO and Zelensky don't accept, or set terms that are not acceptable from the standpoint of a country that took big risks and made big sacrifices to win, Russia will be more than ready to continue.

You just keep repeating the same things that you've already been proven wrong about. War in Afghanistan ended the Soviet Union, Ukraine is putting up a much better fight and Russia is taking massive losses both militarily and economically. Europe was Russia's largest customer, a market that Russia is incapable of replacing, and they support Ukraine with an endless supply of sophisticated weapons.

 

Edited Friday at 11:27 PM by Elliott

[PurpleTree]

Trump admin asked Ukraine for 50% of its minerals 

[Hatfort]

8 hours ago, Elliott said:

You just keep repeating the same things that you've already been proven wrong about. War in Afghanistan ended the Soviet Union, Ukraine is putting up a much better fight and Russia is taking massive losses both militarily and economically. Europe was Russia's largest customer, a market that Russia is incapable of replacing, and they support Ukraine with an endless supply of sophisticated weapons.

No, I've not been proven wrong at all, the facts from the battlefield are what they are. The trend has been clear since the disastrous counteroffensive of Ukraine, Russia has kept gaining more land and faster, and it will only get worse. There's nothing Ukraine can do, nobody is interested in a nuclear escalation of worldwide catastrophic consequences, only lunatics incapable of a second thought.

Then we have the strategic failure of the Kursk offensive, since you don't like me to repeat myself, let's analyze something different. They can't even defend the four oblasts in their territory, and they open a new front that will need to feed equipment. They advanced some miles in an undefended land with well-trained men and good equipment, but Russia showed the capability to counter it in the following weeks. Then Ukraine had one more front to feed, as said, and what could be interpreted as a morale boost for their side at first, I would argue that the men losing and dying in the fronts of Zaporizhia or Donetsk, of course, they must have thought, why didn't they send those troops here to help us? Not that it would have made a difference in the long run, but they would have held a bit longer in those areas. Russia is not going to exchange anything, is going to win the war. The only thing they would exchange is the posibility of them continuing to advance, and anyone with a brain would accept that at this point.

Russia rapidly changed its trade partners to the East, the sanctions have damaged Europe more than they have Russia. Europe is a nice market for producers, but China, India, Brazil, and Indonesia are huge, and they are Russia's partners in BRICS, among other smaller ones. I would even say these hard sanctions helped Russia to rethink its economy, nationalize some industries that were in Western hands, or Russian ones but with outside banks, which was an improvement for them. Its economy is healthy and can continue the war, now they'll have to adapt for peace, they have some work in reconstruction, for example. Although I'm sure they'll keep their military power somewhat latent, which is normal in the world we are living.

[Elliott]

32 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

No, I've not been proven wrong at all, the facts from the battlefield are what they are. The trend has been clear since the disastrous counteroffensive of Ukraine, Russia has kept gaining more land and faster, and it will only get worse. There's nothing Ukraine can do, nobody is interested in a nuclear escalation of worldwide catastrophic consequences, only lunatics incapable of a second thought.

Then we have the strategic failure of the Kursk offensive, since you don't like me to repeat myself, let's analyze something different. They can't even defend the four oblasts in their territory, and they open a new front that will need to feed equipment. They advanced some miles in an undefended land with well-trained men and good equipment, but Russia showed the capability to counter it in the following weeks. Then Ukraine had one more front to feed, as said, and what could be interpreted as a morale boost for their side at first, I would argue that the men losing and dying in the fronts of Zaporizhia or Donetsk, of course, they must have thought, why didn't they send those troops here to help us? Not that it would have made a difference in the long run, but they would have held a bit longer in those areas. Russia is not going to exchange anything, is going to win the war. The only thing they would exchange is the posibility of them continuing to advance, and anyone with a brain would accept that at this point.

Russia rapidly changed its trade partners to the East, the sanctions have damaged Europe more than they have Russia. Europe is a nice market for producers, but China, India, Brazil, and Indonesia are huge, and they are Russia's partners in BRICS, among other smaller ones. I would even say these hard sanctions helped Russia to rethink its economy, nationalize some industries that were in Western hands, or Russian ones but with outside banks, which was an improvement for them. Its economy is healthy and can continue the war, now they'll have to adapt for peace, they have some work in reconstruction, for example. Although I'm sure they'll keep their military power somewhat latent, which is normal in the world we are living.

Why do you act like you care so much about Ukraine's wellbeing, then you want them to capitulate while they are wanting to fight? Why do you care so much about getting Ukraine to let Russia takeover their country?

Ukraine is using war of attrition tactics, this allows the enemy to advance slowly, but while also bleeding out. It would take Russia 50 years to get to Kyiv at their rate, 2024 Russia only gained 1% of Ukraine, meanwhile Europe is training a new Ukrainian army while Russia is growing more reliant on pitch fork farmers for fighting. 

 

 

BulgarianMilitary.com

https://bulgarianmilitary.com › war-tanks-running-out...

War tanks running out? Russia faces alarming shortage by 2025

Dec 10, 2024 · Compounding this issue is the visible degradation of Russia’s manufacturing capabilities. Recent models of the T-90M, one

 

What, you think the u.s. is somehow forcing Ukraine to fight, Biden announced before the war began that Russia would overthrow Kyiv in 3 days. Why doesn't Ukraine stop fighting if that's what they want. I think you're comically brainwashed.

Edited Saturday at 08:50 AM by Elliott

[Hatfort]

2 minutes ago, Elliott said:

Why do you act like you care so much about Ukraine's wellbeing, then you want them to capitulate while they are wanting to fight? Why do you care so much about getting Ukraine to let Russia takeover their country?

Ukraine is using war of attrition tactics, this allows the enemy to advance slowly, but while also bleeding out. It would take Russia 50 years to get to Kyiv at their rate.

No, that's wrong, some are aware that they are fighting a lost cause that started not for their interest, but the strategic interests of NATO. Those who are not aware yet, they don't deserve to die either. This war is not a race, but Russia's acceleration rate is very good, they take more land faster as time goes. It's pretty clear Russia doesn't want the whole Ukraine, but does at least the Donbas, Crimea, and the two Eastern oblasts that connect them. But if the other side is unwilling to negotiate, they will keep getting more, until they do. Ukraine is not economically capable of maintaining this, and at some point, their donors, who are not helping in good faith, will stop, because they have problems on their own too. Not to speak about the required manpower, they don't have enough men, and they are not willing to die for a lost cause, as it's normal. They wanted to lower the fighting age to 18, they are struggling big.

Ukraine is losing, confronting a much bigger nation was suicidal. You could argue that before the war started anything Putin said was a bluff, but it obviously was not. All other expectations of Russia's economy failing and military capabilities being insufficient have been proven wishful thinking by the West that didn't come to reality, as much as they tried to manufacture the reality with their propaganda machinery, it didn't work. 

[Elliott]

9 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

No, that's wrong, some are aware that they are fighting a lost cause that started not for their interest, but the strategic interests of NATO. Those who are not aware yet, they don't deserve to die either. This war is not a race, but Russia's acceleration rate is very good, they take more land faster as time goes. It's pretty clear Russia doesn't want the whole Ukraine, but does at least the Donbas, Crimea, and the two Eastern oblasts that connect them. But if the other side is unwilling to negotiate, they will keep getting more, until they do. Ukraine is not economically capable of maintaining this, and at some point, their donors, who are not helping in good faith, will stop, because they have problems on their own too. Not to speak about the required manpower, they don't have enough men, and they are not willing to die for a lost cause, as it's normal. They wanted to lower the fighting age to 18, they are struggling big.

Ukraine is losing, confronting a much bigger nation was suicidal. You could argue that before the war started anything Putin said was a bluff, but it obviously was not. All other expectations of Russia's economy failing and military capabilities being insufficient have been proven wishful thinking by the West that didn't come to reality, as much as they tried to manufacture the reality with their propaganda machinery, it didn't work. 

Russia only took less than 1% of Ukraine last year, that's barely anything and in a rural area, it's weird you're making it seem so alarming.

 

Why do you act like you care so much about Ukraine's wellbeing, then you want them to capitulate while they are wanting to fight? Why do you care so much about getting Ukraine to let Russia takeover their country?

 

 

 

Edited Saturday at 09:02 AM by Elliott

[Hatfort]

2 minutes ago, Elliott said:

Russia only took less than 1% of Ukraine last year, that's barely anything and in a rural area, it's weird you're making it seem so alarming.

 

Why do you act like you care so much about Ukraine's wellbeing, then you want them to capitulate while they are wanting to fight? Why do you care so much about getting Ukraine to let Russia takeover their country?

Russia is winning the attrition war, Ukraine capability to defend get's worse and worse, that's the metric that matters. Russia outnumbers Ukraine's manpower by so far, and its economic viability is good. Yeah, those matter too.

This is not about me, it's about people dying for nothing. There is no way on this Earth Ukraine can win this war against Russia, the best they can do is negotiate based on reality, as all their before-the-war predictions, and first year of war ones, have failed to be as they expected. If it continues it will be worse. Trump would continue helping Ukraine if that led to their victory and Russia collapsing and getting weaker in the world, he was totally involved in the de facto NATO militarization of the East of Ukraine in his first term pointing to Moscow. The potato exploded in Biden's hands, who was in the same page anyway or more.

The West and Ukraine have two options, face the awful facts now, or face the even worse facts later. They made their bet, they lost, and as conservatives like to say, although they don't apply it for themselves, actions have consequences.

[Elliott]

3 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

Russia is winning the attrition war, Ukraine capability to defend get's worse and worse, that's the metric that matters. Russia outnumbers Ukraine's manpower by so far, and its economic viability is good. Yeah, those matter too.

This is not about me, it's about people dying for nothing. There is no way on this Earth Ukraine can win this war against Russia, the best they can do is negotiate based on reality, as all their before-the-war predictions, and first year of war ones, have failed to be as they expected. If it continues it will be worse. Trump would continue helping Ukraine if that led to their victory and Russia collapsing and getting weaker in the world, he was totally involved in the de facto NATO militarization of the East of Ukraine in his first term pointing to Moscow. The potato exploded in Biden's hands, who was in the same page anyway or more.

The West and Ukraine have two options, face the awful facts now, or face the even worse facts later. They made their bet, they lost, and as conservatives like to say, although they don't apply it for themselves, actions have consequences.

1% last year. That's not winning.

 

 

[Hatfort]

2 minutes ago, Elliott said:

1% last year. That's not winning.

Russia has taken about 20% of what was Eatern Ukraine and have shown the capability to maintain it, counter any attack in other fronts, and keep advancing non-stop and faster. This 20% is not going back to Ukraine ever, and if the other side is not willing to sit and negotiate based on reality, it will continue the war and grab more land. So yes, Russia is winning big.

[Elliott]

10 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

Russia has taken about 20% of what was Eatern Ukraine and have shown the capability to maintain it, counter any attack in other fronts, and keep advancing non-stop and faster. This 20% is not going back to Ukraine ever, and if the other side is not willing to sit and negotiate based on reality, it will continue the war and grab more land. So yes, Russia is winning big.

Last year Russia only took less than 1% of Ukraine. The bulk of Russias position is from the beginning of the invasion.

Russia thought they would take all of Ukraine in 3 days, it's going on 4 years, they gained 1% last year.

Why do you think you should tell Ukraine what to do? Russia has lost more people.

 

 

 

Edited Saturday at 09:42 AM by Elliott

[Hatfort]

Just now, Elliott said:

Last year Russia only took less than 1% of Ukraine. The bulk of Russias position is from the beginning of the invasion.

Russia thought they would take all of Ukraine in 3 days, it's going on 4 years, they've not even taken a major city.

Russia comfortably holds 20% of what was Ukraine and has the capability to keep advancing. Ukrainians don't want to die for what's clearly a lost cause, they are deserting and escaping in huge numbers. The more time passes, the more unsustainable the situation is. The West has been predicting the collapse of the Russian regime since the beginning, and some fools continue to do so, but it's not happening. Russia won, it can be admitted now, or it can be admitted later in much worse terms.

[Elliott]

29 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

Russia comfortably holds 20% of what was Ukraine and has the capability to keep advancing. Ukrainians don't want to die for what's clearly a lost cause, they are deserting and escaping in huge numbers. The more time passes, the more unsustainable the situation is. The West has been predicting the collapse of the Russian regime since the beginning, and some fools continue to do so, but it's not happening. Russia won, it can be admitted now, or it can be admitted later in much worse terms.

You just keep lying and I don't understand why. Why are you trying to speak for Ukrainians and make their decisions? Russia has had more Russians killed, where is your concern for them?

 

https://news.gallup.com › poll › ukrainians-stand-behind-war...

"Ukrainians Stand Behind War Effort Despite Some Fatigue - Gallup.com

Oct 9, 2023 · President Volodymyr Zelenskyy is a key figure in national support for the war. His personal approval ratings remain sky-high in 2023 (81%). Ukrainians who

The People Stand Behind Their Military: Ukrainians’ faith in their troops remains unshakeable, with 95% having confidence in the military in 2023, in line with the"

 

 

 

Edited Saturday at 10:15 AM by Elliott

[Hatfort]

18 minutes ago, Elliott said:

You just keep lying and I don't understand why. Why are you trying to speak for Ukrainians and make their decisions?

https://news.gallup.com › poll › ukrainians-stand-behind-war...

Ukrainians Stand Behind War Effort Despite Some Fatigue - Gallup.com

Oct 9, 2023 · President Volodymyr Zelenskyy is a key figure in national support for the war. His personal approval ratings remain sky-high in 2023 (81%). Ukrainians who

The People Stand Behind Their Military: Ukrainians’ faith in their troops remains unshakeable, with 95% having confidence in the military in 2023, in line with the

No, I'm not lying, I'm analyzing the hard facts, and the reality of the situation. The Ukrainian government is making the decisions, not the people, whose term ended last year, and it was elected with the promise of maintaining the peace accords of Minsk, that's what they should have done. They didn't and Russia invaded, which at first created an understandable reaction from Ukraine and its people. But as time has passed, and the factual reality of the war is what is it, not favorable for Ukraine. 

They are tired of trading funerals for an Eastern land that they know they will never be able to recover, which was quite Russian friendly since always anyway. The West had the strategic objective of weakening Russia, that's what this has been about, and the US military industry has made a ton of money and got rid of the obsolete weaponry and equipment, which is good to renew from time to time. The way Ukrainians have been used is extremely shameful, and common people there don't have any way out, any dissidence with this nonsensical war is persecuted.

Edited Saturday at 10:19 AM by Hatfort

[Elliott]

9 minutes ago, Hatfort said:

No, I'm not lying, I'm analyzing the hard facts, and the reality of the situation. The Ukrainian government is making the decisions, not the people, whose term ended last year, and it was elected with the promise of maintaining the peace accords of Minsk, that's what they should have done. They didn't and Russia invaded, which at first created an understandable reaction from Ukraine and its people. But as time has passed, and the factual reality of the war is what is it, not favorable for Ukraine. 

They are tired of trading funerals for an Eastern land that they know they will never be able to recover, which was quite Russian friendly since always anyway. The West had the strategic objective of weakening Russia, that's what this has been about, and the US military industry has made a ton of money and got rid of the obsolete weaponry and equipment, which is good to renew from time to time. The way Ukrainians have been used is extremely shameful, and common people there don't have any way out, any dissidence with this nonsensical war is persecuted.

Ukrainians support the war, that's why they're fighting on the front lines instead of surrendering like Russians.

 

Why do you have no concerns for Russian lives, why shouldn't Russia leave Ukraine, they're having more Russians killed than Ukrainians are dying. Why do you value Ukrainians more than Russians.

[Hatfort]

1 minute ago, Elliott said:

Ukrainians support the war, that's why they're fighting on the front lines instead of surrendering like Russians.

 

Why do you have no concerns for Russian lives, why shouldn't Russia leave Ukraine, they're having more Russians killed than Ukrainians are dying. Why do you value Ukrainians more than Russians.

They don't have any other chance than dying for nothing, many of them are scaping, deserting, or surrendering. Their government is deciding for them in an expired term, and what they are seeing is that they are having funerals of their youth regularly in exchange for an Eastern land that they know is out of reach forever. This is ridiculous and cruel.

Russians are dying too, but they know they are winning the war, and they are much more motivated to fight, not only or that, but with much better incentives. They know they outnumber the Ukrainians and that they will win, but yes, they want this to end too, nobody likes to put his life on the line.

[Elliott]

5 hours ago, Hatfort said:

They don't have any other chance than dying for nothing, many of them are scaping, deserting, or surrendering. Their government is deciding for them in an expired term, and what they are seeing is that they are having funerals of their youth regularly in exchange for an Eastern land that they know is out of reach forever. This is ridiculous and cruel.

Russians are dying too, but they know they are winning the war, and they are much more motivated to fight, not only or that, but with much better incentives. They know they outnumber the Ukrainians and that they will win, but yes, they want this to end too, nobody likes to put his life on the line.

It's going on 4 years, that only gained 1% last year, and had their heaviest losses, experts predict Russia can only sustain 2 years more at most, that's 2% more.

Russia isn't winning the war, 1% last year, a year you claim to be their strongest, where they lost the most men and equipment, is not winning by any serious standard. Ukraine has military allies that makeup an equipment supply that dwarfs Russia.

You're subscribing to a 19th century view on warfare. Sanctions are 21st century warfare, they alone have crumbled iran, this is why Ukraine is not acting more offensive. This is how warfare goes and Ukraine is winning, it's not men lining up to shoot at each other that determines wars anymore, we're way past bombs even.
 

 

Edited Saturday at 03:55 PM by Elliott

[PurpleTree]

I just hope Ukraine gets under a nuclear umbrella or its own nukes soon.

[Hatfort]

2 hours ago, Elliott said:

It's going on 4 years, that only gained 1% last year, and had their heaviest losses, experts predict Russia can only sustain 2 years more at most, that's 2% more.

Russia isn't winning the war, 1% last year, a year you claim to be their strongest, where they lost the most men and equipment, is not winning by any serious standard. Ukraine has military allies that makeup an equipment supply that dwarfs Russia.

You're subscribing to a 19th century view on warfare. Sanctions are 21st century warfare, they alone have crumbled iran, this is why Ukraine is not acting more offensive. This is how warfare goes and Ukraine is winning, it's not men lining up to shoot at each other that determines wars anymore, we're way past bombs even.

First of all, counting since February 2022, it's 3 years. You don't even realize how much you mold the reality to fit your wishes. It's as ridiculous as your predictions of the collapse of the Russian regime or the false casualty numbers the Western propaganda machine has been sprouting since day one, like that would win them the war, instead of efficiency on the battlefield.

Russia has the main objective of kicking the intentions of NATO about Ukraine away, not taking the whole of Ukraine, but the amount of land it will grab will depend on how far they make them go. The trend is very favorable for them, they are winning, and can continue doing so, that's why they won't settle for any less than the four territories they've already almost taken. But if the West and their puppet want to continue, it will be more. Ukraine is never getting back what they've lost.

Edited Saturday at 05:40 PM by Hatfort

[Rafael Thundercat]

This video is nice, not only for the content but in the end. He is aware of how the comments affect his channel